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Posted on 2/15/20 at 2:05 pm to Carlton
Don’t. He’s had this exact argument with 30 different posters on this board. He thinks the defense has no blame whatsoever because injuries completely excuse them. He loves to bring it up.
This post was edited on 2/15/20 at 2:07 pm
Posted on 2/15/20 at 2:15 pm to Carlton
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Please elaborate.
vs LSU our offense managed only 1 TD until last in the 3rd quarter. That TD came on a 4 play drive, aka a single explosive play.
Among the other drives: The fumble without being touched in the redzone. The fumble by the punter on a punt, giving LSU good field position. The interception with only 15 seconds left in the 1st half, from our own 20 yards, followed by a personal foul that gave LSU the ball in the redzone, basically giving LSU a 20 point lead into the half.
The defense comes out in the 2nd half, shuts LSU out the entire 3rd quarter. They even get a fumble on the 1st drive. The offense basically fails to capitalize on it over and over. Finally late in the 3rd quarter Sark goes away from Tua and the pass, and starts giving the ball to Najee and the offense starts to move the ball on good drives. Then Tua throws another TD late in the game. But come the 4th quarter, the defense gives up 2 more TDs.
It was terrible offensive play for 3/4ths of that game. In a year when it was supposed to be our best offense of all time..
Lost the game by 5 points, people look at the final score and think well the offense must have scored 41, maybe some realize it was 34, and the defense must have given up 46. But they don't look at when the points were scored, how the defense adjusted, the field position the offense put them in repeatedly, etc.
Golding is such a terrible coach, but the adjustments made for the 2nd half were on point.
Then vs Auburn, we straight up threw 2 pick sixes. It wasn't a great defensive performance, but it should have been a win even with that defensive play. How can you lose a game you threw 2 pick sixes in by 3 points and think the defense is the reason you lost?
The defense no doubt had it's troubles. Inconsistency is the main thing I noticed. I saw talent, I saw them make the plays, but then I would see them make a mistake on the next play etc. IMO that is understandable when you have such a high amount of freshman playing.
But the offense was even worse with the costly mistakes in the games we lost and it goes back to the Clemson game in the NC. Pick sixes, drive killing penalties, fumbles, etc. Happened in all of the past 3 losses. This with what has to be the most loaded offense in the history of Alabama, with tons of experience on the field. That is not understandable and it shouldn't have happened. Mac Jones is an exception, I give him a pass on the 2 interceptions because of the situation he was put in, however it's still why we lost.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 2:18 pm to 1BamaRTR
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Don’t. He’s had this exact argument with 30 different posters on this board. He thinks the defense has no blame whatsoever because injuries completely excuse them. He loves to bring it up.
Saban has said the exact same thing, maybe you should ask him why.
But my question to you is this - how many pick sixes does the offense need to throw in 3 point loss before you will move the blame from the defense to the offense?
Posted on 2/15/20 at 2:33 pm to 3down10
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Saban has said the exact same thing
Link?
My question to you is this - Was the defense completely perfect and had no blame whatsoever? I wouldn’t have a problem if you said something like “I think the offense deserves about equal if not more blame”. But nope. You go all out with putting pretty much no blame on the defense.
You act like Golding was about as good as anyone could possibly be in the history of the sport. He could do no wrong in your mind because of the injuries.
Meanwhile you expect the offense to play absolutely perfect otherwise it’s all their fault. Ignoring the single most important player in football, the STAR QB, got hurt. Sean Lee errors got excused because of injury but not Mac Jones’s pick sixes.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 2:55 pm to 1BamaRTR
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Link?
My question to you is this - Was the defense completely perfect and had no blame whatsoever? I wouldn’t have a problem if you said something like “I think the offense deserves about equal if not more blame”. But nope. You go all out with putting pretty much no blame on the defense.
You act like Golding was about as good as anyone could possibly be in the history of the sport. He could do no wrong in your mind because of the injuries.
Meanwhile you expect the offense to play absolutely perfect otherwise it’s all their fault. Ignoring the single most important player in football, the STAR QB, got hurt. Sean Lee errors got excused because of injury but not Mac Jones’s pick sixes.
