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re: Kirby Smart does not have to coach this year
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:06 am to Crowknowsbest
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:06 am to Crowknowsbest
quote:
My point is that #3 is good enough to win big with.
Maybe, with really good coaching. But there is still a pretty big talent gap between #1 and #3. Alabama has been working with a huge advantage for 6-7 years now....and it shows. There is a reason they have had all the success they have had. #1 recruiting classes 7 years in row, I think it is.
quote:
#8 isn't.
Probably not.
0
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:08 am to Peter Buck
Is there such thing as being overcoached?
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:11 am to Peter Buck
quote:
What is scary is they seem disorganized, flat, undisciplined, out of position, and lacking a sense of urgency. Among things. They are not doing the little things. I blame this on the current staff.
The staff clearly deserves a lot of the blame here, but I really think a huge problem is the total lack of any sort of upperclassman leadership on this team. Sony was the only player that showed any sort of vocal give-a-shite on Saturday. It's pretty clear at this point that the seniors aren't going to do it, so the coaches need to demand that of some of our younger players. It's not fair, but they need to grow up faster.
The last time UGA was pretty good (2014), Gurley was jumping on people when they fricked up. We need guys that will do that. Chubb especially really can't be the quiet leader anymore. The other players respect him and won't want to let him down if he makes it clear that they are.
ETA: The best teams I was ever on never needed coaches to motivate us. We were at each others' throats the whole time.
This post was edited on 9/26/16 at 9:14 am
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:22 am to Peter Buck
quote:
If we get beat because our guys are a step slower, a few pounds too small, not quite as good, not quite as deep... I'm good with that with a new coach coming in.
And IMO for the most part that and the simple fact that Kelly is a veteran/NFL caliber QB with very talented/reliable receivers tells most of the story. However, if you look that box score, the game was closer than indicated by the score. We had 230 rushing yards, 50 more than Ole Miss, and dominated time of possession, 35:48 to 24:12. The problem was Ole Miss beat us on big passing plays with 330 passing yards. Bottom line: our defense could not get pressure on Kelly and could not cover his talented receivers. The Rebels only had 2 more first downs than the Dawgs but we did have one more turnover which definitely hurt since they scored on both TO's if I remember correctly.
The outcome of this game was very predictable ( I said it would be at least 2 TD's) with Georgia playing a Freshman QB behind a mediocre OL with small not particularly talented receivers. Chubb is definitely not the same player he was before the injury but I was impressed with Herrien and Michel; it just wasn't enough behind our OL and so many dropped passes. If just half of those drops had been caught the score would have been closer to 45 to 28 but still not enough to overcome the disparity in talent. Kelly & Co. were just too much on offense for our defense to handle.
This post was edited on 9/26/16 at 9:55 am
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:32 am to GurleyGirl
I'm almost hesitant to believe the story told by the box score, in this case, though. Half of that yardage was gained in garbage time against OM's cheerleaders. Freeze gave the appearance that they could have hung 70 on us, but he took his foot off the gas. Seth Emerson was reporting that the team looked absolutely demolished, emotionally, midway through the 2nd QUARTER. I don't know how you coach a team out of that.
Some would say that ButchWax found a way to do exactly that, this week, but something tells me that it was just as much a credit to team leadership. Plus, I refuse to give that french horn playing motherfricker any due.
Others have said it: We are desperately lacking a Shawn Williams to step up and call our own players out.
Some would say that ButchWax found a way to do exactly that, this week, but something tells me that it was just as much a credit to team leadership. Plus, I refuse to give that french horn playing motherfricker any due.
Others have said it: We are desperately lacking a Shawn Williams to step up and call our own players out.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:33 am to DawgsLife
quote:
Those examples are not a matter of tenure and getting your own people in place. Nicholls? Seriously? You don't think we had the personnel to beat them easily?
Ask Nick Saban how is Alabama team did in '07 during his first season against Louisiana Monroe before he had his people in place. While we're on the subject of Georgia's personnel though, less than a year ago a 15 year tenured coach with a very similar roster needed overtime to beat Georgia Southern.
quote:
Against Nicholls? Absolutely. When it comes to preparation? Absolutely. When it comes to record? Not so much. I don't think people have a problem with losing to Ole Miss. It was how we lost. That was the argument for Richt, and that should certainly be the argument for the Ole Miss game. Look at the rosters and see who has more 4 and 5* players. It's not like we have no talent. Saturday was preparation. Peter Buck has a point.
We have one side that wants to pick apart every decision and nose scratch Kirby makes, and the other side that would give him a pass if he decided to stay home from the game.
There needs to be some honest, unbiased evaluation.
