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re: Realignment...B1G going after 2 more ACC schools?
Posted on 2/19/13 at 10:21 pm to TheSandman
Posted on 2/19/13 at 10:21 pm to TheSandman
quote:
You keep acting like y'all were a bigger prize than UT
You're scared of A&M and not tu - we get it already.
2
Posted on 2/19/13 at 11:30 pm to cramps
quote:
You're scared of A&M and not tu - we get it already.
Does not compute.
Posted on 2/19/13 at 11:56 pm to thefloydian
Duke averages 25K during a good football season. Once Coach K retires, their basketball program could crater. They are a small private school.
Everyone one thinks UNC wants to stay with Duke. I'm not buying it. We've seen how much rivalries matter in conference realignment: Texas vs A&M, MU vs KU, WV vs Pitt, etc. They don't mean jack squat.
If the SEC was able to attract UNC, Duke would be a horrible add.
Everyone one thinks UNC wants to stay with Duke. I'm not buying it. We've seen how much rivalries matter in conference realignment: Texas vs A&M, MU vs KU, WV vs Pitt, etc. They don't mean jack squat.
If the SEC was able to attract UNC, Duke would be a horrible add.
Posted on 2/19/13 at 11:57 pm to cramps
quote:
You're scared of A&M and not tu - we get it already.
If that's how you want to spin it
Posted on 2/20/13 at 12:18 am to EvilVodka
quote:
My ideal SEC: Texas Texas A&M LSU Ole Miss Alabama Auburn Tennessee Georgia FSU Florida 9 game conference schedule...it would be the best conference ever
GTFO with that
Posted on 2/20/13 at 4:45 am to RocketBallz
quote:
If the SEC was able to attract UNC, Duke would be a horrible add.
This doesn't make sense. UNC/Duke as a package is immensely valuable because of UNC. Regardless of the partner, UNC is one of the true prizes left.
Posted on 2/20/13 at 7:26 am to EvilVodka
quote:
My ideal SEC: Texas Texas A&M LSU Ole Miss Alabama Auburn Tennessee Georgia FSU Florida 9 game conference schedule...it would be the best conference ever
I could live w/ that
Posted on 2/20/13 at 8:44 am to TeLeFaWx
A couple of things:
1 - Not sure where the idea of UNC/dook being "tied" together got started, but it is WAY overblown. The more relevant school in regards to getting UNC is Virginia, and Delany knows this. If Slive wanted to outmaneuver Delany, he'd push hard for both UVa and UNC. I suspect he's already done this, and UVa prefers the B1G over the SEC.
2 - If the ACC were to collapse, going to the B1G would be a disastrous move for UNC (for several reasons). Having lived in NC, SEC country, and B1G country, there would be a massive cultural identity that would be given up.
3 - UNC fans overwhelming support going to the SEC over the B1G (beyond the football/basketball stuff, would make a great baseball league even better instead of sacrificing an elite program in the B1G).
4 - Sadly, I think if a move happens, UNC will end up joining the B1G. It sounds like the athletics folks are pushing hard for the SEC, but the PTB are set on steering this ship north.
One underreported aspect of this whole saga is right here. Notice a name on this page??? LINK
1 - Not sure where the idea of UNC/dook being "tied" together got started, but it is WAY overblown. The more relevant school in regards to getting UNC is Virginia, and Delany knows this. If Slive wanted to outmaneuver Delany, he'd push hard for both UVa and UNC. I suspect he's already done this, and UVa prefers the B1G over the SEC.
2 - If the ACC were to collapse, going to the B1G would be a disastrous move for UNC (for several reasons). Having lived in NC, SEC country, and B1G country, there would be a massive cultural identity that would be given up.
3 - UNC fans overwhelming support going to the SEC over the B1G (beyond the football/basketball stuff, would make a great baseball league even better instead of sacrificing an elite program in the B1G).
4 - Sadly, I think if a move happens, UNC will end up joining the B1G. It sounds like the athletics folks are pushing hard for the SEC, but the PTB are set on steering this ship north.
One underreported aspect of this whole saga is right here. Notice a name on this page??? LINK
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:08 am to 4LifeTarHeel4Life
quote:
Notice a name on this page???
Jim Delaney
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:17 am to 4LifeTarHeel4Life
quote:Appreciate the Tar Heel perspective. I'm not suggesting that UNC and Duke are really tied, merely that in order to sell UNC on going to the SEC, we're probably going to have to give some consideration to UNC's preferences for team 16 in order to make it happen. For example, I think UNC would be more likely to come to the SEC if the proposed 16th team was Duke rather than Virginia Tech. Think of that 16th slot as bait to attract the Tar Heels rather than a ball and chain situation. You may be right that UVA would actually be the best partner, but I'm sensing that UVA feels like they never would be able to compete in the SEC, but might in the Big Ten. I could be wrong about that, but it is the impression I'm getting.
