re: Anyone here think improving our relations with Russia is a bad idea?

What hyperbole?

quote:

---

Apart from when Russia was the Soviet Union, Russia and the US have had good relations. And why wouldn't they?

To top if off, Russia literally saved the Union from getting dumped on by England and France during our civil war. Russia told those two if you meddle it will be war here in Europe. With that they stayed out.

Russia and US go together like peas and carrots.

---

This is a bit of a flawed argument.

There is no real evidence that Britain and France were going to step in and support the Confederates during the Civil War. If you stand on your head, squint one eye, and hold your breath until you are about to pass out you might get some faint glimmer of the UK and France supporting the South.

The argument for this is the French invasion of Mexico which was supported, at first, by Britain. And yes, the French did pick a time to invade Mexico when they knew the US would not be able to enforce the Monroe Doctrine.

And, for the record, yes, once the Civil War was over and the US quietly let it be known that they were willing to march their battle hardened Army (at the time one of the largest in the world and with considerable military experience) to the border of Mexico and start some shite Napeleon the Third backed off.

There are, however, flaws with this argument. Modern Mexico is not an easy country to occupy... we pulled it off in the Mexican-American War (and briefly, with the support of many in Mexico, considered annexing the entire country. Stop and think about how that would have changed American society if you want.) but we are a hell of a lot closer then France. The French quite rapidly discovered they had bit off more then they could chew. A war with the US was not an option for them. Especially not with the growing threat of a very expansionist Prussia camped in their backyard.

The British initially supported the war... because the French promised them once they had control of Mexico they'd pay off the many debts Mexico owed to the UK at the time. Once it became clear that wasn't going to happen the UK pulled their support. As for a war with the US... at that point in time Britain was already well along in their plan to replace Southern cotton with cotton grown in Egypt and India.

IF... and its a big if... Lee had won at Gettysburg and then marched on and captured Washington... sure they'd acknowledge the Confederacy. As is they made a little money selling things to the South and then cheerfully cut their losses. The UK had already fought two disastrous wars with the US. They had no stomach for a third.

Which leaves us with Russia. By Gawd they called out France and the UK! They even parked two fleets in American waters!

They also were one of the first countries to acknowledge French control of Mexico. The fleets they parked in American waters were not so much for our defense, they were here because tensions had increased, once again, between Russia and its Crimean War enemies France and Britain. By parking them in US ports the Russians knew their navy wouldn't be brutally sodomized by the Royal Navy.

We enjoyed... strained... relations with Imperial Russia. They were friendly during the Civil War because they desperately needed a friend after having sand pounded into their rectum during the Crimean War. And they were friendly when they were trying to sell Alaska, which they could not wait to dump.

Other then that we didn't like them very much, and they didn't like us very much.

We get along just great now when it comes to Space. They give us rides to the ISS and we help to subsidize their space program.

Russia has been, and for the immediate future will likely continue to be, an autocratic society that favors a strongman holding power. We are the modern symbol of a Republic with elected officials and a Federal government that is deliberately set up to prevent a strongman from coming to power.

We go together like water and oil. I've known some Russians in my time and they are great people. Hell, they are way more friendly then the Brits and Frogs I've known. But our societies are polar opposites of each other.

quote:

---

What hyperbole?

---

Everything I said is a documented verifiable fact.

Hyperbole my arse. I say what the frick I mean and do not mince words like some mealy mouth conman.

A. Quit taking shite from 6 years ago out of context. 6 years ago, Russia was not the biggest threat to our Democracy. Romney and Obama were both competent quality candidates. There was no incompetent, ignorant, lying stooge that Russia could manipulate like a goddamn brainless puppet.

B. But, but Obama. But Hillary. But pizzagate. But pedophilia. Jesus Christ man. Find another fricking boogeyman to scare your arse off. This time, hopefully find one with an inkling of actual credibility while you are hiding under mom's bed posting nonsense.

quote:

---

6 1/2 years in front of your dumb

---

Lol that's cute you think a traitor will get reelected

quote:

---

6 1/2 years

---

If you honestly think he will make it to his 2nd term, I really do wonder how retarded Trumpers are

HOW CAN WE FOCUS ON MAKING AMERICA GREAT AGAIN IF WE SPEND TIME AND ENERGY TRYING TO MAKE FRIENDS WITH OTHER NATIONS???

quote:

---

says a guy who didn't give him a chance in hell to beat Hillary! Thanks, but I'll pass on all y'all's "expert" opinions.

---

I admit that I completely underestimate how racist this country still was.

quote:

---

It's funny, Democrats and liberals made fun of Romney for talking about Russia in 2012. "The 80s called and they want their foreign policy back." They've gone batshit since Trump beat their beloved Hillary.

---

This one of the more baffling arguments out there. Hillary is hardly beloved by Democrats or liberals. Consider that even with more then a decade of getting everything lined up to support her run she still barely managed to survive her primary running against an elderly communist from Vermont who is about as charismatic as a pair of socks.

The Democrats love Bill Clinton. They tolerate, at best, Hillary Clinton.

Then there is this undercurrent of Hillary and the liberals hate Trump! Well, yeah, but I'm fairly certain they hate Ebola too, that doesn't mean you should inject yourself in the pecker with it.

I'm a moderate and I've voted for folks from both political parties. So as a vaguely neutral party in this political pissing match let me say that we failed as a country when the two people we had to choose between to run our country, the most powerful nation the world has ever seen, were Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.

I held my nose and voted for Hillary, not because I thought she'd make a great President, but because I thought she'd be marginally less awful then Trump. I can't blame anyone who held their nose and voted for Trump because they thought he'd be marginally less awful then Hillary.

Given the vicious battle unfolding for control of the Democratic Party right now it wouldn't surprise me in the least if Trump wins reelection. That isn't really something to celebrate, its like feeling elated when your doctor tells you that it looks like the syphilis you have is resistant to all antibiotics.

We're stuck with him for now and likely for another 4 years.

Donald Trump is Hillary Clinton's legacy to the Democratic Party.

quote:

---

Exactly. If she were so beloved, she would have won in a landslide.

---

The DNC and the Clinton campaign thoroughly misunderstood how disliked Hillary was outside the major coastal cities. I talk to people who act as if she was the anti-christ. She was a terrible candidate, aloof, unlikable, clueless as far as the struggles of the middle/working class. All around, the wrong choice.