Link to which time? He said during the year "These are the players we have". He talked constantly about how players had so much to still learn, specifically about Shane Lee since that's everyone's favorite punching bag. Just recently on national signing day he mentioned the number of freshman we played and talked about having an obligation to not play them before they are ready and that hopefully next year we have the depth to prevent that.
He's said over and over people think they can just plug another guy in easily and it just doesn't work that way.
Obviously the defense was far from perfect. And I have nobody to compare Golding with because this amount of injuries with the type of defense and caliber of players hasn't happened before. I think those who believe all these freshman should be NFL ready type players within a few months of a single season are unreasonable, to put it nicely.
And yes I do hold the offense to a higher standard than the defense last year. Because it's understandable when half your starters in the front 7, including both ILB are freshman. I don't think it's reasonable to expect top quality play from such a group that still has so much to learn and experience needed. I can't say the same about our offense, and the fact remains in our biggest games they made costly mistakes when they should have been the backbone of the team.
As for Golding specifically, we'll see if he does well this year. I was at one point very anti-Golding after the rumors came out that he called the Clemson game(I do not believe them any longer). However, I saw a defense that was decently aggressive, very little in the way of 3 man rushes and extremely good half time adjustments many times. The problems on defense were individual players making mental mistakes, or in some cases just lacking physically, not a failure in concepts and play calling. As such, I became much more optimistic about him at the position in the future when not being hamstrung by the shittiest of hands possible. But we'll see.
Also, I said specifically I did not blame Mac Jones. He was inexperienced and thrown into a bad situation. He needs to be more consistent, but showed he had the talent. Basically what I see on our defense, a lack of consistency due to inexperience.
This post was edited on 2/15/20 at 3:01 pm
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:00 pm to 3down10
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The defense no doubt had it's troubles. Inconsistency is the main thing I noticed. I saw talent, I saw them make the plays, but then I would see them make a mistake on the next play etc. IMO that is understandable when you have such a high amount of freshman playing.
To put this all on the offense is insane. Most of us know that the defense was young and are okay with that, but to see little to no improvement over the season is what we’re mad at.
quote:
But the offense was even worse with the costly mistakes in the games we lost and it goes back to the Clemson game in the NC. Pick sixes, drive killing penalties, fumbles, etc. Happened in all of the past 3 losses. This with what has to be the most loaded offense in the history of Alabama, with tons of experience on the field. That is not understandable and it shouldn't have happened. Mac Jones is an exception, I give him a pass on the 2 interceptions because of the situation he was put in, however it's still why we lost.
Hate to break it to you but that offense dominated Auburn, Mac threw 2 pick 6’s but still put 40 plus and I believe we score again if not for that terrible penalty at the end.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:08 pm to 3down10
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Obviously the defense was far from perfect.
Yet you always open up with “offense is to blame, not defense”. Why is it so hard for you to say the defense had its issues but so did the offense.
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He said during the year "These are the players we have".
Ok so he never actually said it. He never said anything along lines of the offense was to blame while the defense gets no blame.
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And yes I do hold the offense to a higher standard than the defense last year.
The QB is the by far the most important position in all of football. Tua got hurt. He wasn’t fully healthy against LSU and he didn’t play at all versus AU. Yet you still want to hold the offense to high standards by ignoring that. You keep bringing up the pick sixes. You expect Mac Jones to come into AU and play like a 1st team All American QB? Is that the only way you wouldn’t criticize the offense? Because he put up way more yards and TDs than any other QB they faced all season long.
Meanwhile our veteran secondary also had miscues yet completely excused.
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And I have nobody to compare Golding
You don’t have to. He didn’t do an absolutely perfect job like you seem to imply. But using your own logic you can’t say
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yet it was one of the better coaching jobs in recent history.
because you don’t have anyone to compare him to.
This post was edited on 2/15/20 at 3:16 pm
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:16 pm to 3down10
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Simple minds can't see beyond black and white and that's fine.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:17 pm to YStar
He’s quite literally said on this board multiple times that he’s much smarter than everyone else.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:20 pm to BamaFan107
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To put this all on the offense is insane. Most of us know that the defense was young and are okay with that, but to see little to no improvement over the season is what we’re mad at.
When you directly give the other team points, what else is there? Do you blame the defense for the Ole Miss loss a few years ago, or do you say - how the frick can anyone win when you turn the ball over 5 teams? And that wasn't even an elite team. Turn the ball over 3 times against LSU, who ends up going undefeated with the highest rated offense and somehow that's on the defense in a 5 pt loss?
