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re: Learning about QB position
Posted on 12/6/21 at 7:33 pm to Bigbens42
Posted on 12/6/21 at 7:33 pm to Bigbens42
quote:
had dreams of D1 football early on in my high school career. An encounter with an absolute freak of a lineman at Huffman named Dominic Lee ended that illusion. Huffman had some beastly lines at that time but he was special. Ended up at Alabama. Didn't do much in college but he was stinking good. Big, fast and awesome.
2001 or 2002?
I was still teaching at Woodlawn and we got a steady diet of arse kicking from HT and Huffman... and pretty much everybody else.
1
Posted on 12/6/21 at 7:47 pm to higgs_boson
This would have been '02. I would have been a junior.
I had my best game against Woodlawn my senior season in '03 though. I was the kicker that season too and they had just installed this fancy new stuff called field turf at Lawson. Playing on that after 2 years of that awful fricking astroturf was fun. Had multiple receptions and I was the leading scorer for the game too by virtue of kicking.
I had my best game against Woodlawn my senior season in '03 though. I was the kicker that season too and they had just installed this fancy new stuff called field turf at Lawson. Playing on that after 2 years of that awful fricking astroturf was fun. Had multiple receptions and I was the leading scorer for the game too by virtue of kicking.
This post was edited on 12/6/21 at 7:48 pm
Posted on 12/6/21 at 7:54 pm to Bigbens42
I was at that game, so I guess I was hoping you would miss every time.
I don't think we won a game in 2003. At that point it was all coming apart at the school. Our official enrollment was about 2k, but the truth was we had already been shifted to less than 600 students.
Coach Isaac was busy banging one of the administrators and just riding it out. I felt bad for the players. That was our last year playing those teams, I think.
I don't think we won a game in 2003. At that point it was all coming apart at the school. Our official enrollment was about 2k, but the truth was we had already been shifted to less than 600 students.
Coach Isaac was busy banging one of the administrators and just riding it out. I felt bad for the players. That was our last year playing those teams, I think.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 8:01 pm to Bigbens42
quote:
that awful fricking astroturf
Oh god. I had forgotten about that. I was on that field a few times in 2000 and 2001 and by then, it had large wrinkles in it. It was a disaster. I was told that it was the former astroturf from Legion Field, which was removed for 1996 Olympic soccer.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 8:06 pm to CreweBilt
quote:
Oh god. I had forgotten about that. I was on that field a few times in 2000 and 2001 and by then, it had large wrinkles in it. It was a disaster. I was told that it was the former astroturf from Legion Field, which was removed for 1996 Olympic soccer.
It fricking sucked. We had to play those games in tennis shoes.
Field turf was great because you could wear your cleats. Since I was also the kicker my right foot needed to sport a soccer cleat. Would have hated having to kick in tennis shoes.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 9:16 pm to Bigbens42
Good thread.
Question on the 3 or 5 step drops. Apologize if I missed this already in the thread. Is the 3 or 5 based on the QB being under center or in the gun?
If under center 3 steps indicates a quick shorter pass?
If under center 5 steps indicate a longer route?
And vice versa? Never played the game, sorry for my lack of knowledge.
Question on the 3 or 5 step drops. Apologize if I missed this already in the thread. Is the 3 or 5 based on the QB being under center or in the gun?
If under center 3 steps indicates a quick shorter pass?
If under center 5 steps indicate a longer route?
And vice versa? Never played the game, sorry for my lack of knowledge.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 9:26 pm to Bigbens42
quote:
Riddle
Riddler
Posted on 12/6/21 at 9:29 pm to bluedragon
quote:
The rest of his list is dedicated to talent and the ability to learn outside of the classroom (Football practice field under the supervision of coaches.)
How much of these aspects are instinctive versus taught?
Nature versus nurture?
Just observing without tremendous knowledge, there seem to be guys with the typical size, good velocity, and athletic ability, but they are missing”it,” the guys who have “it” are a QB like David Green from UGA who just seemed to make plays. For Auburn Reggie Slack, Damien Craig had it. Sullivan had it.
Young from Bama is talented, but the “it” is what makes him a top pick after next season.
