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re: Does Texas or Oklahoma know what is happening?

Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:04 am to
Posted by MosesRAB93
Dallas area
Member since Apr 2014
340 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:04 am to
quote:

quote:

You guys sound just like TAMU, who tried to make a living off of beating BAMA in 2012 at Tuscaloosa. That BAMA team won the NC.

How so? That a&m team didn’t finish in the top 4, didn’t win their conference, and weren’t a play away from playing for a national title


You mean the one that y’all let OU take your asskicking from in the 2013 Cotton Bowl?
This post was edited on 7/16/24 at 7:06 am
Posted by Gunga Din
Oklahoma
Member since Jul 2020
2494 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:14 am to
quote:

If you do not have lineman 3 deep who are talented enough to start anywhere you are behind the curve in the SEC. The arse kicking that goes on in the trenches in the SEC when Vandy plays Mississippi State is slightly more brutal than what goes on elsewhere when to tier teams play. There are 8 weeks of that arse kicking. It takes its toll.


First of all...

The "SEC beats each other up" narrative has been around for decades. I remember hearing it in the 1970s.

And while there is evidence that the narrative is actually true for the last while... it is nice to see someone actually admit that Georgia and Alabama (or whoever team #2 is at the time) seem to be immune to it as far as wins and losses.

The larger question here as far as Oklahoma and Texas are concerned is where they will fit into the matrix. `It is pretty evident that they don't belong (beside perhaps Texas' '23 team) that they aren't at the level of the top two.

I think OU and Texas fans think they will fit in at the top of the second tier of teams which this year is likely going to be Tennessee, Ole Miss, Missouri, and perhaps A&M.

SEC fans seem to think they will likely be at the bottom of that group and will be vulnerable to the lower half of the league.

Posted by bamameister
Right here, right now
Member since May 2016
16593 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:33 am to
quote:

The larger question here as far as Oklahoma and Texas are concerned is where they will fit into the matrix.


If Oklahoma is running behind the shorthorns it's a one-year sample size. Venables has big questions to answer about his rebuilt offensive line and new offense. That could all change and flip by next preseason.

The Shorthorns also have plenty to answer about their head coach this year. Sarkisian has never sustained elite success at Washington or USC. Sarkisian has never had back-to-back 10-win seasons. Hell, Sarkisian has never had more than ONE 10-win season in the last 13 years.
Posted by AwgustaDawg
CSRA
Member since Jan 2023
11533 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:39 am to
quote:

Show us the evidence that your teams finish the regular season with more attrition than teams in other conferences "because of the gauntlet". I want to see it.



One of 5 SEC teams has finished the season as national champs 13(?) of the last 20 seasons. Those 5 teams were loaded with NFL talent and high quality depth...that's how they managed the gauntlet. They were not unscathed, they simply had enough quality depth to overcome the grind. In that same period one team from the BIG12 managed to win a national championship.

The difference is not one of night and day. It is very slight. It is, however, very real.

Texas AM and Missouri are prime examples. ATM has not made the SEC CG and Missouri managed to do it with 3 SEC east teams in rebuild mode. UGA, UT and UF were a combined 31-34 in the 2 years Missouri won the SEC East. UGA beat Missouri in 2013. Missouri beat Oklahoma State (BIG12) in 2014. The 2 have a combined SEC record since joining the conference of 98-96 and have had 6 seasons where they won more in conference than they lost, 3 each. Obviously ATM nor Missouri have been comparable to Oklahoma in the last 11 years but they have been comparable to Texas.

Finally, when OU and UT have faced top tier SEC teams, the 5 who have won Nattys over the last 20 years, the 2 are a combined 5-7, less succesful than ATM and Missouri have been in the same period.

The grind is real. UT and OU are both capable of maneuvering it but they aren't built for it currently, especially OU. Both will fare better than ATM and Missouri over time because both are historically better programs. Historically they have not faced what the SEC represents currently.
Posted by TizzyT4theUofA
This side of eternity
Member since Jun 2016
11620 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:41 am to
quote:

Smokey Okie


Posted by AwgustaDawg
CSRA
Member since Jan 2023
11533 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:44 am to
quote:

I wonder if being in the SEC will help OU not get destroyed every time they make the playoff? Or will the SEC keep their weak arse teams from actually getting a spot to begin with.