Chasing that stupid arse Heisman trophy is what it really amounts to. fricking hate that shite so much.
1st down on your own 26 yard line. Less than 20 seconds left in the half. Take a fricking sack, take a fricking knee, run around doing a chicken dance. Any of those are better than what actually happens. Throws a bad pass which was almost intercepted by another player, goes behind the receiver and gets intercepted against the #2 team in the country. Is that not the dumbest fricking decision ever in a game? Literally just fall down and run the clock out and we go into the half down by 13 rather than 20.
Of course, not to be outdone, Dickerson then proceeds to get a personal foul on the return, putting LSU in the redzone for a quick score as LSU abuses the freshman ILB with a pass to a RB for a TD.
People want to expect a freshman ILB to be great by November, but expecting Tua to throw the ball away at any fricking point after 3 years in a program is not in the cards.
Sark is the QB genius, Fire Golding!
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Hate to break it to you but that offense dominated Auburn, Mac threw 2 pick 6’s but still put 40 plus and I believe we score again if not for that terrible penalty at the end.
So again, how many pick sixes does the offense need to throw before they are to blame in a 3 point loss.
They scored 40 plus? No. They scored 31 effective points after you deduct the 14 points given to Auburn. Auburn's offense managed to 31 legit points on offense. The other points came from 2 pick sixes and a ref given FG.
But yeah, aside from the extremely costly mistakes, I thought the offense looked good and I think Mac Jones is very much capable of taking this team the distance next year.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:27 pm to 1BamaRTR
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He’s quite literally said on this board multiple times that he’s much smarter than everyone else.
I don't even argue any of his points. I just mock him and laugh at the dumb shite he says.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:34 pm to 1BamaRTR
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Yet you always open up with “offense is to blame, not defense”. Why is it so hard for you to say the defense had its issues but so did the offense.
Expect I do say it all the damn time. It's not my fault what you choose to focus on.
quote:
Ok so he never actually said it. He never said anything along lines of the offense was to blame while the defense gets no blame.
Your quote I replied to didn't say shite about offense.
Don’t. He’s had this exact argument with 30 different posters on this board. He thinks the defense has no blame whatsoever because injuries completely excuse them. He loves to bring it up.
quote:
The QB is the by far the most important position in all of football. Tua got hurt. He wasn’t fully healthy against LSU and he didn’t play at all versus AU. Yet you still want to hold the offense to high standards by ignoring that. You keep bringing up the pick sixes. You expect Mac Jones to come into AU and play like a 1st team All American QB? Is that the only way you wouldn’t criticize the offense? Because he put up way more yards and TDs than any other QB they faced all season long.
Health has nothing to do with bad decisions. It wasn't a problem that he was getting caught when he normally wouldn't. It wasn't a problem that he was just unable to make throws. It was a decision making issue, and being careless with the football.
And no, I've said multiple times I give Mac Jones a pass. However, it's still the reason why we lost the game. Free passes don't take points off the board. How many times are you going to bring up Mac Jones like I've said nothing?
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Meanwhile our veteran secondary also had miscues yet completely excused.
Sorry, do you expect 100% perfect play or something? Cornerbacks and going to get burned, so are other DBs. If you think it's ever going to be 100% or ever has been close to 100%, then you just need some basic lessons in football. It's not like Savion Smith was out there stinking it up like the NCG.
In truth, the secondary really only has a few seconds in which they can legitimately keep things in check. After which time if your front 7 hasn't gotten to the QB, any half decent QB is going to find a hole and pick apart your secondary. It's why I was furious after the NCG vs Clemson because constantly 3 man rushes and no pressure on the QB. Obvious play calling issues. Didn't really see that kind of stuff this year.
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You don’t have to. He didn’t do an absolutely perfect job like you seem to imply. But using your own logic you can’t say
Again, not what I've implied, just what you choose to focus on.
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because you don’t have anyone to compare him to.
Finished high in the SP+ rankings, and our defense did better against LSU than Clemson did with the DC everyone wants to crown the best in college football while not having a shite ton of injuries.
