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re: What Killed Ole Miss Football?
Posted on 4/18/14 at 6:59 am to cardboardboxer
Posted on 4/18/14 at 6:59 am to cardboardboxer
Surprisingly, this has been an interesting, well-spoken, and non-flame thread.
Let's hope it continues for the Friday Morning crowd.
Mernin, folks
Let's hope it continues for the Friday Morning crowd.
Mernin, folks
0
Posted on 4/18/14 at 6:59 am to Henry Jones Jr
I love ole miss delusional fans who say shite like colonel rebel is supposed to be a black guy, there are and were no racists on campy in 1962, the name rebels and the confederate flag aren't racist, etc. what stupidity and a refusal to even be honest with yourself.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 7:05 am to BruinsWoo
quote:
Posted by BruinsWoo I love ole miss delusional fans who say shite like colonel rebel is supposed to be a black guy, there are and were no racists on campy in 1962, the name rebels and the confederate flag aren't racist, etc. what stupidity and a refusal to even be honest with yourself.
Thank you for your interest in Ole Miss athletics.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 7:20 am to BruinsWoo
quote:
I love ole miss delusional fans who say shite like colonel rebel is supposed to be a black guy,
What? The caricature of Colonel Reb with the wide brimmed hat and cane is based off of Blind Jim Ivy. That is a documented fact.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 7:31 am to Toddy
I wonder what it's like to have no hope of winning a natty ? I guess that would leave you overly concerned about beating only one school. Interesting.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 7:33 am to S.E.C. Crazy
I understand that Ole Miss. was still good in 58,59,60 but that was because their team was already established, once Bryant got his team to the top in 1961, Ole Miss was basically finished as a power, sure that had a few more good years after 61, but Bear won 6 titles in 19 years.
Anyone using their brain would know Bryant didn't takeover until 61.
think
Put the houndstooth crack pipe down.
Anyone using their brain would know Bryant didn't takeover until 61.
think
Put the houndstooth crack pipe down.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 7:43 am to Dalosaqy
quote:
Other than the predictably self-centered gump post, this is a pretty interesting thread.
and a few other fans that have sullied the thread.
Otherwise, love this discussion.
This post was edited on 4/18/14 at 7:46 am
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:18 am to AU4real35
One problem is the public school system in Mississippi. There are a lot of great athletes who never qualify and end up going to one of the 13 football playing JUCO programs. After that many land in some sort of trouble or just neve make the grades there, they then go to West Alabama or Delta state. Our sorry school system is also why our JUCO football dominates other juco football states.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:29 am to Greenfloridan
quote:
ut we have the grove... Which beats the shite out of anywhere else as a fan.
Only to you and all the media heads that you pay to keep spreading that bullshite.
Tailgates in Baton Rouge, and Tuscaloosa blow the whole Oxford tea party scene out of the water.
Whatever killed ole miss came from inside.
This post was edited on 4/18/14 at 8:31 am
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:31 am to Toddy
quote:
What? The caricature of Colonel Reb with the wide brimmed hat and cane is based off of Blind Jim Ivy. That is a documented fact.
Sweet. Should be really easy to verify then!!!
quote:
While University of Mississippi historian David Sansing has stated that "Blind Jim [Ivy] may have been the model for Colonel Rebel." This conclusion is not supported by other historical research. Accordingly, William F. Winter Professor of History, Charles Eagles, contends in his book "The Price of Defiance: James Meredith and the Integration of Ole Miss" that this is clearly not the case. Sansing cites "the late Frank Everett" as the sole basis for this conclusion.[1][2]
Well damn. Bummer. I bet you honestly believed you were right, but you're not.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:34 am to Slippery Slope
Interesting thread minus the crazy gump 
Most people don't know but for a long time, LSU went by "Ole Lou" too Page 3 for Reference
Most people don't know but for a long time, LSU went by "Ole Lou" too Page 3 for Reference
quote:
LSU began in 1860 as the Louisiana State Seminary of Learning and Military Academy, shortly before the beginning of the Civil War. In fact, LSU's first superintendent was Civil War commander William Tecumseh Sherman. "Ole War Skule" was formerly a popular ref- erence to LSU, as was the term "Old Lou."
This post was edited on 4/18/14 at 8:44 am
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:52 am to cardboardboxer
The reason Ole Miss had so much success in the 50s and early 60s was due to the concept of "One-platoon" or "Iron man" football. Players had to play both sides of the ball. This restricted the number of people who could play, thus allowing Ole Miss to thrive on a more even playing field with larger universities, since Mississippi, though not very populated, does have the highest per capita in terms of NFL players. This ended in 1964, a year in which Ole Miss was preseason #1, finished 5-5-1.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:57 am to ukraine_rebel
quote:
Mississippi, though not very populated, does have the highest per capita in terms of NFL players
Ten years ago you would be correct. . It's pretty well know that LA produces more per capita now.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 8:58 am to Greenfloridan
quote:
Even though Alabama had just as bad/ if not worse race issues. But we have the grove... Which beats the shite out of anywhere else as a fan.
