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re: Staff point of view

Posted on 11/27/17 at 1:13 pm to
Posted by Culverhouse13
Birmingham, AL
Member since Jul 2014
1406 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 1:13 pm to
Exactly how I feel about Hurts and couldn’t put it any better....
Posted by KareemAbdul
Member since Dec 2012
1728 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 2:46 pm to
That was really well said. It's the best way to view the situation. I wish nothing but the best for Hurts, but I'd like to see what Tua could do.

Posted by BamaGradinTn
Murfreesboro
Member since Dec 2008
26957 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 2:57 pm to
quote:

I totally agree.

I think our biggest issue right now is behind center.



I won't disagree that Hurts is an issue, but IMO the OL is worse. We start the #67 rated OT in his class at RT, and that's exactly how he plays. Our OL as a unit is mediocre at best.
Posted by KareemAbdul
Member since Dec 2012
1728 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:13 pm to
Based on what, exactly?

Since 2008:

This line has given up 3.75 tackles for loss per game, which is the best of this time period. The previous 9 year average was 5.19.

This line has given up 1.83 sacks per game. Bama averaged 1.60 over those 9 years. So, pretty much our average. You'll say it's because Hurts escaped. I'll counter and say he holds the ball too long and offsets that.

The run game is averaging 6ypc, which is the best of Saban's tenure.

So, what exactly are we basing this "terrible" offensive line narrative on? The fact that we see a QB running around not throwing the ball? I won't pretend that stats prove everything. Despite the numbers, this isn't the best offensive line we've had. But, it's also not bad.

-From Teague. The OL complaints are crap. They aren't th best we have had, but they do their job good enough to win.
Posted by Sauron
Birmingham
Member since Dec 2015
994 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:21 pm to
quote:

So, what exactly are we basing this "terrible" offensive line narrative on?


I think it's a combination. No question Hurts held the ball too long in some situations, because he was waiting for a receiver to come open, or because he couldn't process what he was seeing / scan the field in a timely manner.

On the other hand, there were a number of occasions in which Hurts just had no time whatsoever -- he took the snap, dropped back, and immediately had to scramble or sidestep an onrushing defender.

It's not either / or; it's both.
Posted by AllBamaDoesIsWin
Member since Dec 2011
26725 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:25 pm to
quote:

On the other hand, there were a number of occasions in which Hurts just had no time whatsoever -- he took the snap, dropped back, and immediately had to scramble or sidestep an onrushing defender.



This usually happens for any and every team in any and every game against solid or better competition. It's rare for an OL to be able to keep a pocket clean for the entire game. A QB has to be able to stay calm under pressure, read down the field, and deliver the ball.
Posted by Syd
Member since Sep 2012
2964 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:27 pm to
quote:

Right so why do they keep running it ? Go to RPO if he stays in.


I'd like for a reporter to ask Saban this
Posted by Culverhouse13
Birmingham, AL
Member since Jul 2014
1406 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:32 pm to
.. that would be awesome.

"Hey Coach. Why did you think a pass-first gameplan against Auburn's defense would work with Jalen Hurts as your quarterback when he has struggled to throw the ball versus above average defenses for two seasons?"
This post was edited on 11/27/17 at 3:33 pm
Posted by CrimsonTideMD
Member since Dec 2010
6925 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:33 pm to
quote:

"Hey Coach. Why did you think a pass-first gameplan against Auburn's defense would work with Jalen Hurts as your quarterback when he has struggled to throw the ball versus above average defenses for two seasons?"


It's a fair question.

I'd love to hear his answer.
Posted by AllBamaDoesIsWin
Member since Dec 2011
26725 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:38 pm to
Based on his usual comments in regards to Jalen:

"Well we certainly don't think Jalen has struggled to throw the ball. Who says he has? Aight, because we haven't said that. Now there are certainly things we could do better as a team, and that includes getting better in the passing game, but that isn't all on Jalen. We're very happy with the way Jalen has played."
Posted by 14&Counting
Eugene, OR
Member since Jul 2012
37611 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:50 pm to
quote:

"Well we certainly don't think Jalen has struggled to throw the ball. Who says he has? Aight, because we haven't said that. Now there are certainly things we could do better as a team, and that includes getting better in the passing game, but that isn't all on Jalen. We're very happy with the way Jalen has played."


Needs a few more "relative to"s
Posted by CrimsonTideMD
Member since Dec 2010
6925 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 3:55 pm to
quote:

"Well we certainly don't think Jalen has struggled to throw the ball. Who says he has? Aight, because we haven't said that. Now there are certainly things we could do better as a team, and that includes getting better in the passing game, but that isn't all on Jalen. We're very happy with the way Jalen has played."


Sounds about right.

I appreciate that he won't throw players under the bus.

Maybe tweak the question
"Hey Coach. Why did you think a pass-first gameplan against Auburn's defense would work when the passing game has struggled against above average defenses for past two seasons?"
Posted by samson73103
Krypton
Member since Nov 2008
8130 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 5:16 pm to
quote:

Where is your beef with Foster not running deep enough of a route?

