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re: Something that needs to be said about football

Posted on 7/6/23 at 11:09 am to
Posted by Riggle
Blue Ridge Mountains
Member since Feb 2013
3239 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 11:09 am to
quote:

We will have the 16th- to 18th-ranked recruiting class this year.

Good for ninth in the SEC.


This is the core of the issue. The only way for football to get to where basketball and baseball are is to improve recruiting.
Posted by JeffLebowski
Member since Feb 2015
1817 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 11:21 am to
quote:

We will have the 16th- to 18th-ranked recruiting class this year. Good for ninth in the SEC. This is the core of the issue.


This is definitely the actual elephant in the room. It’s hard to dominate when most of our seniors look like UGA and Bama’s incoming freshmen. It’s become a next-level deficit and we are doing right in NIL in basketball, but I question if we ever will in football or if it would even matter at this point. We needed to get out early. I will say, most of our guys NIL for like UAMS, etc. is very classy, but we’ve got to be dropping CASH if we want to compete in recruiting(which is still a crap show). And for those who think that we wasted on the basketball team last year, we didn’t. We still overcame a ton of injuries with a super young team, played a lot of talented teams, and made the sweet 16 by beating a powerhouse #1 seed and it wouldn’t have happened with scrubs.
Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57956 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 11:31 am to
In-state talent. We have it in basketball and baseball. We're starving for it in football. That's the difference. Arkansas high school football does not feed the university program like baseball and basketball do. Arkansas football is what it is as long as the recruits that grow up dreaming of wearing an Arkansas jersey are good enough for Tulane at best year in and year out.
Posted by dchog
Pea ridge
Member since Nov 2012
21374 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 11:51 am to
They do play in a very weak division but unlike Arkansas they didn't have peaks and valleys with each hire they had.

They hire a Chad Morris and they fall off quickly. No matter what conference they are in.

Posted by Arkapigdiesel
Arkansas
Member since Jun 2009
13329 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 12:01 pm to
I wished we'd devote more NIL resources into basketball and baseball. Football is futile.
Posted by dchog
Pea ridge
Member since Nov 2012
21374 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 12:31 pm to


This post was edited on 7/6/23 at 12:32 pm
Posted by dchog
Pea ridge
Member since Nov 2012
21374 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 12:48 pm to
Baseball recruits across the nation and the instate talent wasn't as good when DVH first got here. It is much better now that the program started winning big.

Nolan recruited across the nation and the instate talent wasn't as good now but it got better under Anderson and even better under Muss.


Football talent began to get worse in the early 2000s when the state began consolidating all these smaller school districts and that hurt a lot of delta schools that produced a decent amount of players.

Then the Little Rock school district got so corrupt that public school system crashed. The parents that could afford it, took them to private schools and students that could have been good in football either don't play or on shitty football teams.
Posted by Arkapigdiesel
Arkansas
Member since Jun 2009
13329 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 1:17 pm to
quote:

Baseball recruits across the nation and the instate talent wasn't as good when DVH first got here. It is much better now that the program started winning big.

I was talking to a co-worker yesterday about baseball in the Bryant area. He was telling me there's teams there that's called the Bryant Blacksox. They have various teams from I think 7 year olds to 13 (I might be off a tad on the ages).

Anyway, he was telling me that there are college coaches that show up to their games. We are talking 13 and younger kids. That's crazy to me.
This post was edited on 7/6/23 at 1:18 pm
Posted by dchog
Pea ridge
Member since Nov 2012
21374 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 2:12 pm to
DVH was asked in his earlier years why he didn't recruit Arkansas as much as other states. He said that the state had poor development of players that weren't SEC caliber.

He won and got Arkansas to the CWS that had less talented teams than his later teams.

He won with what he had at first such as the 2004 team and it would start a gaining interest in Arkansas high school baseball.

Instate baseball got better and so did recruiting out of state.
This post was edited on 7/6/23 at 2:13 pm
Posted by ArHog
Muss is a coward
Member since Jan 2008
33207 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 2:51 pm to



Drink up baws

Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57956 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 2:51 pm to
I'm not going to say it hasn't improved, but the baseball talent in state wasn't as abysmally far behind comparatively as it is in football when Dave got here. He was still able to compete on a national level with a team mostly made up of Arkansas kids.

There's a 0% chance of doing that in football as things stand. It's just not an apples to apples comparison. Football is so much further behind.
Posted by cubsfan5150
Member since Nov 2007
15794 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 3:01 pm to
Football pays the bills though
Posted by Hawgnsincebirth55
Gods country
Member since Sep 2016
16101 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 3:23 pm to
Something else to think about is last year we still weren’t that far off from having a really good season. We lost 4 games by a combined 9 points and one of the other losses was to alabama and the other was Mississippi state without our starting qb. And Pittman has still fielded the 2 most competitive Arkansas teams vs alabama than anyone the last decade since the kody Walker fumble game. If we don’t have a multitude of injuries in a single unit causing us to have one of the worst secondaries in football last year we probably win 8 or 9 games but then again that’s life as an Arkansas fan.
This post was edited on 7/6/23 at 3:27 pm
Posted by Razorback Reverend
Member since Dec 2013
22808 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 3:50 pm to
quote:

Football pays the bills though


I am beginning to question why? I mean, I am obviously one of the season tix holders who continues forking out the $$$ every year. Almost let em go after Chard.

Glad I didn't, since I do ok with the ones I do not use and am able to continue to donations without affecting my life much at all.

BUt dan, we have been mediocre for far too long in Football. Baseball... We rock, as in Basketball now. We still need an NC in both, but we are right there competitive period.

We will be behind further after Tex and OK enter the pic imho. Hopefully we get it together and I am wrong.
Posted by gohogs141
Fayetteville
Member since Jun 2011
7517 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 4:11 pm to
I get that basketball has had more overall success lately, but we finished tied for 8th in the SEC in football last year while we finished 10th in the conference in basketball but most consider it a successful season because we won a few games at the end. The tournament is obviously the most important part everyone focuses on but football doesn't ever have that opportunity - you're stuck in a crappy bowl game no one cares about unless you finish top 4 or so in the league.

It's just tougher in general to appease fans in football I guess. The year before last we finished 4th in the SEC in basketball while we were tied for 5th in football - not that far apart. We went to the Elite 8 and also won our bowl game but the Elite 8 carries a ton more weight.
Posted by Hubbhogg
Fayettechill
Member since Dec 2010
13443 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 4:18 pm to
The bottom line is we have no chance to win it all in football with the current rules/etc. We will be lucky to make a 12 team playoff once every 20 years or so
Posted by dchog
Pea ridge
Member since Nov 2012
21374 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 4:43 pm to
Texas and Oklahoma will have to worry about not getting buried in the SEC. If I was them, I would have stayed in the Big 12 where they can always win more games.

Posted by Arkapigdiesel
Arkansas
Member since Jun 2009
13329 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 7:21 pm to
quote:

I wished we'd devote more NIL resources into basketball and baseball. Football is futile.

quote:

Football pays the bills though

I know. Too many knuckle draggers love supporting a floundering product.
Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57956 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 7:36 pm to
quote:

We will be lucky to make a 12 team playoff once every 20 years or so
I actually think we'll pop into the top 12 every now and then. I hate it for the sport, but that change is probably the most beneficial for us specifically that they've made since they started changing everything.
Posted by JeffLebowski
Member since Feb 2015
1817 posts
Posted on 7/6/23 at 8:46 pm to
Don’t disagree. We could still do better though. But yes, overall, our state just doesn’t produce SEC caliber athletes(particularly linemen to really build off of) on a level for a team foundation in football.
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