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re: ***Official WE TALKIN' BOUT PRACTICE Thread***
Posted on 3/19/14 at 8:09 pm to CapstoneGrad06
Posted on 3/19/14 at 8:09 pm to CapstoneGrad06
quote:
Marquis Johnson was awful his first three years at corner but became a solid CB by his senior year
Back then we didn't have near the talent that we do now. I'd rather not have to wade through another terrible season for him to have a stellar 2015 season particularly since we have a ton of talent at corner.
There was nothing redeemable about Cyrus Jones play last year. I wonder if I posted on the SECr how many teams would be willing to trade one of their starting corners for Cyrus Jones. Most of the powerhouse teams would say no. I want to believe that he will do well just like I wanted to believe that Cade Foster would improve. At the end of the day all I can go with is what I have seen. Cyrus's play does not pass the eye test.
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Posted on 3/19/14 at 8:16 pm to chattabama
Are you sure you aren't confusing Cyrus Jones for Jonathan Fulton? Because as mediocre as Jones was from time to time last year, he wasn't nearly as bad as Fulton. It was Fulton, not Jones, who was being consistently burned by the Texas A&M receivers in that game.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 8:23 pm to CapstoneGrad06
quote:
Marquis Johnson was awful his first three years at corner but became a solid CB by his senior year. Does anyone remember him have five defended passes in that 2009 South Carolina game?
Yep. Spurrier was hellbent on completing that fade route against him.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 8:42 pm to BamaDude06
quote:
Does anyone remember him have five defended passes in that 2009 South Carolina game?
i was there and sitting in the endzone where about 3 of those passes were thrown. it was awesome. iirc, thats the same game where Mark Ingram got in the wildcat and ran all over them for like 200 yds.
Cyrus had a couple interceptions last year, and he was way way way better than John Fulton.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 8:49 pm to SECSolomonGrundy
You remember correctly. That game launched Ingram's Heisman campaign.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 9:12 pm to SECSolomonGrundy
I was also at the 2009 Alabama-South Carolina game as a student. What a frustrating game to watch. We ran all over them but could not punch it into the end zone on offense to save our lives.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 9:45 pm to RollTide1987
This board has helped me realize that only a small few on here have played pass the high school level or understand the game. Cyrus Jones will be O.K and will prove a lot of people wrong who have dogged him. It's very hard to transition as a Corner in a system like Coach Saban has. It involves a lot of hand check placement, understanding "drop" depth and making reads on the go. It's not a plug and play system like the one LSU and Florida have were the coaches let those guys play man and just be athletes. I actually think in 2014 we will see a rotation of corners because Tony, Eddie, Marlon, Cyrus, Bradley, and Mo all bring something special to the table that will overcome most mismatches that any O.C can think of. .
Posted on 3/19/14 at 9:54 pm to 251_Dreaux
That is a good point you bring up especially with LSU, the corndogs would never admit that Chavis was a problem we could exploit before 21-0
Posted on 3/19/14 at 10:37 pm to 251_Dreaux
Those who think that I am being too harsh with Cyrus Jones use game film to prove me wrong. List specific examples of his play that show he made progress throughout the year last year. Show me what he does right, and why I should believe that he's the best option for us at cornerback next year.
I want every player that goes through Bama to be successful, but realistically some of them don't achieve in football. John Fulton would be a prime example.
I want every player that goes through Bama to be successful, but realistically some of them don't achieve in football. John Fulton would be a prime example.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 11:09 pm to chattabama
quote:
Those who think that I am being too harsh with Cyrus Jones use game film to prove me wrong. List specific examples of his play that show he made progress throughout the year last year. Show me what he does right, and why I should believe that he's the best option for us at cornerback next year.