There does need to be unbiased evaluation, but to be fair preparation is such a hard thing to quantify. I'm not saying that CKS isn't to blame, but I can't really make that call 4 games into his coaching career. If we're seeing the same things in week 8 of 2017 then you can have the conversation, but isn't it unreasonable to pin so much on a coach who hasn't even been with the team a full calendar year? To me the real double standard is thinking that we know anything about Kirby Smart as a HC 4 games into his coaching career. The standard for someone 4 games in vs. 15 years in shouldn't be the same, and while this may change in a year from now, for the time being he gets the benefit of the doubt.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:43 am to Dawgs28
So, just to be clear.... It is the fault of the older players for not motivating the team... Not the coaching staff. We are blaming 21 year olds getting free college, not 40 year olds making millions for not doing one of the core jobs of a coach. Jesus fricking Christ, do you people hear yourselves ?
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:43 am to Sandwich
quote:
Sandwich
I'm agreeing with you numbnuts
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:46 am to Peter Buck
quote:
So, just to be clear.... It is the fault of the older players for not motivating the team... Not the coaching staff. We are blaming 21 year olds getting free college, not 40 year olds making millions for not doing one of the core jobs of a coach. Jesus fricking Christ, do you people hear yourselves ?
I'm not blaming them per se, but good teams have vocal leadership from within the team, without exception to my knowledge. We don't have that. That's just reality.
It's the coaches' job to develop that. So far they have failed to do so, and they deserve blame for that.
This post was edited on 9/26/16 at 9:47 am
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:56 am to VoxDawg
quote:
I'm almost hesitant to believe the story told by the box score, in this case, though. Half of that yardage was gained in garbage time against OM's cheerleaders. Freeze gave the appearance that they could have hung 70 on us, but he took his foot off the gas.
Valid and I agree. But we did have some good plays vs their cheerleaders so I remain hopeful. Hope springs eternal at the Dawg Nation.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 9:58 am to Peter Buck
quote:
So, just to be clear.... It is the fault of the older players for not motivating the team?
I wholeheartedly agree with you and hate that argument. Leadership starts with the coaches.
What I'm worried about is we have a core group of players that were cruising being "good men" and now don't like having to work hard. For every Chubb how many Triggas do we have on the roster?
Posted on 9/26/16 at 10:06 am to Crowknowsbest
Fair enough... I also think I should add that ther are an awful lot of comparisons to Saban here. Almost with the assumption that Smart will inherit the same path. Note that Saban failed when the talent was equal or at least closer to equal. Saban wins by having top recruiting classes. He has done so at two schools that have immense recruiting machines in place. We could only dream to have the recruiting infrastructure Bama has... This predates Saban. Their "influence" is immense. I can see Smart improving our recruiting vs Richt. It will be a tad more difficult to go head to head with Saban in that regards. It's not an automatic.
I was real enthused after the UNC game. Not sure what happened since then, but it's almost like our offensive mail is being read. The team is not getting better each game. Take Ole Miss out of the equation and that holds true still. We have coaches making a lot of money and they need to make this team better. That is their job. They are not doing it....
I was real enthused after the UNC game. Not sure what happened since then, but it's almost like our offensive mail is being read. The team is not getting better each game. Take Ole Miss out of the equation and that holds true still. We have coaches making a lot of money and they need to make this team better. That is their job. They are not doing it....
Posted on 9/26/16 at 10:10 am to Peter Buck
A Stingtalker's POV
"You guys can thank Smart for this. He started this talk well before the season even started. He's right in some ways - where's the big-bodied WRs for UGA? Blazevich is their only long receiver.
The problem is that Smart's defense only works when he has guys with specific measurables. It isn't adaptable at all to different offensive situations (as noted by his continual throttling by Hugh Freeze).
Smart needs guys that are
1. An inch or two taller than average at every position
2. Leaner in the linebacker group
3. A shorter, heavier defensive tackle rotation for run stuff
4. A taller, leaner defensive end rotation for perimeter and pass protection.
His zone scheme requires a lot of movement between the back 7-8 players. He is very good within the realm of what Saban has taught him, but he has no ability to adapt the defense outside of that. They recruit guys with NFL measurables and they churn out guys with NFL measurables at Alabama. Not having the perfect defense at Georgia shows how rigid Smart is. It isn't a talent issue; it is a scheme issue.
Smart also needs a gigantic staff to handle most of the player development, and I don't think he's got that at UGA. There's a reason he was the hardest working recruiter in the country at Alabama - they have a stable of coaches for every position and the defense there only really needed Smart on Saturdays. It will be interesting to see how he takes on the head coaching roles at Georgia."
"You guys can thank Smart for this. He started this talk well before the season even started. He's right in some ways - where's the big-bodied WRs for UGA? Blazevich is their only long receiver.
The problem is that Smart's defense only works when he has guys with specific measurables. It isn't adaptable at all to different offensive situations (as noted by his continual throttling by Hugh Freeze).