Not sure where the idea of UNC/dook being "tied" together got started, but it is WAY overblown. The more relevant school in regards to getting UNC is Virginia, and Delany knows this. If Slive wanted to outmaneuver Delany, he'd push hard for both UVa and UNC. I suspect he's already done this, and UVa prefers the B1G over the SEC.
quote:Jim Delaney is a Tar Heel. Mike Slive is a UVA grad. I don't think either will factor in the decision, but it is an interesting aspect.
One underreported aspect of this whole saga is right here. Notice a name on this page???
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:20 am to beatbammer
quote:
frick Florida State.
Would rather have UNC/Duke.
Or Virginia Tech/Oklahoma.
Would prefer option 2 above because we need another western team so we can get busy with the intra-SEC realignment.
I'd rather have FSU than Auburn...we really only need one school in Alabama anyways
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:22 am to EvilVodka
North Carolina will NEVER be in the SEC....if they go anywhere, it will be to the B1G because of academics
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:31 am to EvilVodka
quote:
North Carolina will NEVER be in the SEC....if they go anywhere, it will be to the B1G because of academics
Which is why the SEC should still get the markets and take NC State and either Virginia or VT. Make the wolfpack a solid program by lifting its brand in tandem with the SEC.
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:33 am to KaiserSoze99
To the people saying kick Kentucky out: frick you, frick you, frick you, You're cool, and frick you.
We are a charter member and you can gargle my balls.
We are a charter member and you can gargle my balls.
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:35 am to DisplacedKentuckian
UK belongs in the SEC.
No kicking out the charter members, Got Dammit. They earned their spot. They get to keep it.
No kicking out the charter members, Got Dammit. They earned their spot. They get to keep it.
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:37 am to KaiserSoze99
quote:
Which is why the SEC should still get the markets and take NC State and either Virginia or VT. Make the wolfpack a solid program by lifting its brand in tandem with the SEC.
Virginia ain't coming either, for the same reason...academics
we don't want Virginia anyways...they absolutely suck.
Virginia Tech and FSU!!! F the north carolina market
Posted on 2/20/13 at 9:40 am to twk
quote:
I think UNC would be more likely to come to the SEC if the proposed 16th team was Duke rather than Virginia Tech. Think of that 16th slot as bait to attract the Tar Heels rather than a ball and chain situation. You may be right that UVA would actually be the best partner, but I'm sensing that UVA feels like they never would be able to compete in the SEC, but might in the Big Ten. I could be wrong about that, but it is the impression I'm getting.
Agree in the comparison of dook/VT.....I do think that the SEC going after UVa entices both UNC as well as moving into new markets (which seems to be the SEC's chief goal in expansion).
That said, I think UVa is more interested in the B1G, but for the academics angle moreso than from a competitive standpoint.
quote:
Jim Delaney is a Tar Heel. Mike Slive is a UVA grad. I don't think either will factor in the decision, but it is an interesting aspect.
big difference in UNC and UVA alumni relationships and how they may sway decisions such as these, IMO....UNC is a much tigher-knit group overall
Posted on 2/20/13 at 10:22 am to TheSandman
quote:
You keep acting like y'all were a bigger prize than UT
We were.
Texas has already built their empire- they are the richest program in college football. They aren't going to outright share that windfall with fellow conference members just because and they will demand special concessions to make sure they get a little extra LHN money or something else if they joined the SEC. They didn't need the SEC to build that empire of advantage and they will fight to protect it.
A&M on the other hand needed the SEC to stay relevant in the state. As we get built up as a SEC program we allow the SEC to raid Texas's treasure trove without having to deal with Texas's conditions for the sharing, because we will happily share with the partners that get us to that point. Its Clemson vs USC all over again.
Now if we are going 100% hypothetical and Texas comes to the SEC with no special conditions maybe they are a bigger prize, but at that point you are bending reality so much you might as well add the Patriots and Steelers to the SEC as well.
Posted on 2/20/13 at 10:28 am to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
So let me ask you, who would YOU want to see added to the conference?
Nobody. I don't want top expand any more.
No team in the nation has benefited more from conference realignment than A&M. We are getting maximum exposure in the SEC, while our geographic competition is stuck in a league that is being marginalized (not a single top 10 rated game last year). The longer things stay the way they are, the more it helps us.
Luckily I think the B1G doesn't want major disruption either no matter what the rumors say. They took a single team from the Big 12, Big East and ACC for a reason- they want other leagues to survive. Just like A&M they benefit greatly from the status quo as the richest league and the moment conference Armageddon hits maybe the reshuffle leaves them in a disadvantaged position.
If they wanted to end the ACC they would have taken two teams at one not just one.
