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re: Tide Football Thread in honor of TidalSurge
Posted on 8/8/24 at 8:42 pm to Sl0thstronautEsq
Posted on 8/8/24 at 8:42 pm to Sl0thstronautEsq
quote:
I thought Christian Miller was doing a pretty good job. I wonder if he moved to a different gig.
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Posted on 8/9/24 at 6:10 am to 1BamaRTR
quote:
Instead Hurts was made to drop back to throw over 35 times
There’s a lot that could’ve been different that game, but we took the lead due to a great Hurts scramble TD with only 2min left, and let them go 70 yards anyway. Plenty of blame to go around that game.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 8:42 am to HighTide_ATL
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There’s a lot that could’ve been different that game, but we took the lead due to a great Hurts scramble TD with only 2min left, and let them go 70 yards anyway. Plenty of blame to go around that game.
The entire Jalen Hurts era at Bama is almost impossible to explain to people who didn’t live through it.
Obviously a great teammate who had massive upside, but man it was difficult to watch much of the time.
I mean what do you do with him year two against good to great defenses? He couldn’t pass or read a defense yet, so it was RPO left or right with various window dressing.
I’m not sure I’ve ever been happier for someone to get that win in the SECCG or have the success he’s had in the NFL, but he needed more time in the oven before he was ready to be a championship level QB than he got at Bama.
Had Blake Barnett panned out the narrative on Hurts would’ve been completely different, but very few guys can run a championship offense week 1 as a TF.
But I digress. Time to focus on the new, but similar QB journey of Jalen Milroe who I think has a higher ceiling than Hurts did.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 9:45 am to tide06
The first two years of Hurts, on passing downs, he would basically take one look roll to his right and throw it up in the stands. That happened over and over. Milroe seemed to look for the deep pass until he either threw it or got sacked. Hurts improved his last year at Alabama while watching from the bench and continued to improve after he left. Neither have been the RPO, slant pass, quick hitters. Hopefully Milroe can learn to find the receiver that has a linebacker on him, and get the ball to him. Sometimes that takes leading the receiver with a soft throw over the defender.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 10:13 am to HighTide_ATL
quote:
Plenty of blame to go around that game.
Sure. I wasn’t necessarily blaming Hurts, I was blaming the play calling for not adjusting. You have a freshman QB that was struggling to throw especially as of recent and yet you making him throw more. It would be like if Bama had McElroy throw a bunch in the title game vs Texas despite having broken ribs and 2 elite RBs. Can’t fully blame Sark either because Kiffin bailed suddenly.
quote:
let them go 70 yards anyway.
I can’t blame the defense a lot either because they were clearly exhausted. Clemson scored 7pt through 2.5 quarters. It was only after the offense punted 12 times and went like 7 straight drives without a 1st down that Clemson finally took the lead.
I agree there’s lots to blame but the offensive play calling had a very easy fix. All they had to was run the ball literally a few more times and Bama would’ve won
Posted on 8/9/24 at 10:43 am to 1BamaRTR
Yep, you nailed it regarding that game. Defense was very good until they just wore down in the 4t5h quarter. That was another good example of how Saban's stubbornness to not rotate the DL caught up. You can't expect the big dudes up front to hold up for 80+ snaps. I'm sure their legs were absolutely dead in that 4th quarter.
The playcalling in that game was just so hard to stomach, and watching Hurts trying to function against a capable D was too. It was just a game to forget all the way around.
The playcalling in that game was just so hard to stomach, and watching Hurts trying to function against a capable D was too. It was just a game to forget all the way around.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 11:55 am to IB4bama
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Hopefully Milroe can learn to find the receiver that has a linebacker on him, and get the ball to him. Sometimes that takes leading the receiver with a soft throw over the defender.
I think we are a full year or two behind where we should be with Milroe due in part to coaching.
O’Brien didn’t like him and wanted him gone based on what’s been said from multiple parties so I don’t think he was developed at all until Rees got here.
