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re: I need to let it all out
Posted on 12/20/17 at 8:57 am to JesusQuintana
Posted on 12/20/17 at 8:57 am to JesusQuintana
quote:
Does the coach matter
Those 6 4*s will say yes.
They aren’t paying Mullen millions of dollars to not recruit.
0
Posted on 12/20/17 at 12:32 pm to JesusQuintana
Dan Mullen is a better coach than Mac so your point is totally moot.
Posted on 12/20/17 at 9:33 pm to navynuke
Brown signed with Ohio St.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 1:33 am to JesusQuintana
Again, the fact is that shite schools like State, Kentucky, USCjr, and Ole Piss out-recruit or recruit at the same level as Mizzou. That is absolutely ridiculous. Mizzou is a better brand than every single one of those schools and has 10x the success and history of any of those schools the last decade and it isn’t even close. Mizzou probably has better overall history than every one when you discount an Ole Piss title pre civil rights era.
All in all, you think Mizzou is a shite tier football program. No one thinks we should out recruit Florida. Some of us just think beating Kentucky and out recruiting Kentucky on a yearly basis is to be expected. Pretty pathetic you think otherwise.
All in all, you think Mizzou is a shite tier football program. No one thinks we should out recruit Florida. Some of us just think beating Kentucky and out recruiting Kentucky on a yearly basis is to be expected. Pretty pathetic you think otherwise.
This post was edited on 12/21/17 at 1:35 am
Posted on 12/21/17 at 7:23 am to ZOU
So...those schools "out recruit" us but according to you we've had 10X the success recently?
So do they really "out recruit" us?
So do they really "out recruit" us?
Posted on 12/21/17 at 8:30 am to ZOU
You nailed it zou
Just a continuation of paid pump spin and circle talk.
All most are saying is. If we want to compete year after year recruiting needs to improve... As does in state recruiting.
That's not an attack on anyone.... Just an opinion shared by many.
quote:
All in all, you think Mizzou is a shite tier football program. No one thinks we should out recruit Florida. Some of us just think beating Kentucky and out recruiting Kentucky on a yearly basis is to be expected. Pretty pathetic you think otherwise.
Just a continuation of paid pump spin and circle talk.
All most are saying is. If we want to compete year after year recruiting needs to improve... As does in state recruiting.
That's not an attack on anyone.... Just an opinion shared by many.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 12:02 pm to SemperFi
quote:
paid pump spin
One of the Olde Un's top sellers.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 12:37 pm to SemperFi
All I have to say is that if you don’t think Mizzou CAN and SHOULD recruit better given the later half success Pinkel has had, you’re either deluding yourself or you’re just perfectly content.
The Daniel years had us in the top 15 frequently and as high as #1. The Gabbert years had us top 20 and top 10. The Franklin and pre-Mauk derailment saw 2 East titles and a better defensive strategy away from playing in the NCCG.
Whether we’ve had more success than UK on the field is moot.
We should be fricking recruiting better than we are and damned sure better than UK, USC, Vandy, etc.
We should at least be top 30 every year and every now and then hitting the top 25.
The Daniel years had us in the top 15 frequently and as high as #1. The Gabbert years had us top 20 and top 10. The Franklin and pre-Mauk derailment saw 2 East titles and a better defensive strategy away from playing in the NCCG.
Whether we’ve had more success than UK on the field is moot.
We should be fricking recruiting better than we are and damned sure better than UK, USC, Vandy, etc.
We should at least be top 30 every year and every now and then hitting the top 25.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 12:42 pm to Athos
quote:
Whether we’ve had more success than UK on the field is moot.
quote:
We should be fricking recruiting better than we are and damned sure better than UK
This does not compute. How do we have more on the field success without recruiting better?
Some really weird twists you guys insist on wrapping yourselves in.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 1:08 pm to JesusQuintana
Was it just the players or we totally excluding coaching? I think you need both.
But anwer the question. Do you believe MU can and should recruit better than they have given successes built from 2007 to 2014?
But anwer the question. Do you believe MU can and should recruit better than they have given successes built from 2007 to 2014?
Posted on 12/21/17 at 1:33 pm to Athos
Based on star rating? Incrementally sure, but then you get into the debate of is 28 REALLY better than 36. Which, maybe it is maybe it isn't. Way too much guess work involved in the prospects that compose the majority of these types of classes. Your Kentucky example fits nicely.
Then you also have the question of we're we actually recruiting better than the rankings suggested in that time period. On field results and the NFL draft say, emphatically, yes.