Posted on 2/20/13 at 10:32 am to 4LifeTarHeel4Life
The tough thing in all of this is you can't look at anything on the surface, it is all about 3 chess moves down the road because of how NC's decision affects others. I also agree completely that UNC/UVA is more important than UNC/Duke, those 2 schools have always been the real core of the ACC. The irony is that UVA is the most attractive school of the 2 even though UNC is the better athletic school because UVA is such an academic heavyweight and they are considered the best public school on the East Coast with a large and very powerful alumni base. UNC is awfully sexy though. Anyway, here are some scenarios:
NC/UVA go Big 1G. Ok, first off this only happens if the ACC settles for almost nothing on the UM buyout (which I think happens anyway). UVA and UNC don't want to pay $50 mill to leave and they aren't going to get $50 mil out of UM and not have to pay it themselves. Personally I think this is why the lawsuit is a smokescreen to buy time. If this happens though it also breaks apart the ACC and sends NC State and VT into the SEC. This is the big win scenario for the Big 1G and a loss for the SEC but a HUGE win for NC State and VT who would otherwise go Big 12 for a lot less money and exposure and have to travel farther for their games. UNC has seen what happened to Texas with A&M going to the SEC, do they want to see the same thing happen with NC State? The reason this is a loss for the SEC is NC State and VTech will have a very hard time ever being above average in the SEC. If you can't beat out Clemson/FSU you sure as hell aren't going to be able to keep up in the SEC with UGA and UF right there with double your resources. Both schools will be cannon fodder or at best work their way up to being middle of the pack. It's laughable to me to see folks criticize Mizzou but think NC State or even VT is a good addition. At least Mizzou is an AAU school with significant resources and alumni that completely owns their state.
UVA/UNC go SEC. HUGE win for the SEC here and HUGE loss for the Big 1G. The SEC is done at 16 and happy as a clam. The Big 1G has to scramble and choose from several unattractive options. UVA isn't thrilled because they are academics first and the Big 1G means easier access to research dollars but the SEC wouldn't be as negative for them here as they may think. Likely taking GT and Duke which allows them to keep the academics happy but sacrifices their geographical preferences. They may take one last run at ND but that is a Hail Mary (lulz). Everyone else of value goes Big 12 (FSU, Clemson, Pitt, NC State, VTech, and probably Miami).
UVA/GT go Big 1G, UNC goes SEC with either Duke or VT. This is probably the most likely scenario and everyone wins and loses some. It breaks up UVA/UNC but it allows UVA to go where they want and for UNC to go in the SEC as a power broker while keeping NC State under control as they will go Big 12 and still be little brother. Everyone else scrambles as shown earlier to join the Big 12 or gets left hanging (Sorry Wake, you are screwed no matter what).
NC/UVA go Big 1G. Ok, first off this only happens if the ACC settles for almost nothing on the UM buyout (which I think happens anyway). UVA and UNC don't want to pay $50 mill to leave and they aren't going to get $50 mil out of UM and not have to pay it themselves. Personally I think this is why the lawsuit is a smokescreen to buy time. If this happens though it also breaks apart the ACC and sends NC State and VT into the SEC. This is the big win scenario for the Big 1G and a loss for the SEC but a HUGE win for NC State and VT who would otherwise go Big 12 for a lot less money and exposure and have to travel farther for their games. UNC has seen what happened to Texas with A&M going to the SEC, do they want to see the same thing happen with NC State? The reason this is a loss for the SEC is NC State and VTech will have a very hard time ever being above average in the SEC. If you can't beat out Clemson/FSU you sure as hell aren't going to be able to keep up in the SEC with UGA and UF right there with double your resources. Both schools will be cannon fodder or at best work their way up to being middle of the pack. It's laughable to me to see folks criticize Mizzou but think NC State or even VT is a good addition. At least Mizzou is an AAU school with significant resources and alumni that completely owns their state.
UVA/UNC go SEC. HUGE win for the SEC here and HUGE loss for the Big 1G. The SEC is done at 16 and happy as a clam. The Big 1G has to scramble and choose from several unattractive options. UVA isn't thrilled because they are academics first and the Big 1G means easier access to research dollars but the SEC wouldn't be as negative for them here as they may think. Likely taking GT and Duke which allows them to keep the academics happy but sacrifices their geographical preferences. They may take one last run at ND but that is a Hail Mary (lulz). Everyone else of value goes Big 12 (FSU, Clemson, Pitt, NC State, VTech, and probably Miami).
UVA/GT go Big 1G, UNC goes SEC with either Duke or VT. This is probably the most likely scenario and everyone wins and loses some. It breaks up UVA/UNC but it allows UVA to go where they want and for UNC to go in the SEC as a power broker while keeping NC State under control as they will go Big 12 and still be little brother. Everyone else scrambles as shown earlier to join the Big 12 or gets left hanging (Sorry Wake, you are screwed no matter what).
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