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re: What we know as Urban Meyer investigation wraps up
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:12 pm to imjustafatkid
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:12 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
It is a monumental leap from "can or should" help to "if you don't help you should lose your job." Even if Urban had fired the guy and reported him to the police, nothing can or will change until the person being battered decides to file or pursue charges.
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It is a monumental leap from "can or should" help to "if you don't help you should lose your job." Even if Urban had fired the guy and reported him to the police, nothing can or will change until the person being battered decides to file or pursue charges.
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It is a monumental leap from "can or should" help to "if you don't help you should lose your job." Even if Urban had fired the guy and reported him to the police, nothing can or will change until the person being battered decides to file or pursue charges.
This sounds like the same defense everyone used that defended Paterno and PSU. Just saying
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Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:13 pm to imjustafatkid
If you work for the university and it involves an employee of your’s and your wife tells you about it, then you do have a responsibility.
Urban Meyer had a history of getting involved in the Smith’s relationship. Urban Meyer even acknowledged in his statement that he would follow the proper protocols of ever “learned” of a situation. So even Meyer acknowledges that he has a responsibility.
Quit being obtuse.
Urban Meyer had a history of getting involved in the Smith’s relationship. Urban Meyer even acknowledged in his statement that he would follow the proper protocols of ever “learned” of a situation. So even Meyer acknowledges that he has a responsibility.
Quit being obtuse.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 12:14 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:19 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
imjustafatkid
Quiet down meow, let the adults take it from here.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:21 pm to FairhopeTider
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If you work for the university and it involves an employee of your’s and your wife tells you about it, then you do have a responsibility.
If this is in his contract, then sure.
quote:
Urban Meyer had a history of getting involved in the Smith’s relationship. Urban Meyer even acknowledged in his statement that he would follow the proper protocols of ever “learned” of a situation. So even Meyer acknowledges that he has a responsibility.
In other words, he says he followed the proper protocols. I guess everything's good then.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:22 pm to TideWarrior
quote:
This sounds like the same defense everyone used that defended Paterno and PSU. Just saying
Except for Paterno actually had verifiable evidence of what Sandusky was doing. Text messages to Meyer's wife are not proof of anything. Y'all are really expanding the criminal code here. Really setting yourselves up for failure with these definitions of moral obligations.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 12:25 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:23 pm to imjustafatkid
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I don't have a responsibility to report things texted to my wife. Neither do you, and neither does Urban Meyer just because he's a football coach.
I suspect that OSU and most universities have policies and employment contract stipulations regarding coaches' conduct as well as internal reporting of suspected misconduct of their staff and players. If so then Meyer may have been required by OSU to report anything he knew or even suspected about Zach Smith's potential misconduct.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 12:28 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:24 pm to TidalSurge1
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I suspect that OSU and most universities have policies and employment contract stipulations regarding coaches' conduct as well as internal reporting of suspected misconduct of their staff and players.
I thought it was being reported that he followed these protocols? The outrage is that he "didn't do enough."
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:25 pm to imjustafatkid
Urban Meyer may not have known about everything, but there is a very evident pattern of aberrant behavior here on the part of a member of his staff that has existed for years. There is ample evidence that the guy is at the least an embarrassment to his employer, if not a liability and a serious one. If I'm the boss, I can ignore a few "rumors" or stories that are going around the office. When this type of pattern emerges, you are a fool to not take steps to remove this person from your employ. If he's this lax with his personal standards of conduct and social norms, it could be inferred that he's just as careless in his professional life with things like NCAA rules. This person is a danger to anyone responsible for him on multiple levels.
And Urban has a track record of turning a blind eye and saying "I didn't know..." You can only use that excuse so many times, especially when it's part of your job to know. Legally perhaps, Urban fulfilled his duties. But from a practical standpoint, his actions are very difficult to understand and defend. He may not have done anything illegal or directly against the policies of OSU. But do you really want someone showing such a lack of responsibility and oversight running an operation as big as the OSU football program?
And Urban has a track record of turning a blind eye and saying "I didn't know..." You can only use that excuse so many times, especially when it's part of your job to know. Legally perhaps, Urban fulfilled his duties. But from a practical standpoint, his actions are very difficult to understand and defend. He may not have done anything illegal or directly against the policies of OSU. But do you really want someone showing such a lack of responsibility and oversight running an operation as big as the OSU football program?
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:27 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
In other words, he says he followed the proper protocols. I guess everything's good then.
If there’s verification of that, then Meyer’s good. Should be pretty simple to prove.
If he didn’t do the minimum requirement, then he should be fired.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 12:28 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:31 pm to phil4bama
quote:
but there is a very evident pattern of aberrant behavior here on the part of a member of his staff that has existed for years
This guy has definitely been ruined from all that his wife has released about him, but I highly doubt anyone knew he took pics of his package in the White House with a White House towel. This new stuff looks like a pattern of behavior he definitely hid from his employer. Surely we don't think Urban Meyer knew about that.
