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re: Fromm Didn't Take Us Anywhere Last Year
Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:36 pm to djsdawg
Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:36 pm to djsdawg
quote:
It’s a safe assumption. Make the d focus on the running backs, just like last year, and provide safe high % throws, just like last year.
Sounds easy. I wonder why they didn't do that with Marino, Rosen, Plunkett, Lamar jackson etc?
This post was edited on 10/22/18 at 3:37 pm
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Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:36 pm to djsdawg
Who the hell is Jim Plunkett?
Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:38 pm to deeprig9
Look him up. Heisman Trophy winner. But people can pick more recent QB's if they want. I was just trying to pick great QB's.
Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:48 pm to DawgsLife
It is easy. Elite talent plus safe and effective game plan. We have that, doubt the others did.
This post was edited on 10/22/18 at 3:48 pm
Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:53 pm to djsdawg
quote:
It is easy. Elite talent plus safe and effective game plan. We have that, doubt the others did.
Well, pretty sure Pittsburgh was fair when Marino was there.
ETA
Looked it up. They were 11-1 Marino's first year.
This post was edited on 10/22/18 at 3:57 pm
Posted on 10/22/18 at 3:58 pm to DawgsLife
I mean, there all sorts of dodges you can use...if they didn't have a good season it was because the rest of the team was bad and not because the QB play was bad.
We can go round and round about this, but all we really need to know is most college coaches prefer not to have a freshman QB. When you look at the numbers it becomes clear why.
We can go round and round about this, but all we really need to know is most college coaches prefer not to have a freshman QB. When you look at the numbers it becomes clear why.
Posted on 10/22/18 at 4:01 pm to DawgsLife
We know it worked for uga last year and We still have the same advantages. It seemed to have worked for Pitt too. Worked for Bama in 2016.
Posted on 10/22/18 at 4:14 pm to djsdawg
quote:
We know it worked for uga last year and We still have the same advantages.
Except we don't know about chemistry or how Fields would do. You can't compare last year to this year. They are two different teams.
Surely you aren't arguing this team is as talented as last years?
We might have as much or more, but it is very much inexperienced.
Posted on 10/22/18 at 4:15 pm to djsdawg
quote:
It seemed to have worked for Pitt too.
Was that because of the QB? If we had freshman Marino playing for us right now you all would be screaming for him to be benched.
Posted on 10/22/18 at 4:18 pm to DawgsLife
Dan Marino 58.6% Comp 10TD 9INT (Freshman)
Jake Fromm 66.9% Comp 13TD 4INTs (This year)
Jake Fromm's statistics are better than Dan Marino's when he was a freshman. Yep. You guys would be screaming for him to be benched.
Jake Fromm 66.9% Comp 13TD 4INTs (This year)
Jake Fromm's statistics are better than Dan Marino's when he was a freshman. Yep. You guys would be screaming for him to be benched.
This post was edited on 10/22/18 at 4:19 pm
Posted on 10/23/18 at 10:36 am to DawgsLife
quote:
Except we don't know about chemistry or how Fields would do. You can't compare last year to this year. They are two different teams.
Surely you aren't arguing this team is as talented as last years?
We might have as much or more, but it is very much inexperienced.
Fields is a very likable kid, just like Fromm.
The offensive supporting cast remains elite.
Posted on 10/23/18 at 10:37 am to DawgsLife
quote:
Jake Fromm's statistics are better than Dan Marino's when he was a freshman. Yep. You guys would be screaming for him to be benched.
Different era. Heck, The standard for quality passing has changed a lot since 2002, and you are talking about 1979?
Posted on 10/23/18 at 10:59 am to djsdawg
quote:
Fields is a very likable kid, just like Fromm.
I get that. but likeability has nothing to do with team chemistry.
quote:
The offensive supporting cast remains elite.
Maybe. Receivers have dropped a lot of passes, OLine is banged up. The talent is there, but somethign is off.
Could be team chemistry, play calling, players trying to do too much. While we have a lot of returning payers there was also a lot of changes made. Thomas moved to RT, Robertson joined, Cleveland hurt, Mays filling in, Wilson at RT, Fields coming on the scene....there is a lot going on that can affect team chemistry and cause things to be out of sync.
Add to that that Chaney was Fromm's coach last year and now he is with the TE's. Tons of stuff go into team chemistry and can either improve it or weaken it.
Posted on 10/23/18 at 11:23 am to DawgsLife
quote:
Receivers have dropped a lot of passes, OLine is banged up. The talent is there, but somethign is off.
WRs have not dropped a lot of passes. OL is still good. What it off is going away from the 2017 strategy, which we would be using if we were ”limited” by a freshman Qb. Maybe being limited by that is a good thing.