I had a greater issue with this play than Bo getting tackled a yard short. If Foster just turns upfield he likely has the first down but he dipped back towards the LOS and it proved to be a costly error.
Posted by KareemAbdul
Member since Dec 2012
1728 posts
Posted on 11/27/17 at 5:24 pm to
quote:

had a greater issue with this play than Bo getting tackled a yard short. If Foster just turns upfield he likely has the first down but he dipped back towards the LOS and it proved to be a costly error.


that play was a much bigger error. He was lined up the sideline and ran like 3 yards out before he cut back. He could have made his cut a yard deeper and been in first down territory when he caught it
Posted by BamaReb
N Carolina
Member since Nov 2017
291 posts
Posted on 11/28/17 at 3:55 pm to
For a senior wr, this was a pretty big error...route not deep enough, field awareness questionable for not stopping and diving for yardage versus dipping toward line of scrimmage
Posted by JoseyWalesTheOutlaw
In The Ham
Member since Nov 2017
11661 posts
Posted on 11/28/17 at 4:14 pm to
Robert Foster has been at Alabama for 5 years and for the most part never contributed much. To think he was going to blossom into an elite player in year 5 was asking for a bunch. Robert has little if any football IQ. If he did make a catch then is intent was to take it to the house even if that meant running backward. What you see time and time again was Bama players with little to NO field knowledge as to the 1st down markers . JMO but that starts with coaching. Sure he can fly but his football IQ level is about the same level as his forty time.
Posted by TroyTider
Florida Panhandle
Member since Oct 2009
3763 posts
Posted on 11/28/17 at 6:24 pm to
If Bo opens to the defense on his route and catches over his left shoulder, he either runs over Roberts or hurdles him. But like Foster moving laterally after the 3rd down catch, rather than turning up the field for at least a first down...well, those were just two WTF? Moments.
Posted by JoseyWalesTheOutlaw
In The Ham
Member since Nov 2017
11661 posts
Posted on 11/28/17 at 6:31 pm to
The 2017 version of Bo isn't the same as the 2016 model. Not sure if it is mental from his injury but he is just an average back this season. I look forward to Brian Robinson in 2018. He is gonnnna be a bad man.
Posted by phil4bama
Emerald Coast of PCB
Member since Jul 2011
11455 posts
Posted on 11/28/17 at 7:25 pm to
This is strictly my opinion based on watching the Tide all year. We are being deceived by the statistics in this instance. We all point to the gaudy rushing averages, the point totals, etc, etc, and say that this offense is good. It's not. And the reason it's not good is because it is very inconsistent and streaky. We have lived and died by the explosive play. Rushing is a great example. Damien Harris has a great per carry average this season, for sure. But Damien isn't averaging 7 yards per carry or whatever the number is because he's getting 4-7 yards most plays and busting the moderately frequent 20-25 yarder. Damien's (and probably all the backs) have such nice averages because their rushing chart looks like this: 1, 2, 2, 5, 65, 1, 3, 2...that's a 10 yard average per carry. But it's not productive at sustaining drives.

The other factor is the HUGE number of negative plays the offense generates. We are a very fragile offense this year and can't afford to get behind the chains, but we frequently do. On first down, when we attempt to pass and Jalen can't find anyone open and throws the ball away or tries to run and makes it 2 yards before going out of bounds, we are behind the chains and can't bail ourselves out more often than not. Or the line misses a block and Damien gets hit in the backfield for no gain.

In years past, (pre-spread days at Bama) we might fall behind the chains on first down, but could rely on our brutal ground game to get 4 yards on 2nd down to get to 3rd and 6. Much more manageable than 3rd and 8 or 9. We can't do that now. We have nothing to fall back on. We can't run consistently, we can't throw consistently. We have no go-to plays. On occasion, we flash competent offense like against Miss State. But it's in spurts, for 1 or 2 drives, separated by way too many 3 and outs. I'd love to see the numbers on how many times we have faced 3rd and 5+ this season and how successful our conversion rate is. I suspect it's horrid.

We sustain nothing this year. We try random plays hoping to find a crease and break one for a big play and a TD. We have no consistent philosophy and it shows. There is no rhythm, no continuity, no production.

There's plenty of reasons for it: poor OL play, poor QB production, poor play selection. But here's the thing: I hate to point fingers, but our head coach has admitted that our 2nd year starter at QB can't run the offense we are trying to run the way it is meant to be run so they have reduced his reads by taking half the field away. We have made it almost one dimensional by choice because we know Jalen can't throw the ball downfield in a consistent manner. If the defense can play only half the field on pass plays, and play the run by stacking the box because they don't respect the passing game, we have no prayer of being effective.It's just not working. The staff has to make a decision. We either have to change the offense we want to run to fit what our QB can do, or we have to change QB's to someone who can run the offense we want to run. We can't do both although we've tried like hell this season.

I don't care what we do, I want what's best for Alabama. Jalen is a fine young man that has been a great representative and competitor for us. But he's reached his limits with what we are asking him to do. Tua is a fine young man as well. It's your choice, coaches, but you've got to do something. The mutant offense isn't cutting it anymore.
Posted by stomp
Bama
Member since Nov 2014
3705 posts
Posted on 11/28/17 at 7:30 pm to
quote:

Based on what, exactly? Since 2008: This line has given up 3.75 tackles for loss per game, which is the best of this time period. The previous 9 year average was 5.19. This line has given up 1.83 sacks per game. Bama averaged 1.60 over those 9 years. So, pretty much our average. You'll say it's because Hurts escaped. I'll counter and say he holds the ball too long and offsets that.


Watch the games, man...
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