Oklahoma will get over it. Steel hardens steel and OU is competitive....programmatically they have the resources and will use them to be competitive at the top of the SEC. They are not, from all outward appearances, ready right now. That will change. Neither OU nor UT are ATM and Missouri...programmatically they are as different from those 2 as the SEC is to the conferences OU and Texas have belonged to prior to this season.

It is asinine to think that OU and UT won't be competitive in the SEC. It is equally asinine to think that either will do what Alabama has done recently. Given that Alabama did it in a period when the SEC was historically good and the conference is still in that period it is unlikely ANYONE will do what Alabama has done. UT and OU will win the SEC. Texas very well could do so this season. They are not going to dominate the conference anymore than LSU or UGA has done. They will win their share for certain....they most likely do not do what Alabama has done.
Posted by Soonerboomer1
Arizona via Hollywood, CA
Member since Jun 2024
121 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:47 am to
No. Most OU fans will never shout SEC SEC SEC because we don't

A. Ride Bama's coattails
B. Like our rivals.
C. Are a blueblood
Posted by AwgustaDawg
CSRA
Member since Jan 2023
11533 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:52 am to
quote:

And while there is evidence that the narrative is actually true for the last while... it is nice to see someone actually admit that Georgia and Alabama (or whoever team #2 is at the time) seem to be immune to it as far as wins and losses.

The larger question here as far as Oklahoma and Texas are concerned is where they will fit into the matrix. `It is pretty evident that they don't belong (beside perhaps Texas' '23 team) that they aren't at the level of the top two.

I think OU and Texas fans think they will fit in at the top of the second tier of teams which this year is likely going to be Tennessee, Ole Miss, Missouri, and perhaps A&M.

SEC fans seem to think they will likely be at the bottom of that group and will be vulnerable to the lower half of the league.



Quality depth is what has been the difference for Alabama and UGA.

I think UT is currently in the upper tier of the SEC - not sure what they lost from last years team. I think OU is in the middle of the pack of the second tier teams listed, maybe closer to the top of that tier.

Anyone who thinks OU and UT are going to be second tier or worse SEC teams year in and out is foolish. The same is true of anyone who thinks either wins the SEC 80% of the time.

It is a different race for certain...both are built to run it, just a question of depth at this point, in my mind. A little luck can mitigate depth issues also...it happens.
Posted by lefty08
Not in Auburn or Louisiana
Member since Aug 2014
6225 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:58 am to
Let’s put it this way, Texas is up around 30 games all time on Arkansas with Arkansas only having 23 wins all time against Texas

4 of this wins by Arkansas have been since the Hogs have joined the SEC, with one loss coming on 2004 by 2 points when Arkansas QB fumbled inside the Texas 20 with seconds remaining. All 4 wins have been blowouts, to Texas’ 2 wins. What happened in the series?

Arkansas has much more talent now than when we were in the SEC. The SEC is just different.
Posted by AwgustaDawg
CSRA
Member since Jan 2023
11533 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:58 am to
quote:

A. Ride Bama's coattails


5 SEC teams have won natty's in the last 20 years. I doubt any conference can make that claim over a 20 year period. Had Alabama not been on a historical run during that period the number of SEC natty's in that time frame is likely unchanged...in fact it could be argued were it not for Alabama UGA would have won it LAST year.
Posted by NewBOSSofSEC
Member since Jul 2024
251 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 11:42 am to
quote:

If you do not have lineman 3 deep who are talented enough to start anywhere you are behind the curve in the SEC.
New Mexico State, North Texas, App State...thanks for the good laugh
Posted by NewBOSSofSEC
Member since Jul 2024
251 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 11:44 am to
quote:

Arkansas has much more talent now than when we were in the SEC. The SEC is just different.
Is that what North Texas, BYU, etc, etc said
Posted by NewBOSSofSEC
Member since Jul 2024
251 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 11:51 am to
quote:

Historically they have not faced what the SEC represents currently.
Yes we have. We have a rivalry with 2 bluebloods (Nebraska and Texas), pretty much OUr entire history.
Posted by DawginSC
Member since Aug 2022
7341 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 12:00 pm to
quote:

Yes we have. We have a rivalry with 2 bluebloods (Nebraska and Texas), pretty much OUr entire history.