Bo has measurables and talent. How does he get the next level? I believe Bo can help us win an SEC title IF the team gets better around him, and he makes progress.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 9:40 pm to AUBTIG47
quote:
If under center 3 steps indicates a quick shorter pass? If under center 5 steps indicate a longer route?
Yes those are kind of under center terms but still used today even in the gun. From under center you would take 3,5, or 7 cross over steps hit the back door on the last step, hitch (reset square shoulders and feet) and throw. The drops were determined by what your initial primary read was. In the gun step 1 is considered catching the snap, 2 would be one step back, 3 would be planting squaring , hitch and throw.
From under center on those steps you also don’t realize how big the crossover steps are until you drill it and drill it.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 9:44 pm to CorchJay
Thanks Corch!
Posted on 12/6/21 at 9:45 pm to makersmark1
quote:
Bo has measurables and talent. How does he get the next level?
Bo has “it” as well. But for Bo to get to elite level in college he needs protection he can trust on 90% of his snaps. I would guess the trust level for Bo is probably around 60ish %. Bo also has to get his feet set even on short throws. He sets his feet when he wants to rip one and looks good. Setting his feet on short throws will improve his accuracy on those throws. Bo also needs play makers on the outside that can create a deep threat and make contested catches. We had very few of those this year.
Posted on 12/6/21 at 10:07 pm to TheJones
quote:
Riddler
This guy.
The Delaware Wing-T was sort of his thing. He did win a state title with it at Clay-Chalkville so I guess I can't really blame him for having faith in it.
One if the nicest guys you'll ever meet, to boot.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 3:31 am to Bigbens42
I love how this thread started as a joke then turned into a very informative discussion.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 5:42 am to makersmark1
You’ve come to the right place. I’m not sure there’s a better collection of retards to breakdown the intricacies of the QB position than the Auburn Board.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 5:44 am to CorchJay
Coarch,
“Trust” is sort of an unseen concept in sports.
I know it exists in golf because I’ve actually have “felt” it.
Shooting free throws is another.
Unlike golf and free throw shooting, which are “closed” skills. Playing QB is an “open” skill situation. Your performance can certainly be affected by the opposition.
However, how do you develop skills in practice that will hold up under fire?
I’m sure in shorts and helmets many guys look like Tom Brady, but when the heat is on how do coaches sort out the guys who can really deliver from the guys who for whatever reason struggle with the lights on?
The jump from HS to college must be incredible. In HS, I would think most QBs are one of the best if not the best athlete on the team. They may not get challenged consistently day after day. This may lead to fundamentally unsound decisions which they can get away with when the competition is not elite. How do you get a guy to understand that you can’t retreat 10 yards every time you feel pressure?
The team this year just needed a few more “see, feel, trust” moments to be 10-2.
When/how does a team learn, develop, get the “winning spirit?”
Does it come from success? Or does it lead to success? Both?
I agree Bo needs better protection. Brice Young needs better protection too. How does Bo go from a play like the fumble at A&M, to a lateral like Young made against Georgia. The plays were similar in many ways, but the outcomes were dramatically difference.
Bo made a throw in 2019 Iron Bowl to Canella that Marino and Elway would have been jealous of. I’ve seen Bo really rip it.
The receiver group will improve as players develop and recruiting improves. I liked the Bo checked it down to the backs this year when the initial targets were covered.
I hope some of the hard times this year will provide the lessons the players need for success.
Could bowl practice and game be a time for this team to “lay their guys on the line?”
I’d like to see them finish the season. I know we’ve had serious injuries to key players, but maybe this game can be a positive going into winter workouts.
“Trust” is sort of an unseen concept in sports.
I know it exists in golf because I’ve actually have “felt” it.
Shooting free throws is another.
Unlike golf and free throw shooting, which are “closed” skills. Playing QB is an “open” skill situation. Your performance can certainly be affected by the opposition.
However, how do you develop skills in practice that will hold up under fire?
I’m sure in shorts and helmets many guys look like Tom Brady, but when the heat is on how do coaches sort out the guys who can really deliver from the guys who for whatever reason struggle with the lights on?