Dramatic/dynamic shift? No. It just doesn't happen. Schools, more or less, recruit how they recruit in general terms anyway. We aren't changing our history over night and our proximity to talent will never change. The two things that we can positively change in the near future are facilities and fan support. Facility improvements are on the way, but even then we are simply playing catch up. Hopefully one day we will have the type of fanbase that demands success, not on message boards, but through asses in the seats and checks in the bank. It's just a wildly difficult hill to climb.
Again though, we can have success in our relative lot in the recruiting landscape. Identify and develop. These are our keys.
Then you also have the question of we're we actually recruiting better than the rankings suggested in that time period. On field results and the NFL draft say, emphatically, yes.
Dramatic/dynamic shift? No. It just doesn't happen. Schools, more or less, recruit how they recruit in general terms anyway. We aren't changing our history over night and our proximity to talent will never change. The two things that we can positively change in the near future are facilities and fan support. Facility improvements are on the way, but even then we are simply playing catch up. Hopefully one day we will have the type of fanbase that demands success, not on message boards, but through asses in the seats and checks in the bank. It's just a wildly difficult hill to climb.
Again though, we can have success in our relative lot in the recruiting landscape. Identify and develop. These are our keys.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 1:51 pm to Mizzou59
Here’s my extended rant if y’all wanna hear it:
It just feels like we haven’t made any effort to recruit any 4 star guys since we had the Missouri 10 visit earlier this year (remember that lol).
We’re sitting out here basically BEGGING for a mid-level 3 star TE in Messiah Swinson. He’ll probably be a fine collegiate athlete and will be successful wherever he goes, but he’s a program guy and not a program changer. Do you think any other team in the SEC is begging for mid-level 3 stars that aren’t even in-state? Not to mention he plays a position we’re incredibly deep at.
Meanwhile I look on my twitter feed and see four star after four star either decommit or leave us out of their “top ___”. Then I have to watch the pathetic press box super friends try to find the silver lining, then try to get us excited that we flipped a fricking 2* RB from Tulane.
And I don’t mind the fact that our staff has their own system of evaluation and stuff but can we stop being so lame about it? I distinctly remember listening to a podcast from Rock M Nation (forgot what it was called) and they were interviewing one of the press box super friends around NSD. They were saying that the staff basically lost their shite when Kobie Whiteside committed to us. They said the staff had him rated as the #2 player in the country. HE WAS A FRICKING 2* WITH NO OTHER POWER 5 OFFERS! Meanwhile we just sit back and watch about every instate recruit just stiff arm us and head off to Oklahoma/Illinois/K-State or whatever. He did play more than other 2* true freshmen across the country, but he’s not going to be the type of guy that gets us to a 10 win season.
I’m so tired of this shite. I feel like there has simply not been any sense of urgency to get our program back to what it was in pre-2015. Where are all the guys who care about this team? Half of our fan base has simply quit caring since the protests (which is no longer a viable excuse). We don’t attend games, we don’t watch our games on TV, we don’t demand a better product. It’s laughable that a state with one FBS program, let alone it being in the SEC, gets a once in a lifetime class full of guys who grew up as fans of that team and we don’t even know what to do with them. How many of those kids didn’t even include us in their top five? Are we just supposed to accept it and watch our team wither away into the cellar of the SEC?
I’m one of the unlucky bastards who’s freshman year was marked by the protests and I’ll be damned if this team is settling for this level of shittyness when I graduate!
It just feels like we haven’t made any effort to recruit any 4 star guys since we had the Missouri 10 visit earlier this year (remember that lol).
We’re sitting out here basically BEGGING for a mid-level 3 star TE in Messiah Swinson. He’ll probably be a fine collegiate athlete and will be successful wherever he goes, but he’s a program guy and not a program changer. Do you think any other team in the SEC is begging for mid-level 3 stars that aren’t even in-state? Not to mention he plays a position we’re incredibly deep at.
Meanwhile I look on my twitter feed and see four star after four star either decommit or leave us out of their “top ___”. Then I have to watch the pathetic press box super friends try to find the silver lining, then try to get us excited that we flipped a fricking 2* RB from Tulane.
And I don’t mind the fact that our staff has their own system of evaluation and stuff but can we stop being so lame about it? I distinctly remember listening to a podcast from Rock M Nation (forgot what it was called) and they were interviewing one of the press box super friends around NSD. They were saying that the staff basically lost their shite when Kobie Whiteside committed to us. They said the staff had him rated as the #2 player in the country. HE WAS A FRICKING 2* WITH NO OTHER POWER 5 OFFERS! Meanwhile we just sit back and watch about every instate recruit just stiff arm us and head off to Oklahoma/Illinois/K-State or whatever. He did play more than other 2* true freshmen across the country, but he’s not going to be the type of guy that gets us to a 10 win season.
