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re: Way Too Early 2021 KenPom and T Rank Rankings for SEC Basketball; 5 SEC Teams in Top 25
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:16 pm to sand mountainDvalues
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:16 pm to sand mountainDvalues
quote:
Lol Pearl is the best coach in this conference and could easily make the tournament w/o landing Green
Pearl missed the tournament the first 3 years he was at Auburn, just stop. He's not some saint that always wins regardless of the circumstances, he basically has had a total roster turnover and no experience left from the last 2 years now. Not many coaches could do well in that situation. He still needs players to win and proved that his first few years there.
He literally doesnt have a single player left on this roster from the 2017-2018 classes, except 1 transfer who sat out in 2018-19 and did next to nothing this season as a 3rd year sophomore. Form his 2019 class he returns 0 Top 100 talent, and nobody had a notable season as a freshman who is returning (this doesnt mean some wont improve, just means it's unlikely someone stands out in a big way in year 2 though as well). His team right now will be ridiculously young next season and he's not trotting out a Calipari-esque talent lineup of 6-7 5-stars. He really needs to hit up the transfer market to get a few experienced players in there.
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 12:18 pm
2
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:20 pm to thunderbird1100
quote:
Pearl missed the tournament the first 3 years he was at Auburn, just stop
Did you just start following basketball the last 2 years?
Do you have any idea how awful Auburn was when he got there? Do you realize he was not even allowed to recruit for his first signing period?
His success so far has been from grit and from piecing together rosters. His best years are ahead of him.
Including next year. It’s the last year where he is not a lock for a top 15 team every season.
I still think he makes the tourney next year.
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:23 pm to thunderbird1100
Jaylin Williams should be good. Started showing flashes late. Flanagan didn't shoot well, but his best game was the last one of the year and he actually had more starts than anyone else mentioned so far and he hasn't even been brought up. This whole argument is pointless right now because Pearl isn't done adding players. There are most likely going to be 3 or more players added that we don't even know about yet.
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 12:29 pm
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:24 pm to thunderbird1100
Don't want to start another thread for power rankings
1. Kentucky -- Top 3 seed
2. Tennessee -- Top 5 seed
3. Arkansas -- Top 5 seed (assuming Jones and Joe both back)
4. Florida -- Top 7 seed
5. LSU -- Top 9 seed (assuming Smart and Williams both gone)
6. South Carolina -- bubble
7. Missouri -- bubble
8. Mississippi State -- NIT (assuming Woodard back, Perry gone)
9. Auburn -- NIT (assuming Green)
10. Texas A&M -- NIT fringe
11. Alabama -- NIT fringe (assuming Kira and Petty both gone)
12. Ole Miss -- no postseason
13. Vanderbilt -- no postseason
14. Georgia -- no postseason
1. Kentucky -- Top 3 seed
2. Tennessee -- Top 5 seed
3. Arkansas -- Top 5 seed (assuming Jones and Joe both back)
4. Florida -- Top 7 seed
5. LSU -- Top 9 seed (assuming Smart and Williams both gone)
6. South Carolina -- bubble
7. Missouri -- bubble
8. Mississippi State -- NIT (assuming Woodard back, Perry gone)
9. Auburn -- NIT (assuming Green)
10. Texas A&M -- NIT fringe
11. Alabama -- NIT fringe (assuming Kira and Petty both gone)
12. Ole Miss -- no postseason
13. Vanderbilt -- no postseason
14. Georgia -- no postseason
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:25 pm to SECdragonmaster
quote:It's insane that people can act this question and then expect that a team who just lost its top six players can make the tournament the next season without elite talent.
Did you just start following basketball the last 2 years?
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:34 pm to SECdragonmaster
quote:
Did you just start following basketball the last 2 years?
No been following for a few decades. My response was to someone acting like "it doesnt matter what Pearl has, he will always be in the tournament hunt"
Well guess what, he wasn't for not 1, not 2, but his first THREE years at Auburn. He is not someone immune to missing the tournament at all. He still needs players.
quote:
Do you have any idea how awful Auburn was when he got there?
14-16, 6-12 the year before he got there (hardly the worst ever or anything of that imagination), and again took 4 seasons to finally make the tournament after that. So he had to build a roster for 4 years to finally have one he could take dancing. When Wade got to LSU he took over a 10-21, 2-16 SEC team and not only was in the tournament by year 2 but won the conference going 28-7 and 16-2 SEC. So sorry, not really buying the Pearl is a mastermind and never can lose theory. He needs players, players he finally got by years 4,5,6. All those players are pretty much gone now, and he's going to be dealt a roster full of freshmen and sophomores this upcoming season. Do you understand how that's basically uncharted territory for him in all his time there? Not a single former Top 100 player who wont be a freshman as of right now. Zero seniors right now. Maybe 1 junior who will contribute much of anything right now.
quote:
His success so far has been from grit and from piecing together rosters
You mean finally getting good/talented players in over time and tje experience to boot. He didnt do jack his first 3 years there. Again, he took a long time to build a roster he could even take to the tournament. Now almost everyone off those rosters that did anything are long gone and he's relying on a super young group to do the same now. As it stands that roster isn't looking like a NCAAT one bit. Adding Green can help a lot there, but still, I wouldn't thing without adding a few experienced pieces how Pearl will take a team that young/inexperienced dancing. Really needs to land a grad transfer or two that's notable to lead these guys.
