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re: Why didn't Saban have more success at LSU?
Posted on 1/23/16 at 7:55 am to CrimsonFever
Posted on 1/23/16 at 7:55 am to CrimsonFever
quote:
One NC in 5 years, only one season with less than 3 losses. In comparison, he won 3 NCs in his first 6 years at Bama. Also the SEC wasn't as strong back when he was at LSU at it is now.
He won 2 SEC titles and a NC in his first 4 years at lsu. Compared to 1 SEC title and 1 NC at bama.
2004 mauck left early and Jamarcus was too young (RSFR) to make a title run. Has a QB left him early at bama?
He also won his first SECC in his second year at LSU (against a vol team headed to the NC) while it took him 3 years at bama
That 2005 (Katrina) and 2006 and 2007 team were absolutely loaded and set to have a modern bama like run. You aren't special gump
Edited: corrected, he was here 5. Also I'll bite hard, he must have learned something in the NFL bc his teams at bama suddenly became the most disciplined he ever coached... Funny how being an hour away from Birmingham reduced his penalties.
Saban at Bama
Saban at LSU
This post was edited on 1/23/16 at 8:32 am
1
Posted on 1/23/16 at 7:58 am to Lsuchs
He was actually at Lsu for 5 seasons
Lsu= 2 sec titles and 1 nc
Bama= 2 nc and 1 sec title
It is amazing how delusional some Bama fans in this thread are.
Lsu= 2 sec titles and 1 nc
Bama= 2 nc and 1 sec title
It is amazing how delusional some Bama fans in this thread are.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 7:59 am to lsupride87
He was at LSU 5 years. But don't feed the trolls.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 8:07 am to Glorious
He owed denardo's 40 future pros his 93 LSU championship
Posted on 1/23/16 at 8:07 am to cardboardboxer
quote:
That's not the point, those programs aren't relevant today. Some programs fade. Yale, Minnesota, Miami, etc. But some programs have stuck around and are more than a good coach or two. Notre Dame. Alabama. Michigan, etc.
It is relevant because programs don't sustain themselves, people do. Bama is where they are not by any divine right but because you've had 35 combined years of Saban and Bear. That's it. There is absolutely nothing about bama that is any more or less special than any other top 10 or so program, and yes that includes LSU.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 8:39 am to Draconian Sanctions
The only reason why Bama is having success is because of NICK SABAN.... period.
If SABAN was at any other school (Power 5 program) in the country, that school would be having a successful football team.
Its NS driving that Bama juggernaut. When he leaves BAMA will fold like a cheap suit and become an average program. Facilities, assistant coaches, fans, etc... will crumble down.
If SABAN was at any other school (Power 5 program) in the country, that school would be having a successful football team.
Its NS driving that Bama juggernaut. When he leaves BAMA will fold like a cheap suit and become an average program. Facilities, assistant coaches, fans, etc... will crumble down.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 8:59 am to CrimsonFever
Swampers.
Eta: pride. Bama boys don't chase checks. Barefoot and proud.
Eta: pride. Bama boys don't chase checks. Barefoot and proud.
This post was edited on 1/23/16 at 9:00 am
Posted on 1/23/16 at 11:27 am to CrimsonFever
I'm going to ignore the slight trollishness of this question and all of the back-and-forth in this thread and give my honest opinion.
Saban had to change the culture in Baton Rouge. LSU was considered an above-average but not elite program when he arrived. He had to raise everyone's expectations for the program, including fans, players, potential recruits, and the administration. He had to lock down recruiting in LSU and convince the administration to upgrade facilities. And he still won two SEC championships and a national championship. And now, the mindset has been changed at LSU, and will stay that way for the foreseeable future, which has helped Miles to sustain success there.
At Alabama, although the program was down, the mindset and expectations never changed. All it took was the right coach.
If Saban went to LSU now, he would have them rolling just like Bama is.
Saban had to change the culture in Baton Rouge. LSU was considered an above-average but not elite program when he arrived. He had to raise everyone's expectations for the program, including fans, players, potential recruits, and the administration. He had to lock down recruiting in LSU and convince the administration to upgrade facilities. And he still won two SEC championships and a national championship. And now, the mindset has been changed at LSU, and will stay that way for the foreseeable future, which has helped Miles to sustain success there.
At Alabama, although the program was down, the mindset and expectations never changed. All it took was the right coach.
If Saban went to LSU now, he would have them rolling just like Bama is.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 12:07 pm to Decker
quote:
At Alabama, although the program was down, the mindset and expectations never changed. All it took was the right coach.
If Saban went to LSU now, he would have them rolling just like Bama is.
Nice post Decker. If Nick suddenly left 'Bama to jump to any other SEC team, no doubt a lot of Tide fans would be hurt, but it would not change his legacy. Many LSU fans believe that Nick would have been slightly more successful than Les has been and thus the animosity born by frustration. I see it more the way you describe it. Yes he brought the program back up to a lofty perch where it still sits to this day, but Les Miles, at 112-32 certainly deserves credit for sustaining the program.
