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Posted on 12/7/18 at 9:42 pm to Taurus 357
For most of its history it was a player in college football on the national stage. Now even tho it adds teams it falls farther behind. The problem with not being the leader is the glow cast can linger longer so the perception is different than the reality when it finally hits.
In the BCS and CFP era only 1 of 14 teams has made a mark, and that was twice in 20 years or once a decade on average.
1998 SEC Tennessee
1999 ACC Florida State (only 9 teams)
2000 B12 Oklahoma
2001 BigE Miami (now in ACC)
2002 B1G Ohio State
2003 SEC LSU
2003 PAC Southern Cal
2004 PAC Southern Cal (vacated)
2005 B12 Texas
2006 SEC Florida
2007 SEC LSU
XXXX 10 years XXXX
2008 SEC Florida
2009 SEC Alabama
2010 SEC Auburn
2011 SEC Alabama
2013 ACC Florida State
2014 B1G Ohio State
2015 SEC Alabama
2016 ACC Clemson
2017 SEC Alabama
XXXX 20 years XXXX
MNC's by current affiliation
SEC accounts for roughly half from roughly half the conference
ACC accounts for 4 from 3 schools
B12 accounts for 2 from 2 schools
B1G accounts for 2 from 1 school
PAC accounts for 1 from 1 school
Tell me again how the B1G is relevant in the past 20 years?
In the BCS and CFP era only 1 of 14 teams has made a mark, and that was twice in 20 years or once a decade on average.
1998 SEC Tennessee
1999 ACC Florida State (only 9 teams)
2000 B12 Oklahoma
2001 BigE Miami (now in ACC)
2002 B1G Ohio State
2003 SEC LSU
2003 PAC Southern Cal
2004 PAC Southern Cal (vacated)
2005 B12 Texas
2006 SEC Florida
2007 SEC LSU
XXXX 10 years XXXX
2008 SEC Florida
2009 SEC Alabama
2010 SEC Auburn
2011 SEC Alabama
2013 ACC Florida State
2014 B1G Ohio State
2015 SEC Alabama
2016 ACC Clemson
2017 SEC Alabama
XXXX 20 years XXXX
MNC's by current affiliation
SEC accounts for roughly half from roughly half the conference
ACC accounts for 4 from 3 schools
B12 accounts for 2 from 2 schools
B1G accounts for 2 from 1 school
PAC accounts for 1 from 1 school
Tell me again how the B1G is relevant in the past 20 years?
Posted on 12/7/18 at 10:05 pm to Cheese Grits
Tell me again how the B1G is relevant in the past 20 years?
That’s the funny thing about conferences. They are laughing at you, for laughing at them. They are rich. It’s not about who wins and loses. That’s for the fans. The peons like all of us. Those guys in the ivory tower at the B1G and the SEC? They are playing with many stacks of high society
That’s the funny thing about conferences. They are laughing at you, for laughing at them. They are rich. It’s not about who wins and loses. That’s for the fans. The peons like all of us. Those guys in the ivory tower at the B1G and the SEC? They are playing with many stacks of high society
Posted on 12/7/18 at 10:09 pm to Cheese Grits
quote:
Cheese Grits
It’s shocking, shocking I say that the two conferences that only play 8 conference games and schedule 1 more patsy each have more bowl teams. Next you’ll tell us the earth is round.
Posted on 12/7/18 at 10:14 pm to Taurus 357
quote:
That’s the funny thing about conferences. They are laughing at you, for laughing at them. They are rich. It’s not about who wins and loses. That’s for the fans. The peons like all of us. Those guys in the ivory tower at the B1G and the SEC? They are playing with many stacks of high society
And the TV money the B1G gets is peanuts compared to research grants and endowments. That’s where the money is and that’s where the SEC (minus A&M) is left in the dust.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 12:34 am to rpr4695
quote:
I think adding OU and UT to the SEC would be great.
If you guys want to see an all time melt, just add Texas to the conference and head over to TexAgs. It might even warrant taking a day off work, that place would burn to the ground.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 2:44 am to Who is Your Daddy
Texas doesn't belong in a real conference. They are all about being the boss of Baylor, Tech, Okie State, little brothers with no other options. The only reason OU and KU don't leave is because they're stuck with KSU and OSU.
OU, Texas (and KU) aren't going anywhere because no conference wants their little brothers.
OU, Texas (and KU) aren't going anywhere because no conference wants their little brothers.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 4:48 am to Acc fan
Doubt it happens. If OU knows what’s good for them they’ll do what’s best for them and not worry about sticking together with UT. OU would be a good fit in the big10 but the big 10 would likely have to also bring OK State or Kansas with OU.