ETA: I guess it's possible he did, but I really find it hard to believe this history of events was ever brought to anyone's attention and this guy kept his job.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 12:32 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:43 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
I can agree with this. He may have had a contractual obligation to report rumors, but to claim he has a moral obligation to report things he can't prove is just complete nonsense. No one has any such moral obligation. If you have actionable evidence that can be proven, then yes you have a moral obligation, but otherwise you're just spreading rumors.
What if I saw my next door neighbor come home drunk, hear screaming and banging noises, see his wife and child drive away a little later that night and return the next day after he's gone to work with visible bruises and bandages? I can't prove he beat them. What if I didn't see or hear anything, but another neighbor saw all of that and told me about it. Either way, it's my moral obligation to report what I'd seen or was told about to the police. It's their duty to investigate it and the legal system's duty to prove it. Same principle as neighborhood watch. Report suspicious activities to the proper authorities and let them handle it.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 1:26 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 12:43 pm to imjustafatkid
Dude you really need to stop. You are the one being obtuse. Meyer absolutely had a legal, moral, and ethical responsibility to step in and report this. There is no debate.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:08 pm to imjustafatkid
Isn’t there exculpatory evidence against charging Smith? I thought I read where numerous times the ex called the police alleging abuse, he was at practice at the supposed times of the incidents. If so, Urban may have known this and felt he complied with the letter and spirit of the contract by making notifications but not firing Smith.
I’m as big of a B1G and Urbs hater going, but the case for firing him is shaky.
I’m as big of a B1G and Urbs hater going, but the case for firing him is shaky.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:09 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
Except for Paterno actually had verifiable evidence of what Sandusky was doing. Text messages to Meyer's wife are not proof of anything. Y'all are really expanding the criminal code here. Really setting yourselves up for failure with these definitions of moral obligations.
Link please to where Paterno witnessed it. I remember reading it was reported to him but he did not witness so are you saying that someone else saying they saw it is verifiable?
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:11 pm to 14&Counting
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Meyer absolutely had a legal, moral, and ethical responsibility to step in and report this. There is no debate.
I hope he stay's...the gameday signs are going to be fantastic.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:17 pm to 14&Counting
quote:There was nothing to report. He was an employee of the university via the football program. Meyer is the head coach of said program. He can't put the blame off on anyone else because Meyer, being as powerful as he is, has the final say so and firing. It honestly falls on him, not the AD.
Dude you really need to stop. You are the one being obtuse. Meyer absolutely had a legal, moral, and ethical responsibility to step in and report this. There is no debate.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:18 pm to SoFla Tideroller
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I’m as big of a B1G and Urbs hater going, but the case for firing him is shaky.
The issue here is his contract which I do not have knowledge nor do any of us what language is in it. But since what happened at PSU many especially in the BIG10 I have read have put language in contracts that would require Meyer to do something like report. One of Paterno's main defenses was he told someone else and basically he was no longer involved. The NCAA and colleges now are no more. Meaning that many of the contracts have some moral code of conduct clauses in them that in this situation may be(if it happens) why Meyer is fired.
Since Sandusky turning an eye no longer works even if not directly involved. PSU did not endorse what happened but institutions and people in position like Meyer will now be held accountable.
Meyer from everything I read never broke the law so no expanding as the poster stated of the criminal code. No one is saying Meyer broke the law unless they can prove he knew and obstructed it by his knowledge and not reporting. But the perception that Meyer(which means OSU in the public eye) knew which allowed the behavior to continue is enough to have him fired and may as mentioned be in his contract. Especially in today's society where an institution does not want to promote football over education and what is morally acceptable.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 1:21 pm
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:29 pm to 14&Counting
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Dude you really need to stop. You are the one being obtuse. Meyer absolutely had a legal, moral, and ethical responsibility to step in and report this. There is no debate.
No, he did not. He may have had a professional responsibility to report rumors to his employer, but there is no legal, moral, or ethical responsibility to spread rumors. In fact, he would not have been able to provide anything of substance to law enforcement officials had he even reported it to them. His wife may have been able to provide such evidence, but even that would not be admissible if the wife would not have stood by the texts in court.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:33 pm to TideWarrior
I love how the OSU president presents what appears to be a set timeline for the investigation, and when questioned, pops off that "It will be over when it's over". Very Yogi-esque of him.
Posted on 8/20/18 at 1:40 pm to MontyFranklyn
quote:
There was nothing to report. He was an employee of the university via the football program. Meyer is the head coach of said program. He can't put the blame off on anyone else because Meyer, being as powerful as he is, has the final say so and firing. It honestly falls on him, not the AD.
Coach employment contracts (hirings) are typically subject to university administration approval. Smith's firing might've been as well. Obviously, Meyer's potential firing is. If Meyer followed OSUs reporting protocol well before the media exposed everything and OSU higher ups had failed to investigate and/or let Smith remain employed inappropriately, then it gets more complicated for Meyer, the higher ups and OSU.
This post was edited on 8/20/18 at 1:47 pm
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