Alabama in my view is the number 1 program of all time. LSU is certainly a top 15 all-time program and really better than that in the past 16 seasons, and that's not a bad place to be either.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 12:09 pm to RANDY44
quote:
Many LSU fans believe that Nick would have been slightly more successful than Les has been and thus the animosity born
You misspelled exponentially.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 1:46 pm to Opelousas Sostan
LSU before Saban was a peer for MSU and Ole Miss most of the time, stuck in the middle of the SEC without realistic prospects of knocking off Alabama/Auburn for the SEC west.
Saban imposed order to their potential and set the infrastructure for their continued success. He's absolutely the reason they're a fantastic program to this day
Saban imposed order to their potential and set the infrastructure for their continued success. He's absolutely the reason they're a fantastic program to this day
Posted on 1/23/16 at 2:46 pm to TNTiger1984
quote:
When he leaves BAMA will fold like a cheap suit and become an average program. Facilities, assistant coaches, fans, etc... will crumble down.
Bama is not and never will be an "average" program. That's not what i'm saying at all. Bama will never ever ever be Arkansas.
All I'm saying is that among the top dozen or so best programs. Places that are flagship schools in their state, in talent rich areas, huge fan support, 100kish stadiums, A+ facilities, and massive profit margins are roughly the same. Nick Saban will win big at any of them. There's nothing "average" about that or about Alabama. It's just this idea that there's something about bama that is "more special" than other top tier programs that's absurd. And yes LSU is a top tier program.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 2:52 pm to CrimsonFever
Perhaps Saban was still finding his groove early on..
Posted on 1/23/16 at 2:57 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
It is relevant because programs don't sustain themselves, people do. Bama is where they are not by any divine right but because you've had 35 combined years of Saban and Bear. That's it. There is absolutely nothing about bama that is any more or less special than any other top 10 or so program, and yes that includes LSU.
Than how do you explain Bill Curry having a .722 winning percentage at Bama and having a .365 winning percentage everywhere else? Or Gene Stallings being a failure with A&M and the Cardinals while winning big at Bama? Dennis Franchione was 17-8 at Bama and proceeded to fail miserably at A&M. And does anybody think Mike Dubose and Mike Dubose would have had ten win seasons at any other school besides Bama?
Posted on 1/23/16 at 3:26 pm to Dire Wolf
When Sabin walked in lSU's locker room he was looking at 40 to be pros'sabin stu nk as a coach his first two years his personal bailed him out his third year !
Posted on 1/23/16 at 3:34 pm to lsupride87
You are silly lack of L$U pride,LSu was loads when he got here he gave away his first two season losses he did better his last year !
Posted on 1/23/16 at 3:34 pm to Bench McElroy
quote:
And does anybody think Mike Dubose and Mike Dubose
Wut.
And Saban did have some issues at Michigan State. Maybe he could have turned them around some more with a little more time though.
He was open about the fact that he was not thrilled that MSU wouldn't give him a "blank check" like LSU offered him. Also, his assistants at MSU quit after every season, thinking that his workload for them was crazy. After he won a natty at LSU finally, his assistants realized that the workload was justified afterall and stopped quitting en masse. Now they only leave to become head coaches elsewhere. I think that MSU was recovering from some NCAA sanctions when he got there as well.
This post was edited on 1/23/16 at 4:08 pm
Posted on 1/23/16 at 4:00 pm to TheDude321
I didn't read this whole thread. However, I've always said Saban was a much better coach at Bama, than he was at LSU. My theory is that he learned a great deal at Miami. He was always a very good coach before and became a great coach afterward.
Posted on 1/23/16 at 4:04 pm to Bench McElroy
quote:
Than how do you explain Bill Curry having a .722 winning percentage at Bama and having a .365 winning percentage everywhere else? Or Gene Stallings being a failure with A&M and the Cardinals while winning big at Bama? Dennis Franchione was 17-8 at Bama and proceeded to fail miserably at A&M. And does anybody think Mike Dubose and Mike Dubose would have had ten win seasons at any other school besides Bama?
Why was Bill Belichick a failure with the Browns and a wild success with the Patriots? Is it just the clam chowder and the great Patriot legacy? No it was just a) a better fit and b) he learned a lot.
Of course Billy Curry is going to do better at Alabama than he is at Kentucky or Georgia Tech. Are you really saying LSU is on the same level as those programs?
give me some OBJECTIVE resources that alabama has that LSU doesn't. You can't because there arent any. Aboth Bama and LSU have way way way more going for it than Kentucky, GT, or even A&M (especially circa 1980's and before).
This post was edited on 1/23/16 at 4:06 pm
Posted on 1/23/16 at 4:06 pm to NotRight37
I agree with you for the most part. But like I noted, his assistants at MSU and LSU always quit due to the workload until he won the natty and showed them why he needed all that preparation work done. At Bama, his staff already knows that it can trust him and doesn't quit at the drop of a hat.
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