Kansas would be a good expansion too. Their basketball program brings a lot to the table.
Kansas would be a good expansion too. Their basketball program brings a lot to the table.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 5:54 am to VABuckeye
Nice try
ACC and SEC play all kinds of annual or almost annual P5 games between conferences
B12 only has Iowa State vs Iowa
B1G only has Iowa vs Iowa State
PAC has none
ACC is not the strongest conference top to bottom but at least Clemson beefs up their schedule with South Carolina (116 games) every year and on average, Georgia (64 games) or Auburn (51 games) every year.
Buckeyes played P5 Oregon State who went 2-10, TCU who went 6-6, and G5 Tulane who went 6-6. At least TCU has been good in the past but the other two were scheduled to be easy wins. You can make a schedule look tougher than it is by scheduling a name people know but are not good.
Funny that for all these weak games you say the SEC plays, Sagarin has the SEC - West as the #1 conference and the SEC - East as the #2 conference. Adding another conference game in a conference loaded with fluff just means you play another Kansas type school not another Oklahoma type school as you folks always imply. I mean you can move the goalposts all day but which is the tougher scheduler?
Team A : schedules 1 Top 25 but no FCS
VS
Team B : schedules 3 Top 10 and 1 FCS
It is round as if it were flat, cats would have knocked everything off the edge already.
ACC and SEC play all kinds of annual or almost annual P5 games between conferences
B12 only has Iowa State vs Iowa
B1G only has Iowa vs Iowa State
PAC has none
ACC is not the strongest conference top to bottom but at least Clemson beefs up their schedule with South Carolina (116 games) every year and on average, Georgia (64 games) or Auburn (51 games) every year.
Buckeyes played P5 Oregon State who went 2-10, TCU who went 6-6, and G5 Tulane who went 6-6. At least TCU has been good in the past but the other two were scheduled to be easy wins. You can make a schedule look tougher than it is by scheduling a name people know but are not good.
Funny that for all these weak games you say the SEC plays, Sagarin has the SEC - West as the #1 conference and the SEC - East as the #2 conference. Adding another conference game in a conference loaded with fluff just means you play another Kansas type school not another Oklahoma type school as you folks always imply. I mean you can move the goalposts all day but which is the tougher scheduler?
Team A : schedules 1 Top 25 but no FCS
VS
Team B : schedules 3 Top 10 and 1 FCS
quote:
Next you’ll tell us the earth is round.
It is round as if it were flat, cats would have knocked everything off the edge already.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 7:47 am to Cheese Grits
Until someone explains how texas is getting rid of tech, Baylor, and TCU, this is just goobers discussing fiction. Same for OU and Okie State.
Don’t think for a minute A&M is going to let texas join the SEC. We’ve been saving jars and jars for this battle.
Don’t think for a minute A&M is going to let texas join the SEC. We’ve been saving jars and jars for this battle.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 8:01 am to Cheese Grits
Oregon State was solid when they were scheduled. You failed to mention that Ohio State has played Texas x 2, Oklahoma x 2, USC x 2, Miami x2 recently and has home and homes upcoming against Texas, Notre Dame, Oregon and Washington.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 9:02 am to OKTGR580
quote:
. If OU knows what’s good for them they’ll do what’s best for them and not worry about sticking together with UT. OU would be a good fit in the big10 but the big 10 would likely have to also bring OK State or Kansas with OU.
The Pac12 rejected the OU OSU pair a few years ago. That combo just isn't attractive to conferences because they don't offer big enough markets to raise media payouts. Kansas schools as pair are even less attractive.
OU and Kansas are doomed to be under Texas for eternity to protect their little brothers.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 9:17 am to VABuckeye
quote:
It’s shocking, shocking I say that the two conferences that only play 8 conference games and schedule 1 more patsy each have more bowl teams. Next you’ll tell us the earth is round.
The sec doesn’t need to apologize to anyone for their scheduling.