I’m so tired of this shite. I feel like there has simply not been any sense of urgency to get our program back to what it was in pre-2015. Where are all the guys who care about this team? Half of our fan base has simply quit caring since the protests (which is no longer a viable excuse). We don’t attend games, we don’t watch our games on TV, we don’t demand a better product. It’s laughable that a state with one FBS program, let alone it being in the SEC, gets a once in a lifetime class full of guys who grew up as fans of that team and we don’t even know what to do with them. How many of those kids didn’t even include us in their top five? Are we just supposed to accept it and watch our team wither away into the cellar of the SEC?
I’m one of the unlucky bastards who’s freshman year was marked by the protests and I’ll be damned if this team is settling for this level of shittyness when I graduate!
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:00 pm to Mizzou59
quote:
It just feels like we haven’t made any effort to recruit any 4 star guys since we had the Missouri 10 visit earlier this year (remember that lol).
What gives you that impression? We recruited all of those guys. At some point you have to give attention to the guys reciprocating. Odom could have spent the last 2 months camped out in Babb's front yard but if he told you he wasn't interested then you are just wasting your time.
quote:
We’re sitting out here basically BEGGING for a mid-level 3 star TE in Messiah Swinson. He’ll probably be a fine collegiate athlete and will be successful wherever he goes, but he’s a program guy and not a program changer. Do you think any other team in the SEC is begging for mid-level 3 stars that aren’t even in-state? Not to mention he plays a position we’re incredibly deep at.
Swinson is one of the top targets left on our board. You can't on one hand bang the staff for not recruiting guys hard enough, then on other bang them for going too hard after a particular guy. Nebraska is after him hard also. BTW. Albert O was a similarly ranked TE. He's ok huh?
quote:
Then I have to watch the pathetic press box super friends try to find the silver lining, then try to get us excited that we flipped a fricking 2* RB from Tulane.
You don't have to get excited about anybody, but that 2* was just named first team all state in 6A Texas ball. Maybe he's underrated?
quote:
They were saying that the staff basically lost their shite when Kobie Whiteside committed to us. They said the staff had him rated as the #2 player in the country. HE WAS A FRICKING 2* WITH NO OTHER POWER 5 OFFERS!
Played well as a true FR and looks to have a nice future? Some say he is the strongest guy on the team. Maybe they were right to be excited?
quote:
Meanwhile we just sit back and watch about every instate recruit just stiff arm us and head off to Oklahoma/Illinois/K-State
OU is a blue blood. Currently in the playoffs. Not sure what sales pitch we use there. Haven't lost any in state guys to Illinois or KState so not sure what you are talking about there. In fact, we haven't lost any instate prospects to any school that wouldn't be considered elite.
quote:
I’m so tired of this shite. I feel like there has simply not been any sense of urgency to get our program back to what it was in pre-2015. Where are all the guys who care about this team? Half of our fan base has simply quit caring since the protests (which is no longer a viable excuse). We don’t attend games, we don’t watch our games on TV, we don’t demand a better product. It’s laughable that a state with one FBS program, let alone it being in the SEC, gets a once in a lifetime class full of guys who grew up as fans of that team and we don’t even know what to do with them. How many of those kids didn’t even include us in their top five? Are we just supposed to accept it and watch our team wither away into the cellar of the SEC?
Cellar of the SEC? Bruh chill. We have the longest P5 winning streak in the nation. Fixing to extend that in a few days. The pre 2015 days you pine for were not built on the back of elite recruiting classes. They were built by identification and development. Our next period of success will be built the same way. The sky is still intact. BO will get the job done. Or he won't and we'll hire someone else.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:01 pm to Mizzou59
I honestly think that Kobie Whiteside was underrated because of his height and that he will be a good one before it's all said and done. Ruth and the 2* rb that we flipped from Tulane just made 1st team all-state in 6A in Texas and that's all fine and dandy. We still need a decent amount of high-skilled players to mix in with all our under-the-radar recruits.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:09 pm to JesusQuintana
quote:
So do they really "out recruit" us?
Kentucky's top 25 classes has beaten us the last two years.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:13 pm to Zou brownmajic
quote:
We still need a decent amount of high-skilled players to mix in with all our under-the-radar recruits.
Agreed.
I love identifying talent and seeing that young player blossom to a top tier player for MIzzou. I also recognize if we are playing for championships, something our head coach reiterates to the media and his players, the data tells us we have no shot without upgrading talent.
