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Well the Thorpe award is officially meaningless..
Posted on 11/29/22 at 1:47 pm
Posted on 11/29/22 at 1:47 pm
Emmanuel Forbes, MSU – 6 INT, 15 PD, 3 TD
Who are the Thorpe Finalists?
Clark Phillips III, Utah –6 INT, 11 PD, 0 TD
Tre’Vius Hodges, TCU – 3 INT, 13 PD, 0 TD
Devon Witherspoon, Illinois – 3 INT, 17 PD, 0 TD
Do the people who pick these awards even watch football?
Who are the Thorpe Finalists?
Clark Phillips III, Utah –6 INT, 11 PD, 0 TD
Tre’Vius Hodges, TCU – 3 INT, 13 PD, 0 TD
Devon Witherspoon, Illinois – 3 INT, 17 PD, 0 TD
Do the people who pick these awards even watch football?
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Posted on 11/29/22 at 1:50 pm to CleverUserName
That sucks, but most of these post season awards are indeed meaningless.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 1:55 pm to CleverUserName
2 of the 3 were on the pre-season watch list. Your dude wasn't. Not right or wrong, but it seems they didn't try.
Perhaps more metrics were utilized? IDK...
Perhaps more metrics were utilized? IDK...
Posted on 11/29/22 at 1:58 pm to CoachDon
quote:
2 of the 3 were on the pre-season watch list. Your dude wasn't. Not right or wrong, but it seems they didn't try.
I think this answers the OP's question. No way did anyone on the selection committee actually paid good attention.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 1:59 pm to CoachDon
quote:
Perhaps more metrics were utilized?
Yea laziness.. as in they were too lazy to actually research.
When one guy has 3 more pick sixes as the three finalists combined.. that’s robbery. I don’t know what other metrics overcomes that.
But with the state of journalism and the like.. it’s not surprising.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:00 pm to CoachDon
The whole notion of having a "watch list" is stupidity. Just let them play the season and pick someone at the end.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:02 pm to Mulkey Man
quote:
The whole notion of having a "watch list" is stupidity. Just let them play the season and pick someone at the end.
This I agree with. It prejudices the voters.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:03 pm to CleverUserName
quote:
Well the Thorpe award is officially meaningless..
generally speaking, a lot of these awards have turned into career achievement awards. Grant Delpit, for instance, should have probably won it in 2018 but certainly not when he did in 2019. Same with Deandre Baker. He should have won it in 2017 but then won it the following year in 2018. Minkah Fitzaptrick, same thing. Monster 2016 season, didn't win it. Won it the following season in 2017.
This post was edited on 11/29/22 at 2:03 pm
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:21 pm to lsufball19
quote:
generally speaking, a lot of these awards have turned into career achievement awards. Grant Delpit, for instance, should have probably won it in 2018 but certainly not when he did in 2019. Same with Deandre Baker. He should have won it in 2017 but then won it the following year in 2018. Minkah Fitzaptrick, same thing. Monster 2016 season, didn't win it. Won it the following season in 2017.
He’s been an elite DB for 3 years and is the all time leader in pick 6’s, as a JR with 2 years of eligibility left. He was thrown at a total of 15 times this year and only gave up 3 completions, total.
This post was edited on 11/29/22 at 2:22 pm
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:30 pm to CleverUserName
Stats for DB's aren't necessarily the best indicator of who's best. I know for UGA there have been many seasons where the #2 CB had better stats than the #1 because offenses facing UGA wouldn't throw much to the WR covered by the #1 guy.
For example, Champ Bailey only had 3 picks his last year at UGA. Jeff Harris (UGA's other CB) had 4. Kirby Smart at Safety had 5. Neither was better than Champ... but people didn't throw on Champ nearly as much because Champ was so freaking good in coverage. He basically took away the #1 WR for any team UGA faced.
He was much more deserving of post season awards than guys with more interceptions or passes defended because his coverage was so good passes weren't even thrown his way.
For example, Champ Bailey only had 3 picks his last year at UGA. Jeff Harris (UGA's other CB) had 4. Kirby Smart at Safety had 5. Neither was better than Champ... but people didn't throw on Champ nearly as much because Champ was so freaking good in coverage. He basically took away the #1 WR for any team UGA faced.