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 12:37 pm
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:34 pm to GatorsGators
quote:
5. LSU -- Top 9 seed (assuming Smart and Williams both gone)
Smart isn't leaving
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:37 pm to thunderbird1100
quote:
14-16, 6-12 the year before he got there (hardly the worst ever or anything of that imagination)
Go look at what Bruce inherited from Barbee's last team. Only if it were this cut and dry.
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:37 pm to GatorsGators
quote:
It's insane that people can act this question and then expect that a team who just lost its top six players can make the tournament the next season without elite talent.
VOLS essentially lost their top 6 from last year and would’ve strolled to the tournament had Barnes done Any recruiting the past 3 classes.
Bruce has done a much better job retooling their roster
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:39 pm to Smoke7024
quote:
Go look at what Bruce inherited from Barbee's last team. Only if it were this cut and dry.
I never said he inherited some great team so not sure why it matters. Again, it took him FOUR YEARS to build a roster decent enough to make the tournament, what does that tell you? He can just easily win in any circumstance? Give him just a couple talented freshmen and a few sophomores who werent even noteworthy as freshmen and no way he cant win easily? come on now
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 12:40 pm
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:43 pm to thunderbird1100
It matters because this base even though inexperienced is much better than what he started with when he got to Auburn. I wouldn't necessarily use that as a gauge to how long it takes to rebuild. There will be some growing pains for sure and I'm not even saying that Auburn will make the tourney, but I want to see a completed roster before I'm jumping to conclusions.
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:44 pm to sand mountainDvalues
quote:
Bruce has done a much better job retooling their roster
Exactly how? He doesnt have a single player left from his 2017 or 2018 classes on the roster for next season except a transfer who in his 3rd college year put up 3.5 points a game and was completely forgettable.
I mean as of now he's literally relying on his huge group of freshmen from last year, none of which were former Top 100 recruits and none of which did much as freshmen, to suddenly take huge leaps from multiple guys to replace some talented and experienced guys from previous years? Then a group of incoming freshmen as of now only 1 of which is a Top 100 player, which likely it will be 2, but again, we're talking about Auburn losing what, 11 or so contributors from their team the last 2 years, many of which were juniors/seniors, and replacing them with some upcoming sophomores who havent shown much and a group of freshmen....doesn't exaclty seem like a recipe for success at the moment.
We will see how he finishes out his last few spots though. I think it's a tourney team if he lands Green and some notable transfers personally.
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:49 pm to Smoke7024
quote:
It matters because this base even though inexperienced is much better than what he started with when he got to Auburn. I wouldn't necessarily use that as a gauge to how long it takes to rebuild. There will be some growing pains for sure and I'm not even saying that Auburn will make the tourney, but I want to see a completed roster before I'm jumping to conclusions.
Is it way better? How do we know it's even really any better than what he had in year 3 when he had a trio of talented freshmen, to go along with a pair of decent seniors (1 being former top JUCO recruit, another a transfer), to go along with a talented pair of 2nd year guys...and failed to make the tournament.
Adding Green is a step in a very good direction, but I still dont think that's unquestionably a NCAAT team for sure. Think he needs to add a few decent transfers still.
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 12:54 pm
Posted on 3/17/20 at 12:55 pm to thunderbird1100
quote:
Is it way better?
Yeah, considering he really only inherited one playable guy from Barbee.
quote:
How do we know it's even really any better than what he had in year 3 when he had a trio of talented freshmen, to go along with a pair of decent seniors (1 being former top JUCO recruit, another a transfer), to go along with a talented pair of 2nd year guys...and failed to make the tournament.
We don't for sure, especially since the roster isn't done.
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 12:56 pm
Posted on 3/17/20 at 1:01 pm to sand mountainDvalues
quote:You guys did return two four-year starterish players in Bowden and Turner (I know) and a few bit players who had been in the system forever like Fulkerson and Pons
VOLS essentially lost their top 6 from last year and would’ve strolled to the tournament had Barnes done Any recruiting the past 3 classes.