Now Tommy Rees isn’t exactly a QB guru, but I saw real growth from Tennessee on when the playbook opened at halftime of that game to the end of the season.
Just the data alone tells you how much better Milroe is at this stage of his career than Hurts was even given the relative challenges early last year with the OL.
I really wish we could’ve held onto Bond who IMO could’ve been a featured WR1 safety blanket, but with DeBoer developing him and what on paper should be a vastly improved OL I’m confident season two of Jalen Milroe will look more like the guy who was getting Heisman hype at the end of the season than the guy who got benched against USF, even if he isn’t the NFL finished product he might’ve been if he’d gotten coached by Sark or Kiffin early on.
This post was edited on 8/9/24 at 3:11 pm
Posted on 8/9/24 at 12:00 pm to tide06
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Just the data alone tells you how much better Milroe is at this stage of his career than Hurts was
I'm not disagreeing with you that Milroe showed improvements. But at this stage of their careers (3rd year finished and entering 4th year) Hurts was much improved. Because that was the 2018 and 2019 seasons for Hurts
This post was edited on 8/9/24 at 12:25 pm
Posted on 8/9/24 at 12:24 pm to 1BamaRTR
I’m interested to see how quick the new staff tries to get Ty Simpson in the game to get a look at what he can do with the first team group.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 12:46 pm to IB4bama
Pretty much. He was smart enough to throw it out of bounds but instinctively cut the field in half every single passing down. Hell, probably 20% of his passing yardage was pop-passes. That's the only way he could break 200 yards in the air
I do agree though, 2018/2019 Hurts was ahead of Milroe even with some of the rolling kinks. Much more natural runner as well. If Milroe had Jalen's running ability he would've cleared 1K last year
I do agree though, 2018/2019 Hurts was ahead of Milroe even with some of the rolling kinks. Much more natural runner as well. If Milroe had Jalen's running ability he would've cleared 1K last year
This post was edited on 8/9/24 at 12:48 pm
Posted on 8/9/24 at 2:17 pm to UhOhOreo
I'm a firm believe that Jalen Hurts was not served by starting as a freshman because it allowed some issues to fester instead of getting corrected.
But comparing the two I don't see them as terribly similar.
Hurts was better in the pocket than Milro who has some of the worst pocket presence I've ever seen (granted the snaps didn't help)
Milro when he goes north south is lethal, one of the best I've seen while Hurts is mid to slightly above average.
Both were too slow reading defenses (which for Milro being his first year is normal)
Hurts was better in intermediate passing while Milro is below average
Milro is as good a deep ball passer as you'll see while Hurts was maybe average.
Hurts definitely benefited from the time on the bench as a senior. Sometimes you just need to step back and see your flaws. He never had time before because the team depended on him. His SEC title win in 2018 was one of my favorite moments.
I think Milro to this point in my opinion has not had as good as coaching as Hurts had.
Hurts got a ton of positive hype during his time at Alabama until his season began to unravel in 2017. While Milro has been criticized to this point more than he deserved.
Hurts refused to let bad fortune get him down and he willed himself into an NFL career. I hope Milro can have that as well but this season will likely determine if that's possible. I'm rooting for him.
But comparing the two I don't see them as terribly similar.
Hurts was better in the pocket than Milro who has some of the worst pocket presence I've ever seen (granted the snaps didn't help)
Milro when he goes north south is lethal, one of the best I've seen while Hurts is mid to slightly above average.
Both were too slow reading defenses (which for Milro being his first year is normal)
Hurts was better in intermediate passing while Milro is below average
Milro is as good a deep ball passer as you'll see while Hurts was maybe average.
Hurts definitely benefited from the time on the bench as a senior. Sometimes you just need to step back and see your flaws. He never had time before because the team depended on him. His SEC title win in 2018 was one of my favorite moments.
I think Milro to this point in my opinion has not had as good as coaching as Hurts had.