The primary difference between Alabama and Ole Miss in this regard is that Alabama's legendary coach helped guide it through integration while Johnny Vaught abruptly retired and left the Ole Miss program holding the bag.
And that's no slight at Vaught - he was an all time great - but that's one of the reasons why Ole Miss was in the wilderness for 40 years.
This post was edited on 4/18/14 at 9:06 am
Posted on 4/18/14 at 9:00 am to memphisplaya
quote:
Mississippi, though not very populated, does have the highest per capita in terms of NFL players
Ten years ago you would be correct. . It's pretty well know that LA produces more per capita now.
The point remains, the one-platoon system allowed Ole Miss to use that to its advantage.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 9:03 am to DingDongEddieStrong
quote:
-We divided our home games between Oxford and Jackson, like Arkansas does with LR & Fayetteville and Alabama did with Birmingham & T-town. For years, we would play our bigger games in Jackson because the stadium was bigger, thus neglecting VHS and not improving our facilities until 1997 when Tuberville arrived. He made a focus to improve the facilities in Oxford, getting rid of all home games in Jackson and improve the home field advantage on campus. This is also when the Grove became the tailgate spectacle it is today.
Honest question because I'm interested and don't know the answer and because we're facing a similar situation -- what was fan reaction to the removal of games from Jackson, and did Ole Miss suffer for it?
Reason I ask is because we're in a similar situation and just now have started the process of moving the games out of Little Rock. Of course, our lesser-informed (read: t-shirt fans) are all up in arms about it and claiming that the UA is "abandoning the rest of the state," so I'm interested to see how it played out for Ole Miss. I know it played out okay at Alabama, but that's a different situation because they've continued to win national titles and winning cures all ailments.
This post was edited on 4/18/14 at 9:05 am
Posted on 4/18/14 at 9:18 am to cardboardboxer
Army was a top program in the 40s.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 9:26 am to cardboardboxer
Reasons why Ole Miss football died: a summary of this thread
1) Integration/Johnny Vaught not recruiting black players - 5
2) "Racism" cloud hanging over the head of Ole Miss athletics - 4 1/2
3) The tiny state of Mississippi having multiple large public universities instead of one and having to split resources on top of the public institutions of higher learning are controlled by the same BOT - 2
4) Keeping the original mascot, the Flood, instead of adopting the Rebels, which added to the "racist sentiments" - 1/2
5) Late entrant into the "SEC facilities arms race" which began in the 1970s - 4 1/2
6) Lack of leadership in the athletic department/having a "good ole' boy network" in the athletics department - 1 1/2
Overall decline in the power of "smaller" schools compared to the power they wielded in the 1960s/"the game changed"/change from the iron-man football rules in the 1960s - 1
7) Public school system in Mississippi produces the athletes, but they don't qualify and head the JUCO route - 1
1) Integration/Johnny Vaught not recruiting black players - 5
2) "Racism" cloud hanging over the head of Ole Miss athletics - 4 1/2
3) The tiny state of Mississippi having multiple large public universities instead of one and having to split resources on top of the public institutions of higher learning are controlled by the same BOT - 2
4) Keeping the original mascot, the Flood, instead of adopting the Rebels, which added to the "racist sentiments" - 1/2
5) Late entrant into the "SEC facilities arms race" which began in the 1970s - 4 1/2
6) Lack of leadership in the athletic department/having a "good ole' boy network" in the athletics department - 1 1/2
Overall decline in the power of "smaller" schools compared to the power they wielded in the 1960s/"the game changed"/change from the iron-man football rules in the 1960s - 1
7) Public school system in Mississippi produces the athletes, but they don't qualify and head the JUCO route - 1
Posted on 4/18/14 at 9:34 am to hg
quote:
How awesome would it be if Mississippi only had one large University in the state and that was in the SEC? How different would things be and how good would their history have been?
Kinda like how LSU has the state to its self.
Not sure if trolling or not but I tend to agree. The old wealth of the state (Natchez once had the most millionaires per capita in the USA) probably meant perception of supporting 2 in the 1800's that did not envision a day when King Cotton was no longer king. Ole Miss started in 1848 and State started in 1878 as a Morrill school.
Arkansas, Kentucky, Missouri, Tennessee, and LSU all seem to have benefitted from single state status. UK is both the flagship and the Morrill school so the resources were combined in a small population state. If UK were split into 2 different schools as happened in Mississippi the resources available in the late 1800's and early 1900's would have limited UK in becoming a top basketball school.
That said, both are charter members of the club so debating it now seems pointless as neither is leaving, nor are they combining now just for the sake of the conference.
Posted on 4/18/14 at 9:41 am to cardboardboxer
I'm black. I go to UA, but for some reason I don't think I'd ever go to ole miss.
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