The jump from HS to college must be incredible. In HS, I would think most QBs are one of the best if not the best athlete on the team. They may not get challenged consistently day after day. This may lead to fundamentally unsound decisions which they can get away with when the competition is not elite. How do you get a guy to understand that you can’t retreat 10 yards every time you feel pressure?
The team this year just needed a few more “see, feel, trust” moments to be 10-2.
When/how does a team learn, develop, get the “winning spirit?”
Does it come from success? Or does it lead to success? Both?
I agree Bo needs better protection. Brice Young needs better protection too. How does Bo go from a play like the fumble at A&M, to a lateral like Young made against Georgia. The plays were similar in many ways, but the outcomes were dramatically difference.
Bo made a throw in 2019 Iron Bowl to Canella that Marino and Elway would have been jealous of. I’ve seen Bo really rip it.
The receiver group will improve as players develop and recruiting improves. I liked the Bo checked it down to the backs this year when the initial targets were covered.
I hope some of the hard times this year will provide the lessons the players need for success.
Could bowl practice and game be a time for this team to “lay their guys on the line?”
I’d like to see them finish the season. I know we’ve had serious injuries to key players, but maybe this game can be a positive going into winter workouts.
Posted on 12/9/21 at 12:21 pm to makersmark1
Never answered the "Throwing the receiver open" question.
On a called route? Or in the middle of chaos?
Called routes ...Short routes never. Not enough time. Longer routes? Do you consider a receiver with a step on a defender on a 9 or go route...where in your mind there is a doubt that you can judge the exact trajectory, velocity, receiver speed. Underthrow or overthrow ...Incomplete. But ..if you see there is no over the top coverage and no one in the field of vision that can break up the pass ...you can lead the receiver over about 5-10 yards to get greater distance between the receiver and DB. PROVIDED....the receiver can read your mind and he makes his break to get away while knowing that pass is his.
Chaos ...The line broke down, you are running for your life ...You see a receiver that has broken his route ...you try to lead him to a greater hole or TD. Again does he read your intent to break off again to catch the pass..... It involves the receiver being on the same page as you are ...otherwise you hit nothing but dirt because the receiver was not thinking on your level. In other words, you can think you are throwing a receiver open ...but in this case ..It definitely does take two to tango.
Talent ...The quarterback is not always the most gifted athlete on your team. He's best passer ...but in some cases ...don't depend on him to run for anything. I could do both and went with the philosophy ...if you see five take it ....if you need ten, you better have the path to get there. Three things happen on a pass and two are bad.
No one has enough practice time and most teams do not have the tools to develop the capability to train velocity, loft, touch, or how to lead a target. You do it on your own and figure out how to do it. In my case ..one old tire on a rope tied the the clothes line bars and standing a different angles and distance from the monkey bars, swing sets etc. You can create a lot of training opportunities by being creative on your own. I had two younger brothers and bag of fifteen footballs to use ..Tore them up in the off season. We also had a pro sized basketball court on the adjacent Army Base 30 minutes away. Special Services Officer didn't care if no one was on the court and we didn't throw at the basketball goals.
On a called route? Or in the middle of chaos?
Called routes ...Short routes never. Not enough time. Longer routes? Do you consider a receiver with a step on a defender on a 9 or go route...where in your mind there is a doubt that you can judge the exact trajectory, velocity, receiver speed. Underthrow or overthrow ...Incomplete. But ..if you see there is no over the top coverage and no one in the field of vision that can break up the pass ...you can lead the receiver over about 5-10 yards to get greater distance between the receiver and DB. PROVIDED....the receiver can read your mind and he makes his break to get away while knowing that pass is his.
Chaos ...The line broke down, you are running for your life ...You see a receiver that has broken his route ...you try to lead him to a greater hole or TD. Again does he read your intent to break off again to catch the pass..... It involves the receiver being on the same page as you are ...otherwise you hit nothing but dirt because the receiver was not thinking on your level. In other words, you can think you are throwing a receiver open ...but in this case ..It definitely does take two to tango.