Sagarin rates the conferences as follows:
CONFERENCE CENTRAL MEAN SIMPLE AVERAGE TEAMS WIN50%
1 SEC-WEST (A) = 82.20 81.96 ( 1) 7 82.05 ( 1)
2 SEC-EAST (A) = 80.34 80.53 ( 2) 7 80.44 ( 2)
3 BIG TEN-EAST (A) = 79.18 78.40 ( 3) 7 79.03 ( 3)
4 PAC-12(NORTH) (A) = 78.09 76.80 ( 5) 6 77.68 ( 4)
5 BIG 12 (A) = 76.93 77.16 ( 4) 10 77.09 ( 5)
6 ACC-ATLANTIC (A) = 76.03 76.58 ( 6) 7 75.96 ( 6)
7 BIG TEN-WEST (A) = 75.65 74.96 ( 7) 7 75.31 ( 7)
8 PAC-12(SOUTH) (A) = 73.59 74.25 ( 8) 6 74.10 ( 8)
9 ACC-COASTAL (A) = 73.24 73.25 ( 9) 7 73.27 ( 9)
The SECW, in particular, has been #1 every year since 2012. Most years in that span it wasn’t even close.
LINK
This post was edited on 12/8/18 at 9:27 am
Posted on 12/8/18 at 9:46 am to Acc fan
quote:
That could be the case, according to one report by Minnesota insider Greg Flugaur, who obtained information from a B1G source named BTM.
Oh, well, that makes it so. BTM has decreed it, so be it.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 10:18 am to VABuckeye
quote:
And the TV money the B1G gets is peanuts compared to research grants and endowments. That’s where the money is and that’s where the SEC (minus A&M) is left in the dust.
Not disagreeing, but deduct about 4 non competitive B1G schools in sports and that drops significantly. Even in the past few years word has leaked that the real research schools in the B1G were not going to honor CIC points as some in the B1G were now not up to snuff. Even still, the CA PAC schools and the Ivy's are above the B1G so it is not like you are the leader, just ahead of the ACC, SEC, and B12 of the P5's. get of the cross man because others need the nails. Especially as the southern and western schools are growing their endowments by leaps and bounds. While you say only TAMU is the exception you omit Florida, Vanderbilt, and Missouri (who are all AAU) and Georgia (who has better numbers than some in the B1G, but is not AAU). Also, you forget Tulane was AAU while in the SEC and former SEC member Georgia Tech is also AAU.
Look I grew up when IU and OSU were the party schools of the B1G and that continued into the 80's and probably early 90's so don't act like it is OSU propping up the academics of the B1G. That would be like saying the AL and MS were propping up the academics of the SEC.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 10:26 am to Cheese Grits
They can join the B1G if the Horns get rid of their network, which will never happen. Texas likes being in charge.
In other words, it’s just a fairy tale, and OU is stuck with their Horn masters.
In other words, it’s just a fairy tale, and OU is stuck with their Horn masters.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 10:56 am to VABuckeye
quote:
Oregon State was solid when they were scheduled.
Really, when was that? Not sure how old you are but Prothro died in 1995 and last coached the Beavers in what 65' or 66'?
Are you serious?
quote:
Texas x 2, Oklahoma x 2, USC x 2, Miami x2
2017 12-2 Oklahoma = legit
2016 11-2 Oklahoma = legit
2015
2014
2013
2012 4-8 Miami OF OHIO! : lol :
2011 6-6 Miami of Florida = not legit
2010 7-6 Miami of Florida = not legit (Ohio State had to vacate the win too)
2009 9-4 Southern California = legit (won at home by a FG)
2008 12-1 Southern California = legit (Ohio State lost 03 - 35)
2007
2006 10-3 Texas = legit (you won)
2005 13-0 Texas = legit (you lost)
quote:
home and homes upcoming against Texas, Notre Dame, Oregon and Washington.
Texas = not the Texas of old
Notre Dame = Not sure if they are real right now, Clemson will let us know
Oregon = Not the Ducks of a decade ago
Washington = Good but not great right now
Interesting you talk about HOME and HOME games yet I am trying to remember the last time Ohio State played home and home against an SEC team, much less one who was ranked in the Top 25. Care to enlighten me?
Posted on 12/8/18 at 11:04 am to ColoradoAg
quote:
They can join the B1G if the Horns get rid of their network
Even if they did, not sure you get a supermajority of the B1G vote.
While Utx has assets they have offsetting liabilities.
quote:
Texas likes being in charge.
Herein lies the rub.
In the B1G or SEC they will not be in charge. Penn State found this out and Nebraska is finally waking up to the deal they made. I have to believe Texas already knows this which is why they say they don't want the SEC (claim academics) when the SEC now has better academics (as a conference) than the current B12 does.
