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re: Alabama Basketball Megathread | 26-7 (16-2)

Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:18 am to
Posted by phil4bama
Emerald Coast of PCB
Member since Jul 2011
11940 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:18 am to
You miss my point Teague, it’s not about his stat sheet, it’s about the intangibles. Petty plays hard and does a lot of stuff right. But he’s never been a steadying presence on the court. Maybe that’s just not who he is, but we’ve sure needed that guy the last couple of years.
Posted by SummerOfGeorge
Member since Jul 2013
105802 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:19 am to
Petty was still grinding in the paint and around the rim down 20 late in the 2nd half last night.

He's had a rough start but the whole "he's lazy and just cares about shooting" takes are nauseating.
Posted by Chadaristic
Member since Jan 2011
41026 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:20 am to
quote:

This is one of the most shocking outcomes I've seen from nearly 6,000 games tracked.

Alabama lost by 18, but based on the shots both teams got, Alabama was supposed to win by 12!




LINK
Posted by Chadaristic
Member since Jan 2011
41026 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:23 am to
quote:

Nate Oats: "We obviously haven't figured out the right guys based on this game. Maybe some guys that are playing more minutes are gonna have to get less and flip minutes around. But we're not gonna keep coming out with an effort like we gave tonight, I can guarantee you that."
Posted by Teague
The Shoals, AL
Member since Aug 2007
22277 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:32 am to
quote:

This is one of the most shocking outcomes I've seen from nearly 6,000 games tracked.

Alabama lost by 18, but based on the shots both teams got, Alabama was supposed to win by 12!


I don't know how accurate any of that is, but as a hurt fan, I'm going to take it and run with it.

But seriously, in the light of a new day, I feel slightly better. I don't think there's a huge issue. I'm hoping it's just early and we're not playing well yet. The new guys have been underwhelming, except for JQ, but I think some of it is hesitancy. Or maybe I just hope.
Posted by Gary Busey
Member since Dec 2014
33277 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:33 am to
quote:

based on the shots both teams got, Alabama was supposed to win by 12!


We wouldn't have won, but the missed layups and other shots would have made this game a lot closer.

It is what it is. Stanford is no slouch defensively.
Posted by Robot Santa
Member since Oct 2009
46353 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:35 am to
quote:


I'm not sure it's fair to say that about a guy that has consistently been our leading rebounder and second best defender.


It's definitely not. Petty usually plays with a lot of effort. He occasionally half asses it, but a lot of our fans want to pretend he's Tony Mitchell and just mails it in if he doesn't score in the first 3 minutes of the game despite there being absolutely zero evidence of that. From a leadership standpoint this group's problem is that they don't really have an emotional leader. They didn't last year either. Herb and Petty aren't those kind of players and Bruner doesn't appear to be either.
Posted by mistaken4193
Member since Jan 2017
30377 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:40 am to
We Have to get Primo and Ellis going. If they can’t produce the we aren’t gonna be very good.
Posted by Robot Santa
Member since Oct 2009
46353 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 7:40 am to
quote:

This is one of the most shocking outcomes I've seen from nearly 6,000 games tracked.

Alabama lost by 18, but based on the shots both teams got, Alabama was supposed to win by 12!


I thought we started to take more and more questionable shots as the game went on, but missing all those good looks early just kind of snowballed on us. For whatever reason they just aren't falling. And it's not like these dudes are high school recruits who are billed as good shooters but show up in Tuscaloosa and look like Ben Wallace at the FT line. We know Petty can shoot. We know Shack can shoot. We know Ellis was one of the best JuCo shooters in the country. There's just no explanation for it other than "Alabama basketball things."
Posted by FWBFLlaw
Member since Aug 2018
2546 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:14 am to
Yeah. I am not sure how much of bad practice is on the coaching staff. I know Saban has made the same complaints and no one questions him. A lot of it is in the players and leadership at this point. It is CNO second season on what is likely a complete rebuild. Plus, Stanford is not a bad team with lots of returning starters and a lottery pick. It’s early in the 2nd season. Let’s see how they play moving forward.
Posted by paperwasp
2x HRV 2025 Poster of the Year
Member since Sep 2014
30007 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:15 am to
quote:

There's just no explanation for it

Seriously though, what could it be?

Assuming they are making most of these shots repetitively in practice, what's logically different during the game? Is it something the defense is doing that we're not prepared for, a random external factor (like the logistics on a different court), lack of confidence, just a random mental thing?