I guess it's just a matter of how big a deal people think playing so many freshman is. I think it's a really really big deal, and some people don't think it is at all.
If we had these results with the players Pruitt was working with for example, I'd lead the charge for Goldings head. But all things considered, I think he did ok, and with better offensive play - we do not lose any regular season games.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 3:37 pm to 1BamaRTR
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He’s quite literally said on this board multiple times that he’s much smarter than everyone else.
Certainly not everyone, but I'd take that bet with most of you.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 4:05 pm to 3down10
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Expect I do say it all the damn time. It's not my fault what you choose to focus on.
You always open up with the offense is to blame not defense. You follow up with saying the defense had issues but proceed to excuse it all away by blaming injuries.
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Your quote I replied to didn't say shite about offense.
So if the defense has no blame, that means you think the offense is to blame. Again nowhere did Saban put all the blame on offense and nothing on defense.
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Health has nothing to do with bad decisions. It wasn't a problem that he was getting caught when he normally wouldn't. It wasn't a problem that he was just unable to make throws. It was a decision making issue, and being careless with the football.
Tua barely practiced at all for about a month. You think that had no impact on his play? No rustiness or anything? Tua played here for a few years. Have you ever seen him fumbling the ball without even getting touched. You think that has nothing to do with playing barely any contact football for a month?
Burrow wouldn’t have beat us if he didn’t use his legs. Plenty of QBs have beat us because they were mobile. Tua’s mobility was nonexistent the whole game. Even his mobility in the pocket was affected. The offense would’ve performed better in the first half if he was able to.
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And no, I've said multiple times I give Mac Jones a pass. However, it's still the reason why we lost the game. Free passes don't take points off the board. How many times are you going to bring up Mac Jones like I've said nothing?
Then why keep bringing up the pick sixes to support your point. As long as you keep bringing up the injuries to excuse away the defense’s issues, I’ll bring up Tua’s injuries to excuse Mac’s mistakes. You want to have it both ways but you can’t. You either excuse the defensive errors on injuries while also excusing the backup QB’s two mistakes due to injury or you don’t.
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Sorry, do you expect 100% perfect play or something?
That’s exactly what you’re doing for this offense. Doesn’t matter they put up a lot of points and yards on AU (more than any team all season long), because they made two really bad mistakes out of a several dozen plays, they get all the blame.
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Again, not what I've implied, just what you choose to focus on.
Uh no. You said he did “better”. Implying you’re comparing him to others. Then you turn around and say you can’t compare him to anyone else.
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Finished high in the SP+ rankings, and our defense did better against LSU than Clemson did with the DC everyone wants to crown the best in college football while not having a shite ton of injuries.
Look I’m not saying he did horrible. I’m saying he could’ve been better. He had his issues too.
But if you really want to do this comparison thing, Sark and the offense you want to criticize so much despite Tua’s injury, put up more yards and points against any AU all season. 2nd most yards and points versus LSU with a hobbled Tua.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 4:07 pm to 3down10
You’re the definition of arrogance
Posted on 2/15/20 at 5:30 pm to 1BamaRTR
Okay... back on topic. Why are we talking about Tua, Sark and the offense when it should be about Charlie Strong ?
Posted on 2/15/20 at 5:34 pm to YStar
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This is how deluded you Golding fans are.
So the same people defending Golding night and day like he's the Alamo are the same people saying a proven DC over a career isn't that great.
Again, we will laugh at y'all. It will be yuge
I've already said in this thread that I'm thrilled that strong is joining our staff. If Strong were to take over at DC, then there would be a reason for it, and I would be all for it. Again, there isn't some big Pete Golding bandwagon thing going on here. That is something that you've made up in your head.
There are, however, people that are still on the fence regarding him. If you have a problem with that, fine, but it's a weird thing to melt about.
This post was edited on 2/15/20 at 5:37 pm
Posted on 2/15/20 at 5:58 pm to BamaFan107
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Mac threw 2 pick 6’s but still put 40 plus
And how much did we lose by?
Your argument is frickig stupid. That loss was 100% on the offense. It literally gave Auburn 14 goddamn points.
Posted on 2/15/20 at 6:07 pm to Evolved Simian
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Your argument is frickig stupid. That loss was 100% on the offense. It literally gave Auburn 14 goddamn points.
don't stroke out
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