Posted on 10/23/18 at 12:07 pm to djsdawg
quote:
Different era. Heck, The standard for quality passing has changed a lot since 2002, and you are talking about 1979?
Better Freshman numbers than Stafford,Murray(R) and Green (R)
Posted on 10/23/18 at 12:08 pm to djsdawg
quote:
WRs have not dropped a lot of passes.
I guess a lot is subjective. Broken routes, dropped passes, passes in which the WR has "alligator arms". All in all i have been less impressed with our WR's than last year.
That could be a matter of poor play by Fromm, though, or opportunities.
quote:
OL is still good.
Not really. I mean, I realize that there is some rating system that grades them out well, but they are beat up and not playing at the level they could be playing at. better than two years ago? Much. As good as they could/should? no. Just my opinion, though. But there is no denying that we have players hurt and several (Mays, Thomas, Wilson) playing new positions or are new to starting.
quote:
What it off is going away from the 2017 strategy, which we would be using if we were ”limited” by a freshman Qb. Maybe being limited by that is a good thing.
Thta's possible. No arguing that. Fromm seemed more confident when he was doing pre reads and throwing without thinking as much. I don't know if some fo that has to do with Fields being a threat and he is being too fine, trying not to make mistakes...or what it is, exactly. But yeah, I can see what you are saying, and you very well could be right.
Posted on 10/23/18 at 12:11 pm to djsdawg
quote:
Different era. Heck, The standard for quality passing has changed a lot since 2002, and you are talking about 1979?
I mean our offense is more closely resembling the pro style offenses run in 1979, than the spread and throw the ball around offenses used today.
But if it would make you feel better I can use more recent QB's. I was just trying to get some of the better known Heisman winning QB's.
ETA
Shea Patterson and Jacob Eason are two highly rated QB's recently. Top two fo their class. Do you want to use their freshman numbers?
Josh Rosen from the year before threw 11 INTs, although he threw for a ton of yards...but we don't throw the ball nearly as much.
The year before that the top rated QB was Kyle Allen.
The point is....if you start a QB his true freshman year, you had better be able to weather a lot of storms. Most will not have numbers as god as Fromm this year. You might be able to find one or two that has a successful year overall, but most cost their teams games.
This post was edited on 10/23/18 at 12:17 pm
Posted on 10/23/18 at 12:43 pm to DawgsLife
quote:
I guess a lot is subjective. Broken routes, dropped passes, passes in which the WR has "alligator arms". All in all i have been less impressed with our WR's than last year.
That could be a matter of poor play by Fromm, though, or opportunities.
It's a combination of factors. Not the least of which is the absence of Wims. For Fromm's style of play, a true jump ball receiver was a HUGE help for him on down field throws. The accuracy wasn't a huge issue, rather get it near him and high and he could possibly bring it down or at least win the battle for incompletion vs interception.
Outside of that, I'd say the WR play has been about on par. Hardman playing better than he did early last year, but not as good as he did late. Fromm does seem to be making more mistakes in terms of missing open receivers, leading too much/overthrows especially.
quote:
OL is still good.
It's nowhere near the level of consistency of what he had by the end of last year.
Thomas playing injured < Wynn at full strength
Big Country full strength > Mays playing as backup
Wilson at RT < Thomas at RT
There's a lot of talent there, but it's just not equivalent to what he had last year. This wasn't why he struggled in the LSU game, but it does explain a lot of the other struggles this season.
quote:
What it off is going away from the 2017 strategy, which we would be using if we were ”limited” by a freshman Qb. Maybe being limited by that is a good thing.
Offensive approach definitely seems to be lacking. Using a carbon copy of the "limited" offense from 2017 for Fields may not work effectively as we rarely if ever planned on one of the "checkdown options" to be a QB run with Fromm. But perhaps more frustrating is why we feel the need to significantly change what Fromm is doing at the position to begin with... Overcomplicating things for the sake of doing so seems silly.
I'm firmly in the camp of "Give Fields more time, let us see what he can do", but the entire narrative by some here that Fromm is terrible, didn't accomplish anything, and doesn't deserve to continue to start is laughable at best. Kid's playing "well" by objective measures... he simply isn't playing "incredible". Everyone wants to jump to the conclusion that Justin is ready to deliver that standard, and I'm not sold that he is based on the limited dataset we have so far.
Posted on 10/23/18 at 1:29 pm to fibonaccisquared
So Fromm needs a "true jump ball reciever"? Why is that?
Posted on 10/23/18 at 1:39 pm to RiverDawg
quote:
So Fromm needs a "true jump ball reciever"? Why is that?
Where did I say he "needs" one... One is certainly beneficial. And would be regardless of who is at QB. I'm kind of surprised that Matt Landers hasn't commanded some time in that role given the talk last year, but can only assume he hasn't continued to develop at the same rate.
Jesus some of you boys are dense.
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