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What prevents Vanderbilt from competing in Football using Stanford's model?
Posted on 12/10/15 at 6:53 am
Posted on 12/10/15 at 6:53 am
Stanford has made itself into a consistent contender in Football by recruiting athletically gifted valedictorians from around the country. They don't reel in the top level talent that many SEC schools do, but they do get really good talent, and never fail to have the smartest athletes on the field. They almost always have one of the lowest penalty counts in the country, and they all grasp the mechanics of the schemes they run/play very well as a cohesive unit within that system.
I'm not a sucker for the "awwwhh shucks, that's what student athletes are supposed to be like/play like", but there is some truth to the claim that being smarter than the guy lined up across from you gives you an advantage barring an insane talent gap.
Why can't Vandy do the same? The SEC East is atrocious right now, and there are plenty of athletically gifted kids in the south who also have high academic achievement/interest. Vandy is the best school in the South (I don't consider Duke a southern school. Those are kids from New York/Jersey who put on boots for the first time at age 18), and i'm sure plenty of recruits from the Southeastern United States would love to play in the SEC, stay close to home, live in Nashville, and still be able to receive one of the best educations in the country. A degree from Vandy gets your foot in the door almost anywhere in this region in the country.
I would think the financial incentive would be there for Vandy to invest in Football given their proximity to some of the best recruits/Football fans in the nation.
I'm not a sucker for the "awwwhh shucks, that's what student athletes are supposed to be like/play like", but there is some truth to the claim that being smarter than the guy lined up across from you gives you an advantage barring an insane talent gap.
Why can't Vandy do the same? The SEC East is atrocious right now, and there are plenty of athletically gifted kids in the south who also have high academic achievement/interest. Vandy is the best school in the South (I don't consider Duke a southern school. Those are kids from New York/Jersey who put on boots for the first time at age 18), and i'm sure plenty of recruits from the Southeastern United States would love to play in the SEC, stay close to home, live in Nashville, and still be able to receive one of the best educations in the country. A degree from Vandy gets your foot in the door almost anywhere in this region in the country.
I would think the financial incentive would be there for Vandy to invest in Football given their proximity to some of the best recruits/Football fans in the nation.
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 6:57 am
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Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:01 am to Grovewater
quote:
What prevents Vanderbilt from competing in football using Stanford's model
Their AD and it's commitment to football. They have the location, the facilities are getting better, and the education is second to none. There's no reason they couldn't be the Stanford of the East.
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 7:07 am
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:14 am to Grovewater
Because Stanford is better in literally everything.
Stanford is a top 5 university in the world that can recruit anywhere in the nation. Vandy is a more regional university with clout in the southeast but not much elsewhere.
Stanford has much better facilities and winning tradition. Vandy is still trying to prove that winning there is possible while Stanford has been and currently is doing it.
Ever visited Stanford's campus? It is truly something to see, located in some of the nicest real estate in the world. Nashville is cool to you and I, but it also has a stigma of being a country music place where a lot of recruits would not feel comfortable.
Bottom line, Stanford and Vandy are not even comparable.
Stanford is a top 5 university in the world that can recruit anywhere in the nation. Vandy is a more regional university with clout in the southeast but not much elsewhere.
Stanford has much better facilities and winning tradition. Vandy is still trying to prove that winning there is possible while Stanford has been and currently is doing it.
Ever visited Stanford's campus? It is truly something to see, located in some of the nicest real estate in the world. Nashville is cool to you and I, but it also has a stigma of being a country music place where a lot of recruits would not feel comfortable.
Bottom line, Stanford and Vandy are not even comparable.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:20 am to Grovewater
I agree with your post but competing in the SEC versus the PAC is a killer for Vanderbilt.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:21 am to Grovewater
More smart athletes in California than in Tennessee.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:27 am to Grovewater
quote:
What prevents Vanderbilt from competing in Football using Stanford's model?
Stanford does not play an SEC schedule.
Seriously, Stanford avoids playing pretty much any and all SEC schools. Seems like Stanford has played SEC teams like a dozen times in their football history and most of those were with Tulane when they were in the SEC. Mason came from Stanford and look at how he has done paling an SEC schedule.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:30 am to Grovewater
3 big reasons.
Different conference - While the PAC12 is getting better, it's still not the SEC. Vandy is competing in the best conference in the country which magnifies the inherent disadvantages already in place.
Different recruiting landscape - Even at Franklin's recruiting peak (top 20 class), Vandy was still in the bottom 3rd of the conference in recruiting that year. By comparison, a top 20 class this year would rank 3 or 4 in the PAC12. Easier to win in your system in the PAC12 with a bunch of solid 3 and 4 stars.
Facilities disparity - As some have mentioned, Vandy hasn't put what is sorely needed into facilities. Franklin had to twist our AD's arm just to get the indoor practice facility and was trying to get stadium upgrades for our dump of a stadium. This facilities disparity is a big negative when recruiting against other SEC schools with much better facilities.