Bruce has done a much better job retooling their roster
Auburn next year, besides Jamal Johnson, will be exclusively freshmen and sophomores who barely played this season
I'd say Auburn's turnover going into next season dwarfs Tennessee's this past season
Posted on 3/17/20 at 3:21 pm to GatorsGators
quote:
We're aware of Tyrell Williams, Akingbola, and the other freshmen who didn't play this season that you'll be counting on next season.
quote:
Tyrell Williams
Who?
quote:
Auburn next year, besides Jamal Johnson, will be exclusively freshmen and sophomores who barely played this season
Omg, this is such a stupid argument at this point in time. Auburn will sign AT LEAST 3 more players in this upcoming class. It is too early to even know who will or won’t be on our roster next season and how experienced or inexperienced we will be.
Posted on 3/17/20 at 3:28 pm to TigerProwl24
Tyrell Jones, you know I didn't mean the WR
Even if you manage to sign a decent grad transfer, that player was not in the program last season.
Continuity is the name of the game in college basketball. It's incredible that Auburn's been able to have big success the past three seasons due in large part to having upperclassmen who had been in the program for years and yet this point is being contested
quote:Notice the word I've been using -- "turnover."
Omg, this is such a stupid argument at this point in time. Auburn will sign AT LEAST 3 more players in this upcoming class. It is too early to even know who will or won’t be on our roster next season and how experienced or inexperienced we will be.
Even if you manage to sign a decent grad transfer, that player was not in the program last season.
Continuity is the name of the game in college basketball. It's incredible that Auburn's been able to have big success the past three seasons due in large part to having upperclassmen who had been in the program for years and yet this point is being contested
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 3:29 pm
Posted on 3/17/20 at 7:03 pm to GatorsGators
If Auburn lands Green they will likely be around an 9-10 seed for the NCAAT. 19-20ish wins. Any better than that and Bruce goes from a top 20 coach to a top 5 coach in the country.
Posted on 3/17/20 at 10:08 pm to GatorsGators
quote:I don’t know what you meant, only what you said. We don’t have a WR named Tyrell Williams and we have two freshmen on our roster in Tyrell Jones and Jaylin Williams. It could’ve meant you don’t know as much about our players as you thought.
Tyrell Jones, not Williams, you know I didn't mean the WR
quote:There is a TON of turnover every year in college basketball. Some teams replace less talented players with more talented players. Turnover isn’t always a bad thing.
Notice the word I've been using -- "turnover.”
quote:If you haven’t noticed, Auburn is recruiting at an ALL-TIME level at the moment and signing players we wouldn’t have been in the conversation with years ago.
Even if you manage to sign a decent grad transfer, that player was not in the program last season.
quote:
Continuity is the name of the game in college basketball.
Elite talent and experience, not continuity, is the name of the game in college basketball. It’s not like Pearl runs a complicated system.
quote:Heron(transferred out), Murray(transferred in), Murray(transferred out), Dunbar(JUCO), McCormick(JUCO), Wiley(suspended), Purifoy(suspended), Harper(declared early), Okeke(declared early), Mitchell(transferred out), Johnson(transferred in), Doughty(transferred in) in the last three years, all either starting or having meaningful minutes.
It's incredible that Auburn's been able to have big success the past three seasons due in large part to having upperclassmen who had been in the program for years and yet this point is being contested
Yes, if we went into the season next year with only our returning roster from this year, we probably wouldn’t make the NCAAT.. but with our incoming class and at least 3 more spots available in it, how about we wait and see what the roster actually looks like next year before we make any proclamations.
This post was edited on 3/17/20 at 10:15 pm
Posted on 3/18/20 at 7:05 am to TigerProwl24
quote:Your 2019 class had one Top 100 player in it (Okoro, who will be in the NBA next year), and your 2020 class currently has one as well (Cooper). The 2017 and 2018 classes are gone. That might be "all-time" level for Auburn, but several SEC programs have been out-recruiting Pearl the past several years.
If you haven’t noticed, Auburn is recruiting at an ALL-TIME level at the moment and signing players we wouldn’t have been in the conversation with years ago.
You don't have elite talent on next year's roster. Green would be one elite player. Cooper will be very good but to say he'll be elite as a freshman might be a stretch. No one else -- Jones, Williams, Cambridge, Moore, Powell -- is elite.
Compare it to UF's roster -- Nembhard (5*, three-year starter), Appleby (standout transfer), Locke (Top 100, three-year starter), Mann (5*), Lewis (Top 10 player), Duruji (standout transfer), Ruzhentsev (Top 50), Johnson (Top 100, three-year starter), Payne (Top 50)
Your talent doesn't scare anyone and you're returning less production than anyone in the conference. Pearl is a coach, not a miracle worker. It's best to lower your expectations now. Just trying to help you out.
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