He was much more deserving of post season awards than guys with more interceptions or passes defended because his coverage was so good passes weren't even thrown his way.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:32 pm to CleverUserName
Phillips is legit but yeah Forbes should have been invited at least and IMO should have won
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:32 pm to lsufball19
quote:
generally speaking, a lot of these awards have turned into career achievement awards. Grant Delpit, for instance, should have probably won it in 2018 but certainly not when he did in 2019. Same with Deandre Baker. He should have won it in 2017 but then won it the following year in 2018. Minkah Fitzaptrick, same thing. Monster 2016 season, didn't win it. Won it the following season in 2017.
It's odd, because the Heisman tends to have a different trajectory. It's definitely been political, but rarely a career achievement award (possibly because of the attention it commands).
Like how on earth did Marshall Faulk, Garrison Hearst and Reggie Brooks (all with monster seasons that year) lose to Gino Freaking Torretta. (I guess, to be fair, it's hard to find stats prior to the game).
Interestingly enough both Gino and Miami's first Heisman winner, Vinny Testaverde, had horrible bowl games (a combined 8 interceptions between the two).
Also interestingly, Alabama prevented Miami from getting a "then unprecedented" 5th national championship in 10 games. Alabama would go on to win 5 over a stretch of 9 seasons (2009, 2011, 2012, 2015, 2017).
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:34 pm to CleverUserName
Yeah, it's cool when one of your players wins the award, but the way they set them up slants the field very hard towards the guys they pick in the preseason, which is frankly ridiculous. The criteria for each award is kind of wonky, too. I remember in 2020 when Will Reichard was literally perfect for the year - did not miss a single kick - and yet did not win the Lou Groza, which ended up going to some guy who, while he had a good season, missed a few kicks along the way. Why? Who knows?
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:34 pm to skirpnasty
quote:
He was thrown at a total of 15 times this year and only gave up 3 completions, total.
Dadgum
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:36 pm to DawginSC
quote:
Stats for DB's aren't necessarily the best indicator of who's best. I know for UGA there have been many seasons where the #2 CB had better stats than the #1 because offenses facing UGA wouldn't throw much to the WR covered by the #1 guy. For example, Champ Bailey only had 3 picks his last year at UGA. Jeff Harris (UGA's other CB) had 4. Kirby Smart at Safety had 5. Neither was better than Champ... but people didn't throw on Champ nearly as much because Champ was so freaking good in coverage. He basically took away the #1 WR for any team UGA faced.
We’ve had this situation too. Jonathan Banks won the Thorpe largely because Darius Slay was on the other side.
That doesn’t really apply here, Forbes gave up 3 completions all year and is still the all time leader in pick 6’s. He literally had as many pick 6’s this year as completions allowed.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:36 pm to skirpnasty
you left out a crazy stat.
yes, He was thrown at 15 times allowing 3 receptions but he had 6 interceptions. That is freaking nuts.
yes, He was thrown at 15 times allowing 3 receptions but he had 6 interceptions. That is freaking nuts.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:38 pm to CleverUserName
Jonathan Banks won the Thorpe a decade ago robbing that kid from Fresno State and Dee Milliner of Bama. These things have a way of evening out. But yes 3 pick 6s should have made Forbes a Finalist.
This post was edited on 11/29/22 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:40 pm to CleverUserName
When Troy Smith won the Heisman over DMac I quit giving a shite about any of these awards.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:42 pm to TheTideMustRoll
quote:
I remember in 2020 when Will Reichard was literally perfect for the year - did not miss a single kick - and yet did not win the Lou Groza, which ended up going to some guy who, while he had a good season, missed a few kicks along the way. Why? Who knows?
I felt the same way with Brad Wing and the Ray Guy award in 2011. I can understand if maybe he doesn't win it, but he wasn't even a finalist. I've long since stopped trying to understand what goes into naming finalists and winners of these awards.
Posted on 11/29/22 at 2:43 pm to V Bainbridge
I figured that out when Peyton lost the Heisman to Woodson.
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