Talent ...The quarterback is not always the most gifted athlete on your team. He's best passer ...but in some cases ...don't depend on him to run for anything. I could do both and went with the philosophy ...if you see five take it ....if you need ten, you better have the path to get there. Three things happen on a pass and two are bad.
No one has enough practice time and most teams do not have the tools to develop the capability to train velocity, loft, touch, or how to lead a target. You do it on your own and figure out how to do it. In my case ..one old tire on a rope tied the the clothes line bars and standing a different angles and distance from the monkey bars, swing sets etc. You can create a lot of training opportunities by being creative on your own. I had two younger brothers and bag of fifteen footballs to use ..Tore them up in the off season. We also had a pro sized basketball court on the adjacent Army Base 30 minutes away. Special Services Officer didn't care if no one was on the court and we didn't throw at the basketball goals.
Posted on 12/9/21 at 1:14 pm to bluedragon
quote:
No one has enough practice time and most teams do not have the tools to develop the capability to train velocity, loft, touch, or how to lead a target.
It looks difficult to me to develop all of the skills to be an elite QB even with the requisite arm and athletic talent.
Add to that all of the nuances of the playbook, and the in play adjustments to “chaos”; and it looks extremely difficult to perform at a consistently high level.
The adjustment from HS to college must be a huge progression. All the players are bigger, stronger, faster.
I guess that is why the NFL teams build around a elite QB IF they happen to get one.
Posted on 12/9/21 at 10:17 pm to makersmark1
It’s very detailed. I didn’t play any higher level then high school as a QB. But it’s difficult in high school and if you ever watch high school ball. Ow where they do throw it more you’d think every QB is a dumbass for all the wrong things they do.
Perfect example of what bluedragon was saying was in the sec championship game. Bennett was getting pressure,Bowers was moving across the middle, Bennett thinks Bowers is going to continue the route but Bowers sets down in the hole in the zone. Bennett throws it directly to the DB. Neither player is wrong it’s just one of those things that happens when a primary play breaks down.
That’s why I’ve been so steadfast in my defense of Bo. He plays half the game with undue chaos around him whether they be from poor play calls, poor scheme, lack of offensive talent around him or just a missed block. He has to do some of the things that puts him in spots to be inaccurate. He also isn’t the most disciplined on the easy throws I referenced earlier in the thread. Why? I don’t know. But with all that said ball security has been incredible throwing the football for him considering all that is going on around him.
Perfect example of what bluedragon was saying was in the sec championship game. Bennett was getting pressure,Bowers was moving across the middle, Bennett thinks Bowers is going to continue the route but Bowers sets down in the hole in the zone. Bennett throws it directly to the DB. Neither player is wrong it’s just one of those things that happens when a primary play breaks down.
That’s why I’ve been so steadfast in my defense of Bo. He plays half the game with undue chaos around him whether they be from poor play calls, poor scheme, lack of offensive talent around him or just a missed block. He has to do some of the things that puts him in spots to be inaccurate. He also isn’t the most disciplined on the easy throws I referenced earlier in the thread. Why? I don’t know. But with all that said ball security has been incredible throwing the football for him considering all that is going on around him.
Posted on 12/10/21 at 1:21 pm to CorchJay
My cousin was a wide receiver at Auburn. He went out on tackling drills launched to take out the best running on the team, dipped his head and hit nothing but air. Don later said "I learned a lot during my Freshman year."
Funny story about Don. Bear comes calling to recruit him. Don gets up to go to the bathroom. Returns to see my Great Aunt coming from the front porch with a broom in her hands.
Don asks "Where's Coach?" "He had to leave suddenly and the SOB is never coming back." She had chased him out of the house after he came onto her.
Funny story about Don. Bear comes calling to recruit him. Don gets up to go to the bathroom. Returns to see my Great Aunt coming from the front porch with a broom in her hands.
Don asks "Where's Coach?" "He had to leave suddenly and the SOB is never coming back." She had chased him out of the house after he came onto her.
Posted on 12/10/21 at 2:06 pm to bluedragon
Team Chemistry falls in your lap unexpected. All the team meetings, lunches...get together ...But put together two magic moments ..I'll follow to gates of hell with the determination to take over.
