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re: How Does A Program Implode?
Posted on 6/8/21 at 1:59 pm to CrimsonClover
Posted on 6/8/21 at 1:59 pm to CrimsonClover
quote:
OP became a bama fan after the Nick Saban hire
quote:
Well considering he was hired when I was 5 years old, yeah
Nobody else needs to respond to this thread. OP is just a dumb teenager.
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Posted on 6/8/21 at 7:30 pm to CrimsonClover
Having a POS athletic director takes down a program of he hires or promotes the hiring of a coach who is unable to do the job.
Posted on 6/8/21 at 8:58 pm to CrimsonClover
FSU’s problems started when recruits mentality changed. It’s about who’s got the shiny new top of the line facilities. It’s an arms race now. FSU lacks the money to do so, they denied Jimbo on pretty much everything he needed to compete with teams like Alabama, Ohio st, uga, Clemson, etc. Consider FSU done in the cfb elite they no longer have a legendary coach to recruit them through their empty coffers. Same page with Miami they will never be back besides maybe a small flash in the pan. Money talks and FSU ain’t got it.
Posted on 6/8/21 at 9:39 pm to BeavisXtreme
quote:
FSU’s problems started when recruits mentality changed. It’s about who’s got the shiny new top of the line facilities. It’s an arms race now. FSU lacks the money to do so, they denied Jimbo on pretty much everything he needed to compete with teams like Alabama, Ohio st, uga, Clemson, etc.
Everyone wants to blame FSU for not investing in facilities and such but they ignore the fact that Jimbo was still recruiting right up there with Alabama and Ohio State and some of the others yet he was losing 3 games a year in the ACC after Jameis left.
Everyone says Aggie has given him the resources that FSU wouldn't but he recruited better at FSU.
2011, his second class, he pulled in the #2 class in the country. 2012 he pulled in #4.
His average FSU class ranking was around #4.
His average Aggie class ranking has been around #9.
This post was edited on 6/8/21 at 9:52 pm
Posted on 6/8/21 at 9:58 pm to CrimsonClover
There Coach quit on them…
Posted on 6/8/21 at 10:35 pm to lukestar
Maybe we should ask the LSU fans? Orgeron appears to be an expert on imploding …
Posted on 6/8/21 at 10:38 pm to ColoradoAg
quote:
Maybe we should ask the LSU fans? Orgeron appears to be an expert on imploding …
5-5 with an all SEC schedule > 5-6 with an ACC schedule + OOC cupcakes
Posted on 6/9/21 at 6:10 am to ColoradoAg
quote:LSU had a single down season, in a weird year. Trolling and jabs aside, that doesn't answer the implosion question.
Maybe we should ask the LSU fans? Orgeron appears to be an expert on imploding …
Tennessee, Nebraska, Florida State- those programs imploded.
You could say Arkansas, too. They went from being consistent top 3 in the West for over a decade, to trying not to be last.
Recruiting dipped, coaches either moved on or became ineffective, while their rivals improved.
Next step seems to be: frustrated school admins hire a replacement, lose patience within a year of the rebuild starting, and quickly push that guy out for another. What had been a stable program becomes chaotic, with parts of several guy's systems broken and sort of in place. Meanwhile rivals continue to roll, even elevate, and you lose all semblance of talent equality vs those rivals.
Biggest thing, I think, is the loss of talent. It would be hard for LSU to vanish forever, since La pumps out so much talent each year. Sooner or later you get the right guy in to spark interest, and the program revives.
Florida State is in danger since there's so much competition for Fla players. Nebraska is likely dead, since their brand isn't national anymore. Tennessee is in trouble, since they're getting squeezed by the surrounding SEC schools and Clemson, and they lack a large base. Arkansas needs to recapture parts of Texas, North La and such.
Posted on 6/9/21 at 7:12 am to Sebastian Gorka
quote:
Lose your offensive guru, see LSU this past year.
Was this offensive guru coaching the defense?
Posted on 6/9/21 at 9:09 am to SidewalkTiger
Jimbo benefited from Miami being down. They recruit south FL a lot more than we do. A guy like Dalvin Cook from the 305 would probably go to the U now.
Regardless, FSU should never be worse than 3rd in talent among ACC teams.
Regardless, FSU should never be worse than 3rd in talent among ACC teams.
This post was edited on 6/9/21 at 9:18 am
Posted on 6/9/21 at 9:18 am to SidewalkTiger
quote:
Everyone wants to blame FSU for not investing in facilities and such but they ignore the fact that Jimbo was still recruiting right up there with Alabama and Ohio State and some of the others yet he was losing 3 games a year in the ACC after Jameis left.
Everyone says Aggie has given him the resources that FSU wouldn't but he recruited better at FSU.
2011, his second class, he pulled in the #2 class in the country. 2012 he pulled in #4.
His average FSU class ranking was around #4.
Spot on.
Posted on 6/9/21 at 9:28 am to poncho villa
I feel this, I'm 26...
Posted on 6/9/21 at 10:41 am to BeavisXtreme
quote:
FSU’s problems started when recruits mentality changed. It’s about who’s got the shiny new top of the line facilities. It’s an arms race now. FSU lacks the money to do so, they denied Jimbo on pretty much everything he needed to compete with teams like Alabama, Ohio st, uga, Clemson, etc. Consider FSU done in the cfb elite they no longer have a legendary coach to recruit them through their empty coffers. Same page with Miami they will never be back besides maybe a small flash in the pan. Money talks and FSU ain’t got it.
Our implosion was due to several things (Jimbo and the AD/Booster conflicts, his personal life, losing the lcoker room and handle of APR, etc) but this is a big one too. Spending money on the "Champions Club" instead of upgrading facilities is something for which I think the program would like a mulligan. They also invested into "Collegetown" on the hopes that football money would keep coming in, the opposite of what happened with Tuscaloosa's build-up. Already with less money than a lot of the SEC powers, this set them back a while (and add the Taggart buy-out on top of it). I like to be hopeful since we still have a brand, in a recruiting hotbed, and a relatively easy conference but realistically if Norvell fails we might be headed the way of Nebraska.
Posted on 6/9/21 at 11:30 am to Robot Santa
quote:
Urban is an interesting case study. What he left behind at Utah and Ohio State gave the next guy every opportunity to succeed, which they have both done. Not so much at Florida
I hate to say this, but it was the players, IMO.
There were more than 30 arrests during Meyer's tenure at Florida.
Aaron Hernandez was breaking bouncer's eardrums and murdering people, Riley Cooper was using slurs, players were fighting each other, coaches were fighting each other, etc.
And by all accounts, the "favorites" went unpunished.
There were a lot of egos, negativity, and partying in that facility under Meyer.
I don't think Will Muschamp could maintain that earlier momentum while trying to clean it up.
Posted on 6/9/21 at 2:11 pm to CrimsonClover
quote:
It reminds me of Urban Meyer's implosion at Florida.
Of course there are other examples like Gene Chizik at Auburn, or Orgeron at LSU, but clearly this can even happen to great head coaches.
What causes this phenomena?
Bobby Bowden was a good coach but he wore out his welcome at FSU. He should have recognized that and bowed (no pun intended) out before he did.
Posted on 6/9/21 at 2:33 pm to Windy City
quote:
He then completes his greatest feat by coaching Kellen Mond into a third round pick.
Once upon a time, he coached JaMarcus to a 1st overall pick.
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