Our own coach has stated if we are keeping score then I want to win, when it comes to recruiting. We sell star ratings in our media guides, visibility on ESPN revolves around top tier players, stars matters.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:27 pm to countrygrammar
BY ALEX SCHIFFER
aschiffer@kcstar.com
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DECEMBER 20, 2017 10:59 AM
UPDATED DECEMBER 20, 2017 06:35 PM
Diamonds in the rough
Since he’s been on the job, Odom has taken one out of former coach Gary Pinkel’s book by signing under-recruited players and turning them into stars. Odom has already done that in freshman running back Larry Rountree, who chose Mizzou over FCS schools and kept the trend going in 2018. Missouri flipped Javon Foster, a 6-foot-6 offensive lineman, from Central Michigan and running back Simi Bakare from Tulane. Gicinto is a player that had a breakout senior year and was on the radar of a few top schools, but Odom got his commitment before those programs could turn into threats. Vincent Gray was another find for the program but was offered on Monday by Michigan, his in-state school. He’s now waiting until February to sign.
The Tiger 1(0)?
When Missouri hosted all 10 highly touted in-state prospects in the spring, many thought the program would be able to have a highly ranked class without having to leave Interstate 70. Well, that didn’t happen. The Tigers appeared to lose interest in some of those prospects and others dropped out during the 1-5 start. Blue Springs defensive end Daniel Parker Jr. is currently the lone member of the “Tiger 10” to sign. The Tigers made a late run for St. Louis defensive end Ronnie Perkins, the brother of Missouri safety Ronnell Perkins, but he stuck with Oklahoma. Missouri could still add another defensive lineman out of St. Louis in Michael Thompson, but he isn’t expected to announce until February. Missouri is considered the favorite for Thompson’s services.
aschiffer@kcstar.com
GOOGLE+
ORDER REPRINT OF THIS STORY
DECEMBER 20, 2017 10:59 AM
UPDATED DECEMBER 20, 2017 06:35 PM
Diamonds in the rough
Since he’s been on the job, Odom has taken one out of former coach Gary Pinkel’s book by signing under-recruited players and turning them into stars. Odom has already done that in freshman running back Larry Rountree, who chose Mizzou over FCS schools and kept the trend going in 2018. Missouri flipped Javon Foster, a 6-foot-6 offensive lineman, from Central Michigan and running back Simi Bakare from Tulane. Gicinto is a player that had a breakout senior year and was on the radar of a few top schools, but Odom got his commitment before those programs could turn into threats. Vincent Gray was another find for the program but was offered on Monday by Michigan, his in-state school. He’s now waiting until February to sign.
The Tiger 1(0)?
When Missouri hosted all 10 highly touted in-state prospects in the spring, many thought the program would be able to have a highly ranked class without having to leave Interstate 70. Well, that didn’t happen. The Tigers appeared to lose interest in some of those prospects and others dropped out during the 1-5 start. Blue Springs defensive end Daniel Parker Jr. is currently the lone member of the “Tiger 10” to sign. The Tigers made a late run for St. Louis defensive end Ronnie Perkins, the brother of Missouri safety Ronnell Perkins, but he stuck with Oklahoma. Missouri could still add another defensive lineman out of St. Louis in Michael Thompson, but he isn’t expected to announce until February. Missouri is considered the favorite for Thompson’s services.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:43 pm to countrygrammar
Exactly. Typically, the higher rated guys are higher rated by virtue of either being true game changers or are physically and mentally more prepared earlier than the 2 and 3s. The Pinkel model is fine but it takes superior coaching and time to turn those guys into the NFL talents we’ve put into the league.
You need balance and there isn’t balance right now. We DO need 4* game changers. I’m not saying 5-10 guys but at the very least, 3-5 doesn’t seem unreasonable.
You need balance and there isn’t balance right now. We DO need 4* game changers. I’m not saying 5-10 guys but at the very least, 3-5 doesn’t seem unreasonable.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 3:45 pm to countrygrammar
quote:
quote:
So do they really "out recruit" us?
Kentucky's top 25 classes has beaten us the last two years.
Ok, but the argument prior in this thread was that we have had more success than UK recently so we should be out recruiting them. So which is it? 10 years? 2 years? Let's establish some sort of baseline here so we are jumping all over the place constantly.
We sucked in 16. For a myriad of reasons, but we were really bad.
Kind of feel like we got hosed this past year, but they still beat us.
We are 3-3 against them since entering the league but our highs have definitely been much higher. So should we be out recruiting them? Were we at one point?
Posted on 12/21/17 at 4:27 pm to Athos
quote:
3-5 doesn’t seem unreasonable.
Mizzou is 1 4 star away from having 3 4 star recruits. There’s another 6-7 high 3 stars.
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