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re: Chad Morris is not SEC head coach material
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:30 pm to Drewbie
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:30 pm to Drewbie
quote:Outside of the bowl games (he won 2) that sounds like Bielema....
Would you not be on here bitching to fire a coach that couldn't win a bowl game and maxed out at 7-5 in 4 years here?
Are you saying that we shouldn't have fired Bielema.
I wanted him fired. You can't max out at 7-5 and expect to keep your job in the SEC.
But you are saying that a coach who max's out at 7-5 shouldn't be fired.... so I guess you are mad because you wanted to keep Bielema.
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Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:32 pm to hilltophog
The coach I'm citing is Nick Saban at his first P5 job.
The point I'm making is that Saban had the exact same record in year 3 at MSU as Morris did at SMU and he walked into a hell of a lot better of a situation. Have a little patience. Football takes time.
The point I'm making is that Saban had the exact same record in year 3 at MSU as Morris did at SMU and he walked into a hell of a lot better of a situation. Have a little patience. Football takes time.
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 1:37 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:35 pm to Drewbie
quote:You also described Bielema in regards to maxing out at around the 7-5 mark here.
The coach I'm citing is Nick Saban at his first P5 job.
Also, are you saying that Morris is going to work his way up to 9-2 here only to leave for LSU then win a national championship?
That's why these coaching comparisons are dumb.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:38 pm to hilltophog
quote:I'm saying that even the greatest coach of all time needed more than one year.
Also, are you saying that Morris is going to work his way up to 9-2 here only to leave for LSU then win a national championship?
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:42 pm to Drewbie
quote:
The coach I'm citing is Nick Saban at his first P5 job.
Saban doesn't have magical strategy or theory of the game that leads to success outside of out talenting the competition.
This is why the best of his coaching tree has been mediocre at best. There are only a handful of jobs in the country that can out-talent the competition on a consistent basis.
Arkansas doesn't have this luxury in any sport on campus. Arkansas had a magical strategy to dominate track, but that has been abandoned and no one cares about track.
History has shown and proven that in any sport that Arkansas has equaled the talent playing field on a consistent basis, it only takes the allegation of wrong-doing or scandal to lead to an investigation, during the investigation recruiting comes to a stagnet crawl before regressing back to the "norm". Bama has had their fair share of scandals under Saban (antler spray, chargers, etc) outside of the death penalty, their recruiting hasn't and will not suffer from these scandals. Even under sanctions their recruiting wasn't that bad, the actual in game coaching, yes, but not the recruiting they still were getting their fair share of elite talent.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:46 pm to hilltophog
quote:
Composite is the best route to go - it's the average of all rankings:
Bielema 2013 - 23
Bielema 2014 - 29
Bielema 2015 - 22
Bielema 2016 - 23
Bielema 2017 - 27
Bielema average = 24.8
Morris 2018 - 48
Morris 2019 - 16 (currently)
Morris average - 32
I want to agree, but god damn if those rival rankings really seem accurate. All the while saying 247 is the best.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:47 pm to Drewbie
quote:AND I've already said that he will get more than 1 year.
I'm saying that even the greatest coach of all time needed more than one year.
Beyond that Saban took a Toledo team that had won 4,7,3,6, and 6 games prior to him and coached them up to 9 wins in his FIRST and only season there.
Saban also took a previously 5–6 team and coached them up to 6 wins (they actually went 0-11 the year before due to NCAA infractions). Morris took a 4 win team and coached them down to 2.
Morris is not Saban
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:49 pm to hilltophog
quote:He also took a 1 win team and coached them up to 7. I can form narratives too.
Morris took a 4 win team and coached them down to 2.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:50 pm to Drewbie
quote:
I'm saying that even the greatest coach of all time needed more than one year.
When he took the LSU job, it wasn't a desirable job, Dinardo who won at vandy, back when that truly was an accomplishment failed there.
The upper tier of the SEC raided LSU for their elite talent, the players had no desire to stay at home. Saban's "genius" was to keep the majority of these players in-state (he didn't keep all of them, plenty ended up outside of the state as far away as southern cal).
Since "the game of the century" snooze fest, Saban seemed to make an effort to recruit Louisiana harder to take these players so LSU couldn't have them, other teams such as OU made an effort to recruit LA harder as well. This has led to LSU not being the same as much as their coaches or Saban being in the SEC since then.
This is relevant as when ever Arkansas is good, you see these upper tier teams spend time around Arkansas trying to poach talent, and they have succeeded far more than they have failed. Clemson, Bama, Auburn, etc have all came in and taken players that Arkansas could have benefited from more than them, so not only does Arkansas not add these players to the roster, they also have to face them in conference play.
But muh texas recruiting.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:50 pm to russellvillehog
quote:We can use rivals if we want but the fact remains that we had enough talent to beat Colorado State and not get blown out by North Texas. Which is what pisses most of us off.