You keep making the mistake of thinking that tough opponents 1-2 times a year are the same as playing a conference schedule where every team is very talented.

It's just not.

It's the same argument a team like Boise State or UCF made where they play one tough opponent in a bowl (like BSU did when they played OU), they win, and then claim that because of that they would have won the Big 12.

And that's just not accurate. Boise State would have struggled to put together wins each week against a Big 12 schedule because the Big 12 teams top to bottom had more talent than what they faced in their G5 conference.

You saw that with UCF too. A 9 win team in their last two AAC seasons. They go to the Big 12? 6-7.

The gap between the AAC and Big 12 is the same as the gap between the Big 12 and SEC when looking at the talent level for teams in general.
Posted by Archibald
Member since Apr 2024
1979 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 12:09 pm to
quote:

You mean the one that y’all let OU take your asskicking from in the 2013 Cotton Bowl?
Lol huh? Texas finished third in the big 12 that year. That weren't even eligible for the cotton bowl
Posted by AG87
Anywhere but Austin
Member since Aug 2021
30 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 12:50 pm to
The only advantage Tx and OU have had is they have had 2 years to recruit saying "You will be playing in the SEC if you sign with us".

That is an advantage over Ark., TAMU, and Missouri who did not have that time and advantage.

Tx and OU have no idea what the SEC is like. Go to virtually any stadium in the SEC on Saturday in the fall and compare it to Kansas, Iowa, or Lubbock. It is not the same. This is saying nothing of the talent of the players in the SEC. The speed, size, and depth of rosters is apparent. It will be a surprise and interesting to see how they react.
Posted by Pimphand
Member since Sep 2021
2951 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 12:52 pm to
What a refreshing new take that nobody has parroted 100,000 times on this forum.

Remember Texas 8&4 came in and had their BEST SZN EVAR initially.

Mizzou won the east twice shortly after joining.

Your argument would be better couched on the long term trajectory but I am glad the fear is so palpable.
Posted by NewBOSSofSEC
Member since Jul 2024
251 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 1:02 pm to
quote:

You keep making the mistake of thinking that tough opponents 1-2 times a year are the same as playing a conference schedule where every team is very talented.
You keep making the mistake that a conference that routinely loses to the likes of app state, new mexico State, north texas is scary
Posted by CharlotteSooner
Member since Mar 2016
12966 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 1:10 pm to
quote:

The only advantage Tx and OU have had is they have had 2 years to recruit saying "You will be playing in the SEC if you sign with us".

That is an advantage over Ark., TAMU, and Missouri who did not have that time and advantage.


Yet you both achieved above expectations with mediocre rosters that weren't "2-3 deep to get through da SEC grind"



quote:

Tx and OU have no idea what the SEC is like. Go to virtually any stadium in the SEC on Saturday in the fall and compare it to Kansas, Iowa, or Lubbock. It is not the same. This is saying nothing of the talent of the players in the SEC. The speed, size, and depth of rosters is apparent. It will be a surprise and interesting to see how they react.


Yet neither aggie nor mizzou ever demonstrated any kind of difficulty playing in these "SEC environments". Neither of you pissed down your legs and/or fell apart during a game cuz "a SEC crowd". Nor did either of you lose half your starting roster to attrition "cuz a dat SEC grind".

None of what you espouse happened to either of your own teams when you joined, yet you both sit here like cucks ignoring your own history so you can toe the company line.
This post was edited on 7/16/24 at 1:47 pm
Posted by Archibald
Member since Apr 2024
1979 posts
Posted on 7/16/24 at 1:15 pm to
quote:

Tx and OU have no idea what the SEC is like. Go to virtually any stadium in the SEC on Saturday in the fall and compare it to Kansas, Iowa, or Lubbock. It is not the same. This is saying nothing of the talent of the players in the SEC. The speed, size, and depth of rosters is apparent. It will be a surprise and interesting to see how they react.
True that. Could you imagine if Texas had to play in a place like Tuscaloosa recently? They’d probably get DESTROYED!

Oh wait…
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