I could see them trying for the ACC as Texas + Notre Dame gets them to 16 and the ACC has been open to allowing unequal treatment to survive. I think the PAC is too late. When this was proposed, Southern Cal had unequal power and weight, so Texas could feel comfortable with the same. That flipped when USC got busted and they added 2 schools who could care less about USC's history. More importantly, the PAC has some academic snobbery going on and Utx is "new money" to them.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 12:27 pm to Cheese Grits
I know from a media rights perspective a NC school (probably NC State) and a Virginia school (probably Va Tech) would give larger TV markets to the SEC if they were to pursue those, but it would also open the ACC up to the B1G for raiding. The SEC does not want the B1G getting anywhere out of their footprint into the southeast including Texas. Best chess move in this checkers match is the SEC to take OU and KU and add the rest of Kansas and Missouri market, add Oklahoma market plus add more of the TX market with OU. This adds another national brand college football team and another national brand basketball team to SEC and essentially ends the Big 12. In addition, SEC gets its preferred members before other conferences start the re-alignment talk. Ask OU after the last conference realignment if they want to be tied to a conference that is run by Texas.
The PAC/B1G would have to deal with Texas (and the LHN). PAC would be crazy not to pursue the rest of the Big 12 teams. If the PAC doesn’t go after 4 from Big 12 it will be completely irrelevant in the next media rights negotiation. PAC would get UT, OSU, TT and Baylor?. In addition, the PAC would probably sell their soul to make sure Texas came, much more so than the B1G would be willing. Texas has way more leverage over PAC than B1G. The ACC gets ND and WVU, B1G gets stuck with ISU and KSU? ND would have to give up independence or be left out of the new playoff system that would be negotiated. If that was the choice, ND wouldn’t want to be second fiddle to OSU and would pick the ACC. Biggest problem for SEC is getting OU and OSU go to different conferences, a lot of contention there. But new scheduling mandate may resolve. Ask Texas if they would rather be in PAC conference or B1G. PAC would be much easier to win, plus they would be able to throw their weight around in the PAC not so much in the SEC or B1G. Same question with ND ask if they would rather be in ACC or B1G and they would say ACC…Easier to win championships in ACC and PAC than B1G plus they are top dog in the conference.
This would start the power 4 16 team conferences (64 teams) and potential for division re-alignment. The goal of a conference re-alignment is to try and get better Divisions across all conferences for a better TV contract (or streaming contract). In addition, its goal should foster more P4 vs P4 games for a better product for both the fans and the owner of the contract. Instead of divisions use four 4 team pods in each conference instead of two 8 team divisions. In order to accomplish that you want two traditional powers per pod, and two traditional second tier teams per pod. For the newer power 4 conferences to work they would also require a scheduling mandate. All power 4 conferences require 9 league games and minimum of two additional Power 4 program each year so teams like UF, UGA, SC, UK, traditional ACC matchups don’t put those teams at a disadvantage. This means 11 power 4 games per year and one game (either FCS or group of 5 for home games) as a choice for the school. Still gives teams the chance to take on traditional rivals (OU could still schedule OSU and UTx for instance, UTx might even add back TA&M although I have heard that will never happen). ND could still play Navy, Stanford and USC for instance. This gives each conference a much more valuable package to sell to TV than any currently have (Except B1G ??) Try to maintain as many rivalries as possible…Ratings bonanza and we as fans get better games all around, WIN – WIN for everyone.
SEC North Pod
Alabama
Tennessee
Auburn
Vanderbilt
SEC West Pod
Oklahoma
Texas A&M
Missouri
Kansas
SEC South Pod
Louisiana
Arkansas
Mississippi
Mississippi State
East SEC pod
Georgia
Florida
Kentucky
South Carolina
PAC North Pod
Washington
Oregon
Washington State
Oregon State
PAC East Pod
Texas
Oklahoma State
TT
Baylor
Pac South Pod
USC
UCLA
Arizona
ASU
Pac Central Pod
Stanford
Cal
Utah
CU
ACC North Pod
ND
Syracuse
Pitt
BC
ACC West Pod
FSU
Miami
GT
Louisville
ACC South Pod
Clemson
WVU
Wake
Duke
ACC East Pod
VT
NC State
Virginia
UNC
B1G Pod 1
Michigan
Ohio State
Illinois
Purdue
B1G Pod 2
Nebraska
Iowa
KSU
Minessota
B1G Pod 3
Wisconsin
Michigan State
Iowa State
North Western
B1G Pod 4
Penn State
Maryland
Rutgers
Indiana
Play your pod every year (3 games) and 2 from every other pod in your conference (6 games). This means you play every team in the conference on a 2 year cycle unlike now. Plus every 4 years you have done a home and home with each team in the conference.
