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re: What would have happened
Posted on 11/23/20 at 1:50 pm to meansonny
Posted on 11/23/20 at 1:50 pm to meansonny
quote:
I think a healthy Bennett would get the win against Miss St.
Not sure I agree on this one. Unfortunately, we just didn't have answers defensively that day. We needed to move the ball, and it had to come on downfield passing based on what they schemed to do defensively. Even a healthy Bennett has shown that his accuracy on throws greater than 15 yards would not have been good enough.
Thankfully, JT was ready and we didn't have to find out.
1
Posted on 11/23/20 at 2:07 pm to fibonaccisquared
No one can predict batted balls.
Miss St was giving us the middle of the field if we wanted it. Not every throw needed to be a deep shot.
If the balls arent batted, a healthy Bennett would have been capable of moving the ball and scoring TDs.
A healthy Bennett also is less likely to take all of those sacks. And is more likely to add value in the running game.
Like you said, fortunately we had Daniels and there is no need to wonder about Mathis or an unhealthy Bennett.
It was neat to see Daniels mature the longer he was out there. He obviously had no pocket trust at the start of the game (post traumatic stress from his time at southern cal, no doubt).
That makes me wonder how he would look if he had gotten starting time several games ago.
Miss St was giving us the middle of the field if we wanted it. Not every throw needed to be a deep shot.
If the balls arent batted, a healthy Bennett would have been capable of moving the ball and scoring TDs.
A healthy Bennett also is less likely to take all of those sacks. And is more likely to add value in the running game.
Like you said, fortunately we had Daniels and there is no need to wonder about Mathis or an unhealthy Bennett.
It was neat to see Daniels mature the longer he was out there. He obviously had no pocket trust at the start of the game (post traumatic stress from his time at southern cal, no doubt).
That makes me wonder how he would look if he had gotten starting time several games ago.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 4:02 pm to meansonny
quote:
That makes me wonder how he would look if he had gotten starting time several games ago.
Yeah... I have to imagine that he wasn't physically ready to go by the Kentucky game, because if he was and we held him out still, that's bordering on criminal negligence on Smart's part. At a minimum, it would have forced UF to prepare for multiple QBs (3 legitimately, though in hindsight, they may not have needed to worry about Mathis
) with different strengths/weaknesses. The collective loss to the overall team from the UK weekend was exorbitantly high. Kinda sucks that the game was shifted around due to UF's own inability to manage their Covid protocol, and then they benefitted from that shift in bye week leaving no time for recovery following the weekend of injury losses.
Ultimately, with what we've seen now, I still maintain that this was a pretty flawed team, and a second shot at Bama likely only reaffirms the outcome, maybe a little closer, but still a likely loss. Maybe we stem the bleeding on downfield shots a little more in the second half, but Kirby/Lanning will have some serious introspection ahead as they think about what they need to do schematically against teams that have receivers that you can't just press man/outphysical your way into submission. I'm very curious to see what happens with all of the DB slots in 2021, but in particular the Nickel/Dime. We've all lamented for the last few years about how much of a liability Webb can be at times. I'd like to think that Kirby recruiting all these DB recruits over the last few years is able to improve that position rather than have a drop off.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 4:10 pm to fibonaccisquared
quote:
I'm very curious to see what happens with all of the DB slots in 2021, but in particular the Nickel/Dime. We've all lamented for the last few years about how much of a liability Webb can be at times. I'd like to think that Kirby recruiting all these DB recruits over the last few years is able to improve that position rather than have a drop off.
I love what Webb and Stevenson give us as sure tacklers. And stevenson adds a blitz threat.
But we certainly have been exposed against man coverage against several teams.
For the longest time, I had thought it was the caliber of nickel (tyreque mcghee). But I'm just at the point of thinking that it is these safety body types who cant function in a man role against speedy wideout/slot guys.
I would honestly rather roll a Tyson Campbell to the slot and roll with Stokes/Daniel on the outside.
I know that it isnt as easy as snapping a finger and changing a guys position. But 1 of our 3 CBs is a better pure tackler. And he can better man (imo) the responsibilities in the slot and man coverage when it is called upon.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 4:12 pm to fibonaccisquared
What do we expect from the secondary?