Smart needs guys that are
1. An inch or two taller than average at every position
2. Leaner in the linebacker group
3. A shorter, heavier defensive tackle rotation for run stuff
4. A taller, leaner defensive end rotation for perimeter and pass protection.
His zone scheme requires a lot of movement between the back 7-8 players. He is very good within the realm of what Saban has taught him, but he has no ability to adapt the defense outside of that. They recruit guys with NFL measurables and they churn out guys with NFL measurables at Alabama. Not having the perfect defense at Georgia shows how rigid Smart is. It isn't a talent issue; it is a scheme issue.
Smart also needs a gigantic staff to handle most of the player development, and I don't think he's got that at UGA. There's a reason he was the hardest working recruiter in the country at Alabama - they have a stable of coaches for every position and the defense there only really needed Smart on Saturdays. It will be interesting to see how he takes on the head coaching roles at Georgia."
Posted on 9/26/16 at 10:19 am to Chris_topher
quote:
"You guys can thank Smart for this. He started this talk well before the season even started. He's right in some ways - where's the big-bodied WRs for UGA? Blazevich is their only long receiver.
The problem is that Smart's defense only works when he has guys with specific measurables. It isn't adaptable at all to different offensive situations (as noted by his continual throttling by Hugh Freeze).
Smart needs guys that are
1. An inch or two taller than average at every position
2. Leaner in the linebacker group
3. A shorter, heavier defensive tackle rotation for run stuff
4. A taller, leaner defensive end rotation for perimeter and pass protection.
His zone scheme requires a lot of movement between the back 7-8 players. He is very good within the realm of what Saban has taught him, but he has no ability to adapt the defense outside of that. They recruit guys with NFL measurables and they churn out guys with NFL measurables at Alabama. Not having the perfect defense at Georgia shows how rigid Smart is. It isn't a talent issue; it is a scheme issue.
Smart also needs a gigantic staff to handle most of the player development, and I don't think he's got that at UGA. There's a reason he was the hardest working recruiter in the country at Alabama - they have a stable of coaches for every position and the defense there only really needed Smart on Saturdays. It will be interesting to see how he takes on the head coaching roles at Georgia."
I think this is mostly right. Smart was hired specifically to bring this kind of program to Georgia. It's a risk obviously, and if it works it will take at least 2-3 to come to fruition.
As evidence, UGA has hired about 10 support staffers since Smart arrived, and now pays Jonas Jennings like $300k/yr to run player development.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 10:26 am to Peter Buck
quote:
So, just to be clear.... It is the fault of the older players for not motivating the team... Not the coaching staff. We are blaming 21 year olds getting free college, not 40 year olds making millions for not doing one of the core jobs of a coach. Jesus fricking Christ, do you people hear yourselves ?
Do you blame the coaching staff at Tulsa for losing 48-3 at OSU this past weekend? If not then you may want to get your hearing checked.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 10:28 am to Dawgs28
Didn't watch the game. Talking about UGA football.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 11:11 am to Crowknowsbest
quote:
Richt was a good recruiter.
This is not true. Maybe for the 1st team, but we never had depth with him. Look at bama, kamara couldn't make it there so he transferred and they still had 6 studs at RB. They ran us off the field last year.
Kirby is also trying to change the culture, that's not an easy thing to do.
As far as WR, they may have been 4* but they can't catch a cold. I don't think I've ever seen that many drops in once game on any level. At some point, the players have to make plays, that's why they are on scholarship.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 11:26 am to GurleyGirl
quote:
simple fact that Kelly is a veteran/NFL caliber QB
I'm not sure i would go that far, but by SEC standards he is very good.
Posted on 9/26/16 at 11:28 am to Walkthedawg
Wait, are you saying Richt didn't recruit good running backs ?
Do you honestly think these kids made 4 star by dropping footballs at the frequency they have in games?
Do you honestly think these kids made 4 star by dropping footballs at the frequency they have in games?
Posted on 9/26/16 at 11:31 am to Walkthedawg
quote:
This is not true. Maybe for the 1st team, but we never had depth with him. Look at bama, kamara couldn't make it there so he transferred and they still had 6 studs at RB. They ran us off the field last year.
Dude. Are you insinuating that if a coach does't recruit like Saban they are not good recruiters? You realize he has had 7 straight #1 recruiting classes, right? Cool your heels and compare him to mortals. There are something like 128 Div. 1 schools and Richt was a top 6 or so recruiter. That is pretty darn good.
quote:
As far as WR, they may have been 4* but they can't catch a cold.
If you knew this before they were signed you should have brought it up to the coaching staff. the point is everybody thought they were excellent. Tennessee has some great wide receivers, too. I counted something like 5 dropped passes by them in the first half of their game. It's not just a Georgia thing.
quote:
I don't think I've ever seen that many drops in once game on any level.
See above and go watch a replay of the Tennessee/Florida game for the first half. It will boggle your mind.
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