Chattabama, you have every right to be harsh, but we have to look at the unit as a whole group. Brown and Saban put on the grass a "non-Bama" standard of defensive backfield play that we have grown to expect under his watch. Trust me, as a former college ball player, CB is one of the hardest positions to play and learn when you have to play with some form of discipline. I'm not kissing Cyrus a$$ but we have to look and examine that 1.) This was his first year and to be tied with the team lead for INTs is decent 2.) He is still learning 3.) He is doing something right or showing some type of potential for Saban to play him and keep him at CB instead of moving him back to WR or asking him to transfer. All I'm saying, The kid can play. Be patient and I promise that he will make some big plays in 2014.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 11:09 pm to chattabama
Cyrus Jones will be drafted in the first four rounds of the NFL draft at corner. Every corner under Saban has taken a step up his second year. Cyrus did improve throughout the year. Still had struggles, yes, but its a tough defense to learn, and its hard to play on an island 50% of the time with no exp. Cyrus has decent size, good speed, and decent instincts. As well as good hips, strength, and burst. He will be fine and I'm glad he will be starting at corner over a freshmen or a sophomore who only played in 4 games.
Not worth the time. He did improve.
quote:
Those who think that I am being too harsh with Cyrus Jones use game film to prove me wrong.
Not worth the time. He did improve.
Posted on 3/19/14 at 11:21 pm to chattabama
quote:
List specific examples of his play that show he made progress throughout the year last year.
UA vs. Ark
Saban and Smart seemed pretty damn happy with him on this play.
here's a quote from the al.com and saban about that play.
quote:
On one particular play, Jones didn't play with the proper technique and ultimately surrendered a catch in his neighborhood of responsibility. He was promptly coached up on the sidelines about his mistake and pushed back into action.
When the ball came his way the next time, Jones did what he was told and picked up his second interception of the season. It was one of three turnovers Alabama forced against the Razorbacks.
"I always feel good with a guy when they respond and do it the correct way," Saban said.
that shows progress
quote:
Show me what he does right
you'll see in the video that he has good speed, hands, and body control. most of those are WR qualities, which should come as no surprise because he'd been a receiver. but he also has good lateral quickness and closing speed, which is why they moved him to corner.
quote:
why I should believe that he's the best option for us at cornerback next year.
he's not. but his experience in the system makes him a viable option for us. we have other guys behind him who probably have a better combo of size and speed, but those guys are gonna go through the some of the same struggles that Jones did when he started out. If the guys like Mo Smith and Slyve or J.Washington and Averett weren't having the same problems last year, then they would have been playing over Jones. But for now, he's further along than those guys. That doesnt mean any of them suck. It's just a hard position to play and a hard system to learn. They were all very young players in their first year playing CB for Saban and they will all benefit by improving their technique and understanding of the playbook. Why we would have coaches if they arent helping the players improve?
quote:
John Fulton would be a prime example.
We're not talking about Jon Fulton who didnt crack the starting lineup until his fourth year. We're talking about a guy who was in his first year at corner.
Posted on 3/20/14 at 12:08 am to SECSolomonGrundy
quote:
UA vs. Ark
He made a good play. No doubt. Just like he made a good play in the ATM game. If it was true progress though, why wasn't it maintained? The story of Cyrus Jones last year was two steps forward, and one step back. Again that doesn't make me feel optimistic about this year. Any progress he may have made was negated by the AU game, as proven by him losing his starting job for the Sugar Bowl.
quote:
he's not. but his experience in the system makes him a viable option for us.
I can understand this. Subpar play is experience nonetheless.
quote:
Why we would have coaches if they arent helping the players improve?
He could improve next year, but I have my reservations. He certainly can't do much worse than he did last year. He would have to improve a lot to be on par with what we have come to expect from the Bama secondary. That is what scares me the most. With what little experience we have returning in the secondary it is very possible that we could be worse than we were last year.