Everyone is getting burned regularly. I'm not sure about Saturday's strategy, and I'm inclined to believe there could be some improvement. Realistically, though, what unit in the country is much better?
Everyone is getting burned regularly. I'm not sure about Saturday's strategy, and I'm inclined to believe there could be some improvement. Realistically, though, what unit in the country is much better?
Posted on 11/23/20 at 4:18 pm to meansonny
As for 2021, we have Campbell, Ringo, and Kimber as our 3 corners.
Put campbell and ringo at CB in base defense.
In nickel, rotate campbell and Stevenson based upon opponent/scheme. And have Kimber fill in the vacated corner spot.
Put campbell and ringo at CB in base defense.
In nickel, rotate campbell and Stevenson based upon opponent/scheme. And have Kimber fill in the vacated corner spot.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 5:33 pm to chillmonster
quote:Burned means beat one on one. Miss State picked and dinked us in man and ran curls/settle routes under our zone. Their QB did a good job making the reads. In the second half, we started showing some more fronts and blitzing, combo and robbers. Once we messed with him and put him under more heat, he didn’t do nearly as well. Kinda similar to UF. We can’t give guys clean pockets all the game. We have made some mistakes in coverage, but our coverage gets significantly better when we don’t give QBs clean and easy looks. Thats our issue on defense.
What do we expect from the secondary?
Everyone is getting burned regularly. ?
Posted on 11/23/20 at 5:47 pm to Peter Buck
quote:
We have made some mistakes in coverage,
I've mistakenly put a lot of coverage blame on the ILBs.
Watching film reviews and watching a game for a second time, I'm finding myself embarrassed for calling out the ILBs as much as I have.
The reality is that Monty Rice has often been the nearest defender standing next to a busted play (wheel routes in particular). Review has shown multiple busts by tyson campbell, bust by stokes, and some poor tackling from Smith/burns making the ILB coverage look a lot worse than it should be.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 6:09 pm to meansonny
A RB wheel is typically the responsibility of one of the LBs in man.
One adjustment we made was lining up with 4 and having 44 drop into a spy, which also lead to taking away the throwing lane in the middle, while sending pressure on the outsides.
One adjustment we made was lining up with 4 and having 44 drop into a spy, which also lead to taking away the throwing lane in the middle, while sending pressure on the outsides.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 6:12 pm to Peter Buck
People also forget that we dropped two guaranteed pick-6's and a possible 3rd pick-six. Scheme would have been considered genius!
Posted on 11/23/20 at 6:35 pm to Peter Buck
quote:
A RB wheel is typically the responsibility of one of the LBs in man.
Against florida, we had cover 3.
Twice, Campbell was responsible for his zone and he trailed a receiver up the middle. Stokes did the same thing on another play. Nearest defender standing was Rice on all 3 plays and he took the brunt of my anger.
We tried everything against Florida. Safeties were also responsible (missed tackles by burns and smith). On another wheel route, travon walker was supposed to pick up the RB and he got caught with eyes in the backfield.
I remember seeing another similar situation against Miss St where Webb was the closest defender standing and he was obviously upset that someone else lost responsibility
Posted on 11/23/20 at 6:59 pm to meansonny
quote:
Against florida, we had cover 3.
Twice, Campbell was responsible for his zone and he trailed a receiver up the middle. Stokes did the same thing on another play. Nearest defender standing was Rice on all 3 plays and he took the brunt of my anger.
We tried everything against Florida. Safeties were also responsible (missed tackles by burns and smith). On another wheel route, travon walker was supposed to pick up the RB and he got caught with eyes in the backfield.
I remember seeing another similar situation against Miss St where Webb was the closest defender standing and he was obviously upset that someone else lost responsibility
We could dissect every play but in the case of Campbell, I am inclined to think those were option routes where if Campbell is back-pedaling, then hitch. If Campbell comes close, go. Really nothing you can do to defend, if receiver and qb do their jobs right.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 7:08 pm to deeprig9
The all 22 makes it pretty apparent when there is cover 3.
