re: Has Kirby Smart passed Spurrier? I say ....

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But how is that innovative or transformative? Does it require some great football mind to figure that out?

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that's like saying "how is lining up 5 WRs and throwing all day innovative"? I mean at its core there's nothing special about it, but spurrier perfected that particular systme in a time when other people weren't doing it. There's nothign super special about recruiting, but kirby has shown over his entire career as an assistant and HC that there are very, very few people in america as good at it as he is.

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that's like saying "how is lining up 5 WRs and throwing all day innovative"? I mean at its core there's nothing special about it, but spurrier perfected that particular systme in a time when other people weren't doing it. There's nothign super special about recruiting, but kirby has shown over his entire career as an assistant and HC that there are very, very few people in america as good at it as he is.

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A couple of things. You've obviously never looked at SOS's playbook or route concepts that deeply. Most folks think Spurrier's play book was just 5 go routes and "throw it deep." It's wasn't. Where Spurrier took the game to the next level was by forcing the defense to make choices about where and how to cover multiple receivers in space and where one receiver's route worked to open other receivers. Every one on his route trees stresses a defense in different ways and works to get receivers open on this play AND the next play. Additionally, he was one of the 1st to use the pass to set up the run. While is commonplace for us to speak of it today, it had never really been done before Spurrier. THAT'S what I mean when I say Spurrier was a transformative coach, and why, while very very good, Kirby hasn't "passed" Spurrier yet (at least in this regard).

There is more than one way to win football games and championships. Kirby's found a way to win games and championships that works for UGA in this day and age and good for him. This is obviously the yardstick that UGA fans are using here to measure the two coaches. With that being said, there are also multiple ways to judge football coaches beyond wins and losses. That's obviously the yard stick that myself and others that are in SOS's corner are using. I'd say that Kirby is an outstanding CEO with a good football mind. Outside of Saban, I'd say he's the best in the game at this. On the flip side, I'd say Spurrier had a great football (one of the greatest of all time) mind and was a good CEO.

As an example of, I'll use an anecdote that Beamer told this year or last. He said that one year when he was special teams coordinator for Spurrier he was prepping for a big game (maybe a bowl??) on the road. The day before the game in Beamer was in his hotel room stressing over every little detail of the Special teams plan. Then he looked out the window and saw Spurrier down by the pool with his shirt off relaxing with a beer. He said at that point he realized that he need to relax and trust his preparation. Does anyone think they'd catch Kirby chilling by the pool with a beer the day before the Natty? No way. And not that that's a bad thing either, it's just their personalities.

If I'm being 100% honest here, in today's football world, I think so far as winning games goes, the former (CEO type coach) trumps the later. As for examples of this, I'll point to Spurrier's last few years and Mike Leach at Mississippi State (who I think we can all agree had a outstanding vison of the game from an X's and O's point of view). Both won their fair share of games, but lost a few as well.

And there is nothing wrong with being either of those type of coaches. As I said at the start of this, there is more than one way to win games...

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Defensively, it is the same defense that Kirby helped pioneer at Alabama. It is as much Kirby's defense as it is Sabans (by Saban's inability to replicate it with the past couple of DCs). No other major P5 university other than Bama has built a defense where the linebackers can be so multiple.

Why is it unique?
Because you are teaching a revolving door of 18, 19, 20, and 21, and 22 year olds multiple schemes at once.
You are creating the most stress possible during weekly practices (including hitting) to get the correct speed of the game in those minds with all that they have to key and retain.

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I wouldn't say there is anything particularly innovative about the 3-4 base package Kirby runs. But where I'll give Kirby credit is this: To be run properly, it takes a special kind of athlete to populate that defense, and there aren't that many of them out there. It all starts at the NT, and literally and figuratively moves out from there. If you can find that rare combination of Big, Fast and Physical then you can have something special (re: Jordan Davis is the prototype that I'm thinking of here). Additionally, the type of linebacker that you need to run the 3-4 is also a rare breed of size and speed. Many of UGA's linebackers would be outstanding DE's on most other teams. The fact that they're playing LB for UGA is impressive. Kirby's ability to both locate and develop these types of players is outstanding. That's a plus in his corner.

This is a tough question to answer, in a debate that usually isnt that hard.

Spurrier struggled to win that FSU game or he probably has a few more natties. Thats on him, but he made that right at Carolina winning the clemson game and keeping dabo from rising up (until he left us).

Spurrier also took two bad programs and won. Florida was his easier job since athletes were all around. That said, Florida wasnt exactly a stellar program when he took over.

So spurrier is a guy who always elevated a program 10 fold. There is something to be said about that. Kirby has elevated UGA, but UGA had the support in place for that to happen.

Kirby doesnt have the personality that Steve had, so he won't be loved like Steve is. Thats fine, he wins ball games and recruits well.

As far as passed, Spurrier built himself a place in a history that I dont know that you pass, but you maybe join.

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To come on here and dump BS about how our defense runs through the nose tackle (when we have 4 players at the nose on any given 1st down in 2022) is laughable.

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UGA has a deep roster. Congratulations.

My point is/was, and granted I didn't elucidate it very well, you have to have "that player" that holds down the middle so the LB's can shine. That's the key to a 3-4 defense and why it's hard for most schools to run run effectively.

And, my point about Davis is/was that if you could design the perfect NT for Kirby's defense that would be him. It was not that he's the only player that could do the job.

Furthermore, what you describe isn't anything special. It's what pretty much every coach is forced to do, make the most of their roster with the players they have available. In a perfect world, not every team is going to have the players to do exactly what any coach wants to do at any given time (due to depth injuries, etc). Kirby just has more choices than almost everyone else when it comes to putting square pegs in round holes...

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So what? Shane Beamer beat two top 6 teams in the last two weeks of the season. My guess is, Spurrier never had the OPPORTUNITY to go for that feat...

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Shane beamer didn't play two top 4 teams in the last 2 weeks of the season....they played Notre Dame who was ranked #14. Steve Spurrier also never beat 2 to 4 teams to end the season. Kirby Smart just did it two years in a row.

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GA Southern.

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I was there, Hail Southern!

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Kirby has elevated UGA, but UGA had the support in place for that to happen.

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Kirby has support because he demanded it or he wouldn't have agreed to come here.

Our AD that hired kirby is the same one that didn't let us build an IPF until kirby got here. The same one that refused to give richt money to give assistants raises so Richt had to pay them out of his own pocket. All the "support" that kirby has is becuase he said if you don't give it to me I'm going somewhere else.

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And what doomed Spurrier at South Carolina is what ultimately doomed him at Florida.

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Doomed him at Florida? He left for the NFL in his prime. It’s not like he started losing there

He got old at USC and wasn’t a Saban type who had the drive to keep grinding at his age. But winning 11 games three years in a row there is pretty nuts for a guy who apparently hated recruiting. Must have been a pretty good coach to win like that with no talent

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No way to know fersure but 98, 99, and 2000 all come to mind. UF was ranked in the top4 but lost to FSU

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01 as well Osama stole a natty from them with the schedule change