Different conference - While the PAC12 is getting better, it's still not the SEC. Vandy is competing in the best conference in the country which magnifies the inherent disadvantages already in place.
Different recruiting landscape - Even at Franklin's recruiting peak (top 20 class), Vandy was still in the bottom 3rd of the conference in recruiting that year. By comparison, a top 20 class this year would rank 3 or 4 in the PAC12. Easier to win in your system in the PAC12 with a bunch of solid 3 and 4 stars.
Facilities disparity - As some have mentioned, Vandy hasn't put what is sorely needed into facilities. Franklin had to twist our AD's arm just to get the indoor practice facility and was trying to get stadium upgrades for our dump of a stadium. This facilities disparity is a big negative when recruiting against other SEC schools with much better facilities.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:33 am to TNTiger1984
quote:
I agree with your post but competing in the SEC versus the PAC is a killer for Vanderbilt
I disagree fully. Fans tend to be biased towards their own conference and look at the present situation instead of taking a broader historical perspective.
The SEC East historically only has 2 Nationally relevant teams who can CONSISTENTLY compete. Florida and Georgia.
The Pac 12 has Oregon, USC, UCLA, and once upon a time Cal was a consistent winner, additionally Stanford plays Notre Dame every year. The Pac 12 is historically stronger than the SEC East, and from a broad perspective I think it would be easier from a scheduling standpoint to maintain consistent success at Vanderbilt.
Vandy gets 4 easy OCC games. Then they get Kentucky, Missouri, South Carolina, and their West rival is Ole Miss(who isn't exactly a historic powerhouse).
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 7:34 am
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:42 am to Grovewater
quote:
The SEC East historically only has 2 Nationally relevant teams who can CONSISTENTLY compete. Florida and Georgia.
Historically speaking, Tennessee has to be considered nationally relevant in addition to UF & Georgia. Only the last decade they've sucked arse.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:43 am to Grovewater
They're in Nashville, not Palo Alto...
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:43 am to TRUERockyTop
Isn't the Vandy AD a law professor?
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:44 am to Grovewater
quote:
The Pac 12 is historically stronger than the SEC East
How old are you?
quote:
Stanford plays Notre Dame every year.
The modern Notre Dame is not your great grandpas Notre Dame.
quote:
The SEC East historically only has 2 Nationally relevant teams who can CONSISTENTLY compete. Florida and Georgia.
This thinking is so wrong on so many levels. LINK
Both Alabama and Tennessee are ahead of Southern California
10 or 14 current SEC schools (and 1 former SEC school) are ahead of Stanford
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:46 am to Grovewater
quote:
The Pac 12 has Oregon
To say Oregon is historically anything shows what a complete and utter buffoon you are. Sure, the last couple decades are nice but when they play anyone at all when it's on the line they fold like a cheap suit. UT, Ga, Auburn and LSU are all historically better than Oregon and have all won titles; Oregon hasn't. You lost any argument you may have had right there.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:48 am to Grovewater
Stumbling on a Harbough
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:53 am to Grovewater
Stanford and Vandy operate in different spheres.
Vandy is academically and athletically in more competition with schools like Duke, Northwestern, and UVA when it comes to recruiting.
Vandy is academically and athletically in more competition with schools like Duke, Northwestern, and UVA when it comes to recruiting.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 8:03 am to Grovewater
Because they're Vandy.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 8:05 am to Grovewater
quote:
What prevents Vanderbilt from competing in Football using Stanford's model?
It's the anchor down thing. If recruits wanted gay sayings and traditions they'd go to A&M.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 8:10 am to Grovewater
quote:
Vandy gets 4 easy OCC games. Then they get Kentucky, Missouri, South Carolina, and their West rival is Ole Miss(who isn't exactly a historic powerhouse).
bingo..
great thread.. I will stay tuned in
Posted on 12/10/15 at 8:11 am to Grovewater
quote:
What prevents Vanderbilt from competing in Football using Stanford's model?
I feel its the recruiting footprint. Standford really only has to compete for recruits with a couple schools athletically and have no competition academically.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 8:44 am to Cheese Grits
quote:
Stanford does not play an SEC schedule.
I know SEC homers love to think of their conference as the end all and be all, but Vandy would suck even in the PAC 12 whereas Sanford would give most of the SEC teams at the top a run for their money. Actually think Stanford could win the East and probably finish 2nd in the West. They are well coached with a workable scheme on offense and a good defense. AAAAAANNNNNDDDD
Unlike Alabama, LSU, Ole Miss and most of the other schools in the SEC, their players can read at or above grade level....none of the see spot run stuff, also the players are required to have legit majors....none of this Sports Management/Information degrees.
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