I want to agree, but god damn if those rival rankings really seem accurate. All the while saying 247 is the best.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:52 pm to Drewbie
quote:He took a 1 win team and coached them up to 7 in year 1.
He also took a 1 win team and coached them up to 7. I can form narratives too.
Where? When?
Can you not read?
The "narratives" I cited were YEAR 1 (one, uno) turnarounds.
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 1:52 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:54 pm to DaleDenton
quote:This is our current class:
But muh texas recruiting.
Texas: 7
Tennessee: 2
Oklahoma: 2
Mississippi: 1
Louisiana: 2
Georgia: 2
Florida: 2
Arkansas: 5
Alabama: 1
Texas will always be a big deal, but Morris has done a good job of spreading out.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:56 pm to Beached Tusky
quote:
Morris may not be the guy who gets us back to relevance... if he's not he'll get canned sooner rather than later because believe it or not the brand still has some semblance of standards.
This is why I never get people getting worked up over coaches in year 1. If Chad fails, at least the new coach will have some of the best talent we have ever had to work work assuming Chad continues to recruit this way.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:58 pm to russellvillehog
quote:
I want to agree, but god damn if those rival rankings really seem accurate. All the while saying 247 is the best.
Your going to see the sites used to fit whatever narrative is trying to be creative.
At one time you had to average a top 10 recruiting class to make the NC game, until Oregon did it with a top 15 average.
Then the narrative changed to you had to average a top 10 class to win the NC until Clemson did it. Then it changed to you had to have a top 10 class on the team.
They do contain some good information and provide a source for discussion, debate, and entertainment, but to say they are an exact science or carry any weight to determine the out come of the games played is not accurate.
One trend that has existed prior to the internet ranking sites and the news print ranking sources that preceded them is that good and elite talent tends to want to play with good to elite teams filled with good to elite talent.
Back in the day, NSD consisted of the day after when the class was printed in the news papers with stats, 40 times, and offer list high lights for each player, that was it, they were not compared to each other across the country. Often were accompanied by editorial opinion on how the class fit the roster on campus, filled needs etc. Topics that are rarely discussed by the people covering the classes on NSD although ESPN has been doing more of this and the needs and fit in the roster has been increasingly used in their ranking system, which puts a ranking that does not fit the narrative being written about this class currently....
Posted on 11/18/18 at 1:59 pm to hilltophog
quote:You really can't help yourself can you?
Can you not read?
MY point was that it takes more than one year, and referenced that Morris has given results when given a timeframe longer than that. You want to harp over one year's worth of results with a roster that isn't his and completely ignore the only info we have to go on that could possibly be some kind of indication as to what the program will be like when he establishes his culture here. I don't know about you, but if he wins more games than the previous year every year he's here, that's a trend I'm willing to start.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 2:02 pm to rockiee
quote:
This is why I never get people getting worked up over coaches in year 1. If Chad fails, at least the new coach will have some of the best talent we have ever had to work work assuming Chad continues to recruit this way.
If the next coach is similar in philosophy to Chad.
If the next coach is Dan Enos, as an example, then all that talent will be wasted and we will again be fricked as there will not be a QB on the roster that can stay in the pocket and make the reads Enos's system requires.
Arkansas is going to do a 180 in coaching hires, the POTB just can help themselves not too.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 2:04 pm to Drewbie
quote:
MY point was that it takes more than one year, and referenced that Morris has given results when given a timeframe longer than that. You want to harp over one year's worth of results with a roster that isn't his and completely ignore the only info we have to go on that could possibly be some kind of indication as to what the program will be like when he establishes his culture here. I don't know about you, but if he wins more games than the previous year every year he's here, that's a trend I'm willing to start.
Plenty of HCs have taken over a program and not shown regression of the program in results on the field.
This is what has happened. He won 50% of the games the guy he was hired to replace won the year prior.
You are not going to find many examples of this not leading to another coaching change 3-4 years down the road.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 2:06 pm to DaleDenton
quote:
If the next coach is similar in philosophy to Chad.
There are certain positions that will carry over no matter who the next coach will be
quote:
If the next coach is Dan Enos, as an example, then all that talent will be wasted and we will again be fricked as there will not be a QB on the roster that can stay in the pocket and make the reads Enos's system requires.
Eh, people thought that about Allen before Enos took over for Chaney.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 2:07 pm to Drewbie
quote:
Texas will always be a big deal, but Morris has done a good job of spreading out.
Arkansas is the big deal. You start there and work you way outward.
You do not start in Texas and work your way back in.
This has been the winning strategy for every coach in football at Arkansas. Failing to lock down Arkansas has lead to increase in losses and a coaching change. Every time.
Meanwhile, there are two O-linemen from instate who has more P5 offers than the rest of the class combined who are not coming here, huge loss no matter how you want to try to spin that, only positive is neither will be on Arkansas's schedule while they are playing CFB.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 2:10 pm to DaleDenton
quote:
This is why the best of his coaching tree has been mediocre at best.
Smart has been mediocre at best?
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