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I'm gonna get a lot of flak for asking, but is DVH a bad player developer?
Posted on 4/24/22 at 3:28 pm
Posted on 4/24/22 at 3:28 pm
Seems that guys continually come in and don't get much better than their first season on the hill and sometimes even get worse.
Even the guys that were really good didn't necessarily get better, they just stayed good.
Kerstad got better for sure, but he's the exception.
Even the guys that were really good didn't necessarily get better, they just stayed good.
Kerstad got better for sure, but he's the exception.
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Posted on 4/24/22 at 5:18 pm to cubsfan5150
quote:
Kerstad got better for sure, but he's the exception.
Not saying I disagree, but you are forgetting Benintendi as well.
He went from a good college freshman to MLB ready in one years time.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 5:19 pm to cubsfan5150
No
These guys are able to play at a high level and we are a fixture top 10 team. That's not by accident. Just because they don't all hit .569 like they did in HS vs SEC pitching or have 0.01 ERAs doesn't mean they regress.
We have a top 5 team ERA in the country after losing our Friday starter for the year when most thought pitching would be a weakness. I'd call that development
Some guys like Casey Martin get to a peak and once there is a playbook on how to get them out everyone will use it unless and until they overcome it. It's why there aren't many Joey Vottos and Albert Pujols playing 20 years anymore. The game now requires constant reinvention and not every player is capable of that.
These guys are able to play at a high level and we are a fixture top 10 team. That's not by accident. Just because they don't all hit .569 like they did in HS vs SEC pitching or have 0.01 ERAs doesn't mean they regress.
We have a top 5 team ERA in the country after losing our Friday starter for the year when most thought pitching would be a weakness. I'd call that development
Some guys like Casey Martin get to a peak and once there is a playbook on how to get them out everyone will use it unless and until they overcome it. It's why there aren't many Joey Vottos and Albert Pujols playing 20 years anymore. The game now requires constant reinvention and not every player is capable of that.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 5:20 pm to razorbackfan4life
Robert Moore has struggled this year. Out of all the players coming back I wouldn't have expected him to be the one who has struggled the most. His swing looks vastly different, and it isn't working.
Slavens had power last year, but he was an all or nothing guy. I wasn't as shocked to see him struggle early on this year, but thankfully he seems to be turning the corner.
Slavens had power last year, but he was an all or nothing guy. I wasn't as shocked to see him struggle early on this year, but thankfully he seems to be turning the corner.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 5:50 pm to razorbackfan4life
I don't know that it's DVH. I might look to another coach.
Our pitchers, at least more than a few, do seem to progress.
Our hitters, mostly, do not.
We bring in guys who are supposed to be stud offensive powers. For the most part, they don't seem to get better as they go.
Sure, there are exceptions, Benintendi is the one who stands out.
Kjerstad and Martin -- AWESOME players for us -- didn't get better.
I don't know. Seems to me, our guys don't get better offensively after they get here.
I don't put that on DVH.
That said, I wonder a bit about who we are recruiting -- offensively, not pitching-wise. We seem to be on target with pitchers.
Our pitchers, at least more than a few, do seem to progress.
Our hitters, mostly, do not.
We bring in guys who are supposed to be stud offensive powers. For the most part, they don't seem to get better as they go.
Sure, there are exceptions, Benintendi is the one who stands out.
Kjerstad and Martin -- AWESOME players for us -- didn't get better.
I don't know. Seems to me, our guys don't get better offensively after they get here.
I don't put that on DVH.
That said, I wonder a bit about who we are recruiting -- offensively, not pitching-wise. We seem to be on target with pitchers.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 7:26 pm to cubsfan5150
I hope DVh doesn't pull a DeBriyn and stay too long. DVH has earned the right to stay until retirement, but I don't think we will ever win it all with DVH. We are an elite program under DVH and he's elevated it from DeBriyn. I hope that the next coach comes in and elevates things even moreso.
Might not be a popular opinion, but that's my feelings.
Might not be a popular opinion, but that's my feelings.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 7:44 pm to exiledhogfan
when you're a high school All American, you "get worse" when you move to Rookie League because you're not in high school anymore
when you're a bonus baby out of wherever and you get promoted to the majors, you "get worse" because you always truly wondered if you belonged in the majors, and they begin to eat your lunch and you find out
the exceptions are few
when you're a bonus baby out of wherever and you get promoted to the majors, you "get worse" because you always truly wondered if you belonged in the majors, and they begin to eat your lunch and you find out
the exceptions are few
This post was edited on 4/24/22 at 7:45 pm
Posted on 4/24/22 at 8:14 pm to Harry Rex Vonner
When you dominate as a freshman in the SEC, you should get better by your junior year, not worse.
This isn't the majors, you should be able to overcome the opponent's scouting.