Each year you play one traditional big team and one traditional tier 2 team from each pod. Biggest issues is loss of some traditional conference cross division rivals but I tried to pair up teams so each pod has two traditional powers that already have rivalries and two traditional 2nd tiers that already have rivalries. Believe you play every team in the conference every 2 years and home and home with every team in 4 years
The PAC/B1G would have to deal with Texas (and the LHN). PAC would be crazy not to pursue the rest of the Big 12 teams. If the PAC doesn’t go after 4 from Big 12 it will be completely irrelevant in the next media rights negotiation. PAC would get UT, OSU, TT and Baylor?. In addition, the PAC would probably sell their soul to make sure Texas came, much more so than the B1G would be willing. Texas has way more leverage over PAC than B1G. The ACC gets ND and WVU, B1G gets stuck with ISU and KSU? ND would have to give up independence or be left out of the new playoff system that would be negotiated. If that was the choice, ND wouldn’t want to be second fiddle to OSU and would pick the ACC. Biggest problem for SEC is getting OU and OSU go to different conferences, a lot of contention there. But new scheduling mandate may resolve. Ask Texas if they would rather be in PAC conference or B1G. PAC would be much easier to win, plus they would be able to throw their weight around in the PAC not so much in the SEC or B1G. Same question with ND ask if they would rather be in ACC or B1G and they would say ACC…Easier to win championships in ACC and PAC than B1G plus they are top dog in the conference.
This would start the power 4 16 team conferences (64 teams) and potential for division re-alignment. The goal of a conference re-alignment is to try and get better Divisions across all conferences for a better TV contract (or streaming contract). In addition, its goal should foster more P4 vs P4 games for a better product for both the fans and the owner of the contract. Instead of divisions use four 4 team pods in each conference instead of two 8 team divisions. In order to accomplish that you want two traditional powers per pod, and two traditional second tier teams per pod. For the newer power 4 conferences to work they would also require a scheduling mandate. All power 4 conferences require 9 league games and minimum of two additional Power 4 program each year so teams like UF, UGA, SC, UK, traditional ACC matchups don’t put those teams at a disadvantage. This means 11 power 4 games per year and one game (either FCS or group of 5 for home games) as a choice for the school. Still gives teams the chance to take on traditional rivals (OU could still schedule OSU and UTx for instance, UTx might even add back TA&M although I have heard that will never happen). ND could still play Navy, Stanford and USC for instance. This gives each conference a much more valuable package to sell to TV than any currently have (Except B1G ??) Try to maintain as many rivalries as possible…Ratings bonanza and we as fans get better games all around, WIN – WIN for everyone.
SEC North Pod
Alabama
Tennessee
Auburn
Vanderbilt
SEC West Pod
Oklahoma
Texas A&M
Missouri
Kansas
SEC South Pod
Louisiana
Arkansas
Mississippi
Mississippi State
East SEC pod
Georgia
Florida
Kentucky
South Carolina
PAC North Pod
Washington
Oregon
Washington State
Oregon State
PAC East Pod
Texas
Oklahoma State
TT
Baylor
Pac South Pod
USC
UCLA
Arizona
ASU
Pac Central Pod
Stanford
Cal
Utah
CU
ACC North Pod
ND
Syracuse
Pitt
BC
ACC West Pod
FSU
Miami
GT
Louisville
ACC South Pod
Clemson
WVU
Wake
Duke
ACC East Pod
VT
NC State
Virginia
UNC
B1G Pod 1
Michigan
Ohio State
Illinois
Purdue
B1G Pod 2
Nebraska
Iowa
KSU
Minessota
B1G Pod 3
Wisconsin
Michigan State
Iowa State
North Western
B1G Pod 4
Penn State
Maryland
Rutgers
Indiana
Play your pod every year (3 games) and 2 from every other pod in your conference (6 games). This means you play every team in the conference on a 2 year cycle unlike now. Plus every 4 years you have done a home and home with each team in the conference.
Each year you play one traditional big team and one traditional tier 2 team from each pod. Biggest issues is loss of some traditional conference cross division rivals but I tried to pair up teams so each pod has two traditional powers that already have rivalries and two traditional 2nd tiers that already have rivalries. Believe you play every team in the conference every 2 years and home and home with every team in 4 years
This post was edited on 12/8/18 at 12:54 pm
Posted on 12/8/18 at 12:33 pm to Acc fan
quote:If that happens the SEC hype will go down the drain thanks to Bama killing off the talent of the mid tier schools. They will start using that to show the sec is weaker and the top schools don't play anyone anymore.
Big 10 to pursue oklahoma and texas
This post was edited on 12/8/18 at 12:36 pm
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