Hurts got a ton of positive hype during his time at Alabama until his season began to unravel in 2017. While Milro has been criticized to this point more than he deserved.
Hurts refused to let bad fortune get him down and he willed himself into an NFL career. I hope Milro can have that as well but this season will likely determine if that's possible. I'm rooting for him.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 2:42 pm to slammer66
I think Hurts having Brian Daboll his second hurt him. It sucked that Kiffin elected to skip out the National Championship game. Not only did it hurt that game, but Sarkisian probably wouldn't have left for the Falcons.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 2:58 pm to slammer66
We’re going to find out quickly whether or not Jalen fits into this new offense. DeBoer has always been a coach who likes to throw the ball and I’m not sure if Milroe fits into the scheme. That’s not me hating on him. It’s a fact. Ty Simpson is a better passer than him. He just doesn’t have the in game experience that Milroe has. As I said earlier, it is going to be very interesting to see how quickly DeBoer can get him reps with the first team offense during a game situation.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:07 pm to bamatide07
quote:
We’re going to find out quickly whether or not Jalen fits into this new offense. DeBoer has always been a coach who likes to throw the ball and I’m not sure if Milroe fits into the scheme.
You think that DeBoer would start Milroe if he "didn't fit into the scheme?"
quote:
It’s a fact. Ty Simpson is a better passer than him.
That is actually not a fact. Could very well be true, but its not a fact.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:33 pm to UhOhOreo
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If Milroe had Jalen's running ability he would've cleared 1K last year
Kiffin helps. Jaxon Dart had similar rushing stats to Milroe but if you put the two in the combine, I bet Milroe blows him out of the water
I will say Milroe is not a crafty runner. Hurts was from the get-go
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:35 pm to Funky Tide 8
What we as fans MUST accept is that Jalen Milroe is the unquestioned #1 QB until something happens to upset that apple cart. No coach in his right mind would go against the "leadership" and "experience" he brings to the table. Not to mention the physical and mental maturity.
Again, I am making ZERO predictions on how this situation will play out over the course of the first 4-5 games. But barring a disaster, JM will be the starting QB at least through the Georgia game. Both the coaches and the fans will have a MUCH better grasp on the picture from that game forward.
I will say this too. In 2023, Ty did not exhibit the composure or maturity to lead a team at QB. What we all need to hope for is that the DeBoer/Sheridan combo has worked its magic on both of them. If so, there won't be any major concerns with the most important position. Not too much longer before we see for ourselves. Until then, I'm giving all of them the benefit of the doubt.
Again, I am making ZERO predictions on how this situation will play out over the course of the first 4-5 games. But barring a disaster, JM will be the starting QB at least through the Georgia game. Both the coaches and the fans will have a MUCH better grasp on the picture from that game forward.
I will say this too. In 2023, Ty did not exhibit the composure or maturity to lead a team at QB. What we all need to hope for is that the DeBoer/Sheridan combo has worked its magic on both of them. If so, there won't be any major concerns with the most important position. Not too much longer before we see for ourselves. Until then, I'm giving all of them the benefit of the doubt.
This post was edited on 8/9/24 at 3:36 pm
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:38 pm to bamatide07
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As I said earlier, it is going to be very interesting to see how quickly DeBoer can get him reps with the first team offense during a game situation.
How many great head coaches have to pick Milroe over Simpson before we start to consider that Jalen is the better man
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:43 pm to Glorious
When he gets replaced this year I’ll bring the receipts.
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:44 pm to bamatide07
quote:
When he gets replaced this year I’ll bring the receipts.
I will be ecstatic if someone steps up and beats him out. Especially if he hasn’t progressed
Posted on 8/9/24 at 3:49 pm to Glorious
Again, anyone expecting Milroe not to start the first four games is gonna be hugely disappointed. Barring injury, it's a lock. If any serious evaluation of the QB position needs to be done, it will be done following that game.
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