It doesnt matter if the WR is in an option route or not... the defender shouldnt do more than his responsibility.
Defense rarely covers 2/3 deep based on how a defensive playcall is designed.
Credit to OCs for messing with eye discipline and the QB for catching it.
It doesnt matter if the WR is in an option route or not... the defender shouldnt do more than his responsibility.
Defense rarely covers 2/3 deep based on how a defensive playcall is designed.
Credit to OCs for messing with eye discipline and the QB for catching it.
Posted on 11/23/20 at 8:10 pm to meansonny
If you are in cover 3, you have the deepest guy in your zone. The wheel came underneath it in UF’s scheme, they developed fasterand were caught within 5 yards of the LOS. Not the CBs responsibility
Posted on 11/24/20 at 6:25 am to Peter Buck
The disconnect we are having is that there was no one pushing deep in the third (resulting in no one there to make the tackle either).
Florida was running digs on that side. The CBs lost eye discipline on their third. One time, Campbell latched onto a post into the mid third. Me as a fan see Rice trying to run down the wheel from behind and like you thinking that it should be the ILB picking up the wheel.
Honestly, if the CB had maintained responsibility, they would have been able to disrupt the throw (wheel is not a flat) or crushed the receiver after the catch. Digs and posts moved the CB off their spot leaving no one on the wheel.
Florida was running digs on that side. The CBs lost eye discipline on their third. One time, Campbell latched onto a post into the mid third. Me as a fan see Rice trying to run down the wheel from behind and like you thinking that it should be the ILB picking up the wheel.
Honestly, if the CB had maintained responsibility, they would have been able to disrupt the throw (wheel is not a flat) or crushed the receiver after the catch. Digs and posts moved the CB off their spot leaving no one on the wheel.
Posted on 11/24/20 at 6:28 am to Peter Buck
quote:
caught within 5 yards of the LOS.
Replays will show most of the wheels about 10-15 yards beyond the line. And the wheel wasnt only the RB. WRs and TEs also were running the same route.
Agreed that the CBs werent responsible 5 yards past the LOS. But that isnt where most of them hit.
Posted on 11/24/20 at 7:29 am to chillmonster
Everyone knew Stets limitations. In the end, he saved us from a far worse season while JT got healthy.
Kirby always knew this. Mathis just didn't have it.
Wish we could go back to just supporting the team and enjoying football.
Kirby always knew this. Mathis just didn't have it.
Wish we could go back to just supporting the team and enjoying football.
Posted on 11/24/20 at 7:38 am to lewis and herschel
quote:
Mathis just didn't have it.
We may never know.
Mathis was a feel good story and I am happy for the young that he has recovered from brain surgery but life after brain surgery is serious business. I don't think he will ever be the QB that he might have been which is entirely understandable. Or yea, maybe he just didn't have what it takes to be a successful QB regardless. But as I said, I guess he and we will never know.
This post was edited on 11/24/20 at 8:47 am
Posted on 11/24/20 at 8:40 am to lewis and herschel
quote:
Wish we could go back to just supporting the team and enjoying football.
When was this?
Posted on 11/24/20 at 9:20 am to chillmonster
quote:
What do we expect from the secondary?
Everyone is getting burned regularly. I'm not sure about Saturday's strategy, and I'm inclined to believe there could be some improvement. Realistically, though, what unit in the country is much better?
Our secondary was not as responsible for the Bama and Gator losses as some may think. Offenses today are wide open, with 4 and 5 receivers going out. If the defense can't pressure the QB he will pick every defense apart because it is nearly impossible for any DB to cover fast WRs for more than 3-4 seconds. That's how Bama and Florida scored long balls.
Saturday our 3-man rush never got close to the QB and he dinked us to death. Their average pass play was 6.5 yards. When we loaded the line a little more we shut down the passing game in the second half. I kept looking for an OLB or safety blitz in the first half but we never did anything to pressure their QB. He had time to wait for a receiver to come open. Watch the last 20 minutes of the game and they did nothing.
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