Senior year....Both teams had finished their season 0-9-1. We are so miserable that the team we tied was against each other. Because of base cutbacks in Tokyo .. The middle school at Camp Drake is closed and the decision reached is to bus the High School Kids to Yamato High School. Our team is from two different bases ...should have a cluster.
The sports write up predicting the season. No one came to see our team, no one called and interviewed the coaches.
"When you combine a loser with a loser. All you get is bigger loser."
What no one realized, was all the missing pieces on both teams were suddenly filled with talent. That write up was step one in formation into a team ...Then came game one.
We are on two separate bases, one hour apart, with little contact outside of school.
Neither of us had beaten Chofu ever, in anything ....
Third quarter, trailing by 4. Three and out, punt and the ball was killed on the one yard line. Coach Wiser suddenly yells out "Ray, get over here and bring your helmet!" I was at the table getting a Gatorade ...
Stood beside him and he says "On the first play they will fumble, we'll recover at the one. Go out and run the goose." The goose is quite simple, you place your hands under center and the pressure you provide, tells the center where to put the ball on the snap so he doesn't ruin any potential for fatherhood.
Snap, fumble, defenders jumping up and down ...Wiser looks at me "You haven't left yet?"
Go out, hands under center ...the trick now is press harder to tell the center that you want the ball with no verbal signal. He missed the first one, I pulled out and adjusted the fullback. Put my hands under and pressed again. Snap and we both went ...no one else moved on the field. I'll never forget the defensive tackles eyes when Brian and went past him into the endzone ...TD and we never trailed after that. From that moment on I believed Coach Wiser walked on water.....
At the end of the season sitting in front of my locker ..Undefeated and Far East Champions ...The sports writer was there to interview us. He came to my chair, I got up, went to our board, pulled down his first write up and handed it to him ... "Bigger loser" "I'm not interested in being interviewed by you." Coach Wiser came over and hugged me ..."That was done with class."
There has to be things done to produce a magical moment that cannot be defined. What works one year ...doesn't work the next ....Coaches pray for the magic moment ..
Senior year....Both teams had finished their season 0-9-1. We are so miserable that the team we tied was against each other. Because of base cutbacks in Tokyo .. The middle school at Camp Drake is closed and the decision reached is to bus the High School Kids to Yamato High School. Our team is from two different bases ...should have a cluster.
The sports write up predicting the season. No one came to see our team, no one called and interviewed the coaches.
"When you combine a loser with a loser. All you get is bigger loser."
What no one realized, was all the missing pieces on both teams were suddenly filled with talent. That write up was step one in formation into a team ...Then came game one.
We are on two separate bases, one hour apart, with little contact outside of school.
Neither of us had beaten Chofu ever, in anything ....
Third quarter, trailing by 4. Three and out, punt and the ball was killed on the one yard line. Coach Wiser suddenly yells out "Ray, get over here and bring your helmet!" I was at the table getting a Gatorade ...
Stood beside him and he says "On the first play they will fumble, we'll recover at the one. Go out and run the goose." The goose is quite simple, you place your hands under center and the pressure you provide, tells the center where to put the ball on the snap so he doesn't ruin any potential for fatherhood.
Snap, fumble, defenders jumping up and down ...Wiser looks at me "You haven't left yet?"
Go out, hands under center ...the trick now is press harder to tell the center that you want the ball with no verbal signal. He missed the first one, I pulled out and adjusted the fullback. Put my hands under and pressed again. Snap and we both went ...no one else moved on the field. I'll never forget the defensive tackles eyes when Brian and went past him into the endzone ...TD and we never trailed after that. From that moment on I believed Coach Wiser walked on water.....
At the end of the season sitting in front of my locker ..Undefeated and Far East Champions ...The sports writer was there to interview us. He came to my chair, I got up, went to our board, pulled down his first write up and handed it to him ... "Bigger loser" "I'm not interested in being interviewed by you." Coach Wiser came over and hugged me ..."That was done with class."
There has to be things done to produce a magical moment that cannot be defined. What works one year ...doesn't work the next ....Coaches pray for the magic moment ..
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