This isn't the majors, you should be able to overcome the opponent's scouting.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 8:24 pm to cubsfan5150
I think “development” is a little overrated in sports in general. No coach is going to teach Ben Simmons a jump shot. Most of the time you either have it or you don’t.
Lanzilli was an all-American one year and hit .347 at Wake Forest then .259 two years later. Players all the time in the pros have all-star years then randomly fall of a cliff.
Lanzilli was an all-American one year and hit .347 at Wake Forest then .259 two years later. Players all the time in the pros have all-star years then randomly fall of a cliff.
Posted on 4/24/22 at 8:30 pm to cubsfan5150
if you're an Arkansas fan and you're trashing DVH then you're a dumbass
Posted on 4/25/22 at 6:57 am to Arkapigdiesel
quote:
I hope DVh doesn't pull a DeBriyn and stay too long.
Did DeBriyn stay too long?
He made the tournament 5 of his last 8 seasons, which included an SEC title in ‘99 and a Supers appearance in his last season in ‘02.
It wasn’t his heyday of the 1980s, but he did navigate our transition into the SEC which was a step up in competition in baseball, especially with guys like Ron Polk and Skip Bertman in the division.
Either way, Van Horn has only gotten better as his tenure has progressed. Since 2012 we’ve made the CWS 4 times and the Supers last year. The 2020 season was canceled and doesn’t count, so he’s at least made the Supers 5 of the last 9 years, with really only 1 stinker of a season (2016) in that stretch.
DVH might not be Skip Bertman or Tim Corbin, but he sure as hell isn’t Mike Bianco.
This post was edited on 4/25/22 at 7:05 am
Posted on 4/25/22 at 7:48 am to Feral
This whole thread seems like Duke fans saying Coach K lost his touch. Or Bama fans picking their next coach after losing in the National Championship game.
Posted on 4/25/22 at 10:33 am to exiledhogfan
quote:
Kjerstad and Martin -- AWESOME players for us -- didn't get better.
Heston got better. Martin was weird. I think his problem was nerves making him go too fast. He seemed more relaxed as a freshman than he did in his soph year.
Posted on 4/25/22 at 10:51 am to V Bainbridge
I think DVH is too loyal sometimes to the upper classmen and to his assistants. I personally don't care the MLB hitting approach of HR or bust, or walks.
I honestly have never been too high on Thompson bc we should be able to hit for decent BA. OPS isn't everything like some make it out to be.
One last thing, I think our players have believed some of their own hype and have put too much pressure on themselves knowing this is their draft year instead of just having fun and playing a game.
I honestly have never been too high on Thompson bc we should be able to hit for decent BA. OPS isn't everything like some make it out to be.
One last thing, I think our players have believed some of their own hype and have put too much pressure on themselves knowing this is their draft year instead of just having fun and playing a game.
This post was edited on 4/25/22 at 10:54 am
Posted on 4/25/22 at 11:40 am to V Bainbridge
Martin had a problem hitting a curve ball and still does now.
Posted on 4/25/22 at 11:46 am to dchog
You could say the same for most of our current lineup.
Posted on 4/25/22 at 12:05 pm to Arkapigdiesel
quote:
I don't think we will ever win it all with DVH
I think, much like Frank Broyles with the 69 Shootout, DVH has not (and will not) get over that CWS loss to Oregon State
Posted on 4/25/22 at 12:36 pm to CFB_Fanatic
Maybe he hasn’t gotten over it personally, but it hasn’t affected our on-field performance.
The Big Shootout affected Broyles deeply. He was never the same after that loss, and his teams fell off to winning 5 and 6 games a year after the 1970 season. With the exception of 1975, his last 5 years were fairly mediocre by comparison.
Conversely, Van Horn went back to the CWS the very next season, and we just had the greatest regular season in the history of Arkansas baseball last year and were a home run away from going back to Omaha. It would’ve been interesting to see how that 2020 season would’ve played out if it hadn’t been canceled.
The Big Shootout affected Broyles deeply. He was never the same after that loss, and his teams fell off to winning 5 and 6 games a year after the 1970 season. With the exception of 1975, his last 5 years were fairly mediocre by comparison.
Conversely, Van Horn went back to the CWS the very next season, and we just had the greatest regular season in the history of Arkansas baseball last year and were a home run away from going back to Omaha. It would’ve been interesting to see how that 2020 season would’ve played out if it hadn’t been canceled.
Posted on 4/25/22 at 1:40 pm to cubsfan5150
You realize how much luck is involved in just a player's batting average? A guy can be seeing the ball well and hit 5 screaming line drives straight to the defense and have no hits for the day. This game is built on hot streaks and slumps. Fluctuations in stats from year to year should be expected. The competition doesn't remain the same either.
Posted on 4/25/22 at 2:29 pm to cubsfan5150
Our fan base is nuts my lord.
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