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NBA MVP
Posted on 4/12/17 at 8:52 pm
Posted on 4/12/17 at 8:52 pm
the rockets are campaigning like ive never seen before to get harden this thing. whos it going to be?
Posted on 4/12/17 at 11:13 pm to Uncle Gunnysack
It's going to be Westbrook. If I had a vote, it would be for Harden. I can understand why people want Westbrook, but it would be pretty historic to give it to someone with so few wins. I don't think it happened in like 40 some years.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 12:16 am to Farmer1906
if there was ever a season for co-mvps its this one. i think harden wins though
Posted on 4/13/17 at 7:43 am to Uncle Gunnysack
Harden's performance deserves an MVP, but I think Westbrook breaking the triple double record, paired with a couple game winners will be too much to overcome.
I personally would vote Harden, but I am more than a little biased.
I personally would vote Harden, but I am more than a little biased.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 7:50 am to Uncle Gunnysack
Rocketfan is so overly invested in the MVP race this year. Fun to frick with them
My guy is Kawhilights, of course.
My guy is Kawhilights, of course.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 8:03 am to TbirdSpur2010
Are you upset that SA's ceiling this year is round 2?
Posted on 4/13/17 at 8:41 am to TbirdSpur2010
It's been an incredible year for MVP candidates. I don't really buy the "should have had more wins" argument. If they didn't make the playoffs, I'd agree.
He led the league in scoring and averaged a triple double, while breaking one of the records most thought unreachable, with a team full of slaw.
Don't get me wrong, If i'm starting a team I'd take Kawhi first out of the 3, and harden put up historic numbers as well, I just think you have to reward him for making history.
I mean he basically roasted the whole league all year long in a revenge tour.
He led the league in scoring and averaged a triple double, while breaking one of the records most thought unreachable, with a team full of slaw.
Don't get me wrong, If i'm starting a team I'd take Kawhi first out of the 3, and harden put up historic numbers as well, I just think you have to reward him for making history.
I mean he basically roasted the whole league all year long in a revenge tour.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 9:36 am to Nguyening
A couple things that bother me about Rus's MVP.
1. If he wins it breaks precedent of giving it to a winner. They won 47 games. The NBA hasn't given it to someone with such poor of a record since 1982 for Moses Malone (25-15-2-1-1). If voters not longer care about the W column then we may need to retroactively give an MVP to Kobe in 06 and 07.
2. Rus was chasing numbers. He was looking to fill up his stat sheet whether they were up 20 or down 20. There was a reason he lead the league by a wide margin in uncontested rebounds. I don't blame him for this, but I also wouldn't reward him for it either.
1. If he wins it breaks precedent of giving it to a winner. They won 47 games. The NBA hasn't given it to someone with such poor of a record since 1982 for Moses Malone (25-15-2-1-1). If voters not longer care about the W column then we may need to retroactively give an MVP to Kobe in 06 and 07.
2. Rus was chasing numbers. He was looking to fill up his stat sheet whether they were up 20 or down 20. There was a reason he lead the league by a wide margin in uncontested rebounds. I don't blame him for this, but I also wouldn't reward him for it either.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 10:31 am to Farmer1906
quote:
1. If he wins it breaks precedent of giving it to a winner. They won 47 games. The NBA hasn't given it to someone with such poor of a record since 1982 for Moses Malone (25-15-2-1-1). If voters not longer care about the W column then we may need to retroactively give an MVP to Kobe in 06 and 07.
I mean Harden had 7 more wins than Russ, but Kawhi had 6 more than Harden. Wins are a team stat. Obviously a "most" valuable player is adding to that number, but you have to take into account where they would be without him as well.
quote:
2. Rus was chasing numbers. He was looking to fill up his stat sheet whether they were up 20 or down 20. There was a reason he lead the league by a wide margin in uncontested rebounds. I don't blame him for this, but I also wouldn't reward him for it either.
I mean, uncontested rebounds happen for point guards. If you have a post and your point in position for the same uncontested rebound you're going to defer to the guy who needs to bring it up the court anyway. RW and Harden both made the top 20 for defensive rebounds and not for offensive, which would imply both got their fair share of gimmes.
I don't claim to be an expert about these ratings or this Source, but...
PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING:
1) RW 30.6
3) Kawhi 27.5
5) Harden 27.3
PLUS/MINUS:
1) RW 15.5
2) Harden 10.1
7) Kawhi 7.9
D +/-:
2)RW 4.7
other 2 not in top 20 (Kawhi because of his matchups, harden for obvious reasons)
O +/-:
1) RW 10.9
2-3*) Harden 8.7 (*tied with Isaiah Thomas when rounded to tenths)
VALUE ABOVE REPLACEMENT:
1) RW 12.4
2) Harden 9.0
7) Kawhi 6.2
Posted on 4/13/17 at 10:54 am to Uncle Gunnysack
I love the Rockets/Harden but I don't have a problem with Russ winning it. I'm a fan of Westbrook so that probably helps, but his on/off numbers are pretty staggering. The Thunder are one of the worst teams in the NBA when he's not on the floor. The same can't be said for the Rockets
The rebounding argument is dumb as well IMO, Westbrook is absolutely lethal in transition so him getting uncontested rebounds is great for their team
I think both players are deserving but I'll be happy for Westbrook if he does win it
The rebounding argument is dumb as well IMO, Westbrook is absolutely lethal in transition so him getting uncontested rebounds is great for their team
I think both players are deserving but I'll be happy for Westbrook if he does win it
Posted on 4/13/17 at 11:17 am to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:
The Thunder are one of the worst teams in the NBA when he's not on the floor.
I will argue until the day I die that this is because they have completely built themselves around Westbrook getting a triple double. Oladipo, Adams, Kanter, etc. were all considered great players last year, but now they are being underutilized in the name of getting Westbrook his numbers.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 11:24 am to Nguyening
quote:
I mean Harden had 8 more wins than Russ, but Kawhi had 6 more than Harden. Wins are a team stat. Obviously a "most" valuable player is adding to that number, but you have to take into account where they would be without him as well.
One minor correction above.
You bring up a good point. Where would they be? Both teams went through huge transformations. Most people considered the Thunder to be better than the Rockets before the season started. Harden took predictions of around ~41 wins and turned it into 55. Westbrook took a projection of ~45 and turned it into 47. Harden also leads Westbrook in win shares this year.
My point in the original statement was that the voters has always put winning as a big factor in the MVP. History shows the large majority of MVPs finish top 3. You have to go back 30+ years to find an instance of ignoring Bird/the Celts dominance in favor of Moses's strong stats.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 1:01 pm to Farmer1906
quote:
2. Rus was chasing numbers.
Rockets/Harden fans trying to downgrade another player for "chasing numbers" is absolutely precious.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 3:35 pm to Farmer1906
There is no need to expound. Just watch the games. There have been plenty of times he padded stats when he didn't need to.
It's no big deal. Plenty of ball dominant players do it. But to act like it's something Westbrook is more prone to doing is just as silly as some of the people on the MSB trying to act like OKC's scorekeeper gooses WB's assist numbers when it's pretty common for all home scorekeepers to do that w/their star players.
It's no big deal. Plenty of ball dominant players do it. But to act like it's something Westbrook is more prone to doing is just as silly as some of the people on the MSB trying to act like OKC's scorekeeper gooses WB's assist numbers when it's pretty common for all home scorekeepers to do that w/their star players.
This post was edited on 4/13/17 at 3:37 pm
Posted on 4/13/17 at 4:46 pm to Farmer1906
quote:
Are you upset that SA's ceiling this year is round 2?
Y'all just handle your business vs. OKC so you can come down here and get this asswhooping.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 6:06 pm to Dr RC
I do watch the games. As a Rocket fan I probably watch more Rockets games than the avg NBA fan and I have no damn clue what you're talking about. There may be times where they jack up a few 3s when they're blowing a team out, but its nothing blatant that effects the outcome of games.
So once again, expound a little. Give a few examples maybe if its so obvious.
So once again, expound a little. Give a few examples maybe if its so obvious.
Posted on 4/13/17 at 6:07 pm to TbirdSpur2010
We can take an asswhipping at SA. We can take 3 of them. We'll just own Toyota and steal one at da boof.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 7:24 pm to Farmer1906
Y'all will take 4 asswhoopings and like them.
Good luck vs. OKC. Hope we get an I-10 series after
Good luck vs. OKC. Hope we get an I-10 series after
Posted on 4/16/17 at 7:47 pm to TbirdSpur2010
Bird, you're welcome to join me at a game in Toyota if you can find a way not to choke vs Memphis.
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