Shooters can have off-nights, but how can essentially the whole team, all at once? It's baffling.
Posted by wm72
Brooklyn
Member since Mar 2010
9421 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:16 am to
quote:

thought we started to take more and more questionable shots as the game went


Agree. Offense looked a little better in 1st 8-10 minutes but we missed some good shots and blew some breakouts that should have been easy baskets.


Honestly, Oats is right to talk rebounding and Stanford being a step faster to loose balls.

However, think he also got outcoached a bit. Stanford was able to adjust on defense and really bothered us with the smothering perimeter defense.

Some of that is only JQ and Herb being able to consistently take a defender off dribble but there was a lot of "uncertainty" resulting in forced shots that seemed like players weren't in a comfort zone dealing with the looks Stanford's defense showed them.

The "surprising" metric posted above concerning point expectation based on shots emphasizes just how many bad, frustrated shots we took.
Posted by phil4bama
Emerald Coast of PCB
Member since Jul 2011
11940 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:19 am to
quote:

It's definitely not. Petty usually plays with a lot of effort. He occasionally half asses it, but a lot of our fans want to pretend he's Tony Mitchell and just mails it in if he doesn't score in the first 3 minutes of the game despite there being absolutely zero evidence of that. From a leadership standpoint this group's problem is that they don't really have an emotional leader. They didn't last year either. Herb and Petty aren't those kind of players and Bruner doesn't appear to be either.




THAT is exactly what I'm saying, I'm not questioning his effort, I'm questioning his Alpha male-ness I guess. We don't have one and we need one. We need a player that gets on asses when somebody does something stupid or loafs and someone that calms them down when shite goes sideways like last night. When things got away from us at the end of the first half, we collapsed. That's what's missing; the guy that can calm jangled nerves, make a couple of shots, and right the ship to at least get back in the game.
If you carefully read my post, I never called Petty lazy, I called him out for not leading. He's the senior in the best position to be the guy everyone looks to for leadership, for emotional fire when needed and a steadying hand when needed. John doesn't want that mantle. He's made that clear. It's not purely an indictment, maybe that isn't who he is. But that's what Alabama basketball needs him or someone else to be. It frustrates me and probably many of you and certainly Oats that John isn't that guy, and we don't apparently have one.

ETA: and I guarantee you we see that game plan Stanford used again because they totally blew us the frick up with it. Nate better figure that one out.
This post was edited on 12/1/20 at 9:56 am
Posted by Teague
The Shoals, AL
Member since Aug 2007
22277 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:29 am to
quote:

and I guarantee you we see that game plan Stanford used again because they totally blew us the frick up with it. Nate better figure that one out.


Yeah, maybe, but I think their freshman phenom making everything he threw up made this game look worse than it was. I guess you could say we should have defended him better, but that dude is either really really good, or he had a really really good night.
Posted by mistaken4193
Member since Jan 2017
30377 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:34 am to
I have no expectations for tonight. Im gonna hate watch the frick out of it tho
Posted by Bear88
Member since Oct 2014
15079 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:40 am to
Was traveling so had to listen on radio... cut it off about 7 minutes into second half , couldn’t take it anymore . Sounded brutal . Maybe the guys will bounce back tonight but definitely wasn’t expecting that type of loss
Posted by Robot Santa
Member since Oct 2009
46353 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:41 am to
You literally said that if Petty is off he doesn't want to accept any leadership responsibility, and only begrudgingly accepts it even when he's hot. A ton of y'all just seem hell bent on making the poor kid the scapegoat anytime we don't play well for some ridiculous reason and have been pushing that narrative for the past 3 seasons. He typically plays hard and tries his best to help the team win even if he's not making his outside shots. I mean you're basically criticizing his personality at this point. Not everyone is a vocal, emotional person. Is there anyone on this team who is? I'm really not sure, but I don't think so. That's definitely a problem, but it isn't like it's some personal failing on their part either.
Posted by saban n bear
Member since Aug 2013
2987 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:43 am to
Can we also put to rest the “my God, Herb’s defense is just so damn good that if he could shoot, NBA teams would be salivating over him” nonsense? Herbs D is above average against your basic college competition, but Ziaire Williams just proved first hand Herb ain’t shutting down no nba caliber guys
This post was edited on 12/1/20 at 8:44 am
Posted by Robot Santa
Member since Oct 2009
46353 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:44 am to
quote:

but that dude is either really really good, or he had a really really good night.


It's both. He's really good but also made a lot more low probability shots than even elite players are typically going to make. In typical Alabama basketball fashion we couldn't hit water if we fell out of a boat while our opponent's basket might as well have been 6 feet wide.
Posted by MontyFranklyn
T-Town
Member since Jan 2012
24299 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:46 am to
True
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