Posted on 3/20/14 at 12:24 am to chattabama
quote:
He certainly can't do much worse than he did last year
he could go Jon Fulton on us.
but i cant think of many other corners who earned playing time and didn't improve under Saban
This post was edited on 3/20/14 at 12:25 am
Posted on 3/20/14 at 6:59 am to SECSolomonGrundy
I defended Marquis Johnson and Dee Milliner from the beginning. And I'll defend Cyrus Jones too.
He was playing a new position on perhaps the worst defense Saban has fielded. It's not like he was being helped out by the rest of the team a lot. Despite being a little undersized, and having only 1 year at CB, he's competing well with all those 5* guys you people are so eager to see.
Personally, I don't want to see two brand new CB's out there. That would be a disaster. And if you'll notice, each year, Saban tries to have at least one CB starting that has some experience. We need that.
He was playing a new position on perhaps the worst defense Saban has fielded. It's not like he was being helped out by the rest of the team a lot. Despite being a little undersized, and having only 1 year at CB, he's competing well with all those 5* guys you people are so eager to see.
Personally, I don't want to see two brand new CB's out there. That would be a disaster. And if you'll notice, each year, Saban tries to have at least one CB starting that has some experience. We need that.
Posted on 3/20/14 at 7:20 am to Teague
I've defended our first year corners. I did it on the basis that it is a hard transition and first year guys usually struggle, but I also did it because I saw steady improvement throughout the season and I saw flashes of good play.
I've seen some signs of good play in Cyrus Jones, but what I didn't see was a steady and maintained improvement, and most of his big plays (not all) weren't as a result of good corner play.
As Nick Saban himself has said, "A WR won't catch the ball, but the Corner would have bad coverage. He got lucky. And that Corner is jumping around happy like he did something right."
Weren't his exact words, but he said that with maybe slightly different words or in a different order. The point is obvious though. A good play doesn't always mean you did your job.
I've seen some signs of good play in Cyrus Jones, but what I didn't see was a steady and maintained improvement, and most of his big plays (not all) weren't as a result of good corner play.
As Nick Saban himself has said, "A WR won't catch the ball, but the Corner would have bad coverage. He got lucky. And that Corner is jumping around happy like he did something right."
Weren't his exact words, but he said that with maybe slightly different words or in a different order. The point is obvious though. A good play doesn't always mean you did your job.
Posted on 3/20/14 at 7:39 am to AllBamaDoesIsWin
So is anyone going to post anything about practice or is this going to continue to be a Cy.Jones bitch fest?
Posted on 3/20/14 at 7:43 am to Bamad
Well no one is bitching, but on top of that it is 7:42 in the morning and nothing to report right now.
Posted on 3/20/14 at 7:43 am to AllBamaDoesIsWin
I am not going to bash the kid to no end but I saw nothing from Jones last fall to get me excited about him this coming fall. And I could care less what a kid does in spring camp, because until they get in a game nothing matters. Just like all these high rated recruits that out perform at all star combines it doe snot always translate over to the game.
IMO Jones was not the worst DB we had last year, it was Belue who made me cringe every time they threw the ball his direction. Jones at least had the excuse just learning where Belue just never could figure it out.
Under Saban we have been lucky that he can turn an athlete into a playable CB but I am just not sold on Jones. Maybe this fall he will surprise us but I also would not be surprised to see Jackson and Brown take over. Jones in my opinion is no lock and will be battling for playing time.
I hope he does well, but in the end I just hope the best 2 are out there.
IMO Jones was not the worst DB we had last year, it was Belue who made me cringe every time they threw the ball his direction. Jones at least had the excuse just learning where Belue just never could figure it out.
Under Saban we have been lucky that he can turn an athlete into a playable CB but I am just not sold on Jones. Maybe this fall he will surprise us but I also would not be surprised to see Jackson and Brown take over. Jones in my opinion is no lock and will be battling for playing time.
I hope he does well, but in the end I just hope the best 2 are out there.
Posted on 3/20/14 at 8:25 am to TideWarrior
I agree with Warrior, I want the two best out there and if that means benching Cyrus that is fine.
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