re: Eason will start vs Vandy?

Did Eason throw at all against Tennessee? I was thinking we were near the goal line once and Eason threw an incompletion.

quote:

---

Did Eason throw at all against Tennessee? I was thinking we were near the goal line once and Eason threw an incompletion.

---

Yeah, late in the game when they brought him in, he threw a 3rd and goal pass. Missed the correct read, late delivery and too high for the receiver (Nauta IIRC?). It wasn't a good pass, but it also was delivered in a spot that at worst left us kicking a FG... I put it marginally better than Fromm's first throw in the game when the receiver (Nauta again?) fell down mid route.

quote:

---

When Fromm came into App State, that was clearly off script.

---

How do you reach this conclusion?

quote:

---

Fromm's first pass was not just incomplete, it should have been intercepted.


Because the target was on the ground?

---

The target he chose before the snap? And refused to even look at a wide open Sony before throwing it to the pre-snap choice who was already tripping by the time the ball was in the air?

He threw it to a spot where the receiver was suppose to be. And he made the decision to throw it there before he even got in position.

It was absolutely a poor decision and a horrendous read. That is why Kirby was on the field, screaming in his face as he came off. It was such a bad decision and an even worse read that the head honcho couldn’t wait for his QB to make it back to the sideline to confront him about it.

It has been mentioned by multiple analysts that Jake never checks down. ALWAYS throws to the first read. Sooner or later the windows will tighten and he won’t be so lucky.

I’m guessing the coaches know more about football than anyone on this board and we will find out as the season progresses who makes the team best.

All of you cats claiming there is definitive proof that Fromm is better than Eason are exhibiting extreme myopia.

Fromm may very well be the answer. If he is, great. We are all behind the team and want them to do well. If it turns out that Eason actually makes the team better, I hope those of you hanging off Fromms nuts won’t be too disappointed.

quote:

---

I fully understood the point

---

Clearly you didn't, when you attempted to offer up a "better alternative"... the point is that there *isn't* a better alternative to compare a sample size of 4 passes. I'll admit that I gave you a fair amount of snark, but nothing about my claim was stupid... at least not unintentionally so.

quote:

---

As for Eason's app state throws, 2 were a few yards too high. That's an issue he had last year and it was an issue he had to start 2017.

---

Taming the cannon is something he has to show demonstrable improvement on. In 4 passes, it hasn't been shown it yet... I've also seen Fromm throw balls well above the receiver in question, though less frequently than we saw from Eason last year (he's also been under less pressure in general)...

As noted by DawgHolliday, Fromm has his own set of potential pitfalls based on how he reads/selects his target. Getting a larger sample size is really the only way to know one way or the other... why that seems to be hard to admit I'll never know, but never change man... stick to your guns.

quote:

---

I can't even take you seriously...

---

Because I don't jump to wild conclusions without any good reason like you have twice today?

quote:

---

was absolutely a poor decision and a horrendous read.

---

You are Pointing out the obvious for no reason. I don't think one person has argued otherwise.

quote:

---

Because I don't jump to wild conclusions without any good reason

---

now you're being intentionally obtuse.

quote:

---

Part of that is scheme... Chicken/Egg... either way, Chaney will eat it.

---

I agree that that's part of it. It's just interesting to note that we had such a problem with our OL blocking for Eason last year and our scheme didn't change to focus on more short passes like we're doing with Fromm. Didn't really happy last year but we were able to change it up [b]immediately[/i] when Fromm came in cold in our first game. Was it planned/schemed that way or was it the difference in the decision making of the QBs? Tough to say but there's a noticeable difference between Fromm and Eason in this regard.

quote:

---

Even when we went quick/short passing last year, defenses sat on those throws, jumped routes, and/or our brick handed receivers did what they often do..

---

Certainly but I think at least part of that was on Eason. His reads and his throws weren't accurate and he put too much heat on the ball in such short distances for our receivers to be successful. Fromm is doing really well with the short passes. Is that because the defenses we've faced are vastly inferior or because our receivers have made drastic strides since last year?

quote:

---

Don't have an easy way of grabbing the exacts from 2016, but was curious. Using cfbstats.com we can at least get a percentage of passing plays based on distance to go ranges:
…
So in the lone game where Fromm had an average yardage to go on third down of that number or higher, he completed slightly less.

---

Rig provided some links that compare both of their percentages on the various distances and Fromm came out on top when all three were averaged out (Eason won the head-to-head on 4-6 yards; Fromm creamed Eason on 7-9 yards; and they were tied on 10+).

quote:

---

He's good... what the team is doing around him is helping a ton though

---

Regardless of the comparison, my point was giving those stats was to show what Fromm did on 3rd downs because the argument was that Fromm has benefited from short yardage on 3rd downs because of our running game. I think the stats show that Fromm isn't getting the benefit of the running game on 3rd downs, at least not when he's throwing the ball. We've been doing a lot better on picking up yards on 1st and 2nd downs and then running again on 3rd and short to move the chains.

quote:

---

This is what *I* have been saying since the beginning. I'm not sure what everyone else is attempting to point out, but that's really the only point I've made since the beginning. Just pump the brakes on the Fromm is incredible train... let the thing play out. He's playing well on a better team. If Eason gets significant time and doesn't look improved, guess who will be one of the first to acknowledge it. So far, he simply hasn't been given much of an opportunity to show us one way or the other.

---

Agreed. I think so many people (including me) are on the Fromm train because he passes the eye test at QB, has shown improvement as a football player each game (showing his ability to run last game); and has done a great job of leading our offense in a 5-0 start to the season. I'm of the opinion that if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

quote:

---

1st pass …
Fourth pass - awful….

---

Eason should be judged a little more harshly considering he has a complete season under his belt, so missing 3 out of 4 of his open targets seems a lot worse to me. But putting that subjectivity aside, my complaint with Eason in those examples is that he is not accurate, even in throwing short passes which should be easier to be more accurate on than the deep ones. You made a remark about the 3rd pass looking like it got there before Wims was expecting it. That tells me that either the timing was off (weird considering Eason got the lion's share of the 1st team reps leading into the game) or that he just threw it too fast for Wimms to react and catch it, which shows that he hasn't learned to take a little off his passes to make them more "catchable" than last season. Regardless, on to Fromm.

While Fromm's first pass example was getting much criticism, the replay showed that Michel was only "obviously" open once Fromm had started his motion to throw to Nauta. It was a bad read, yes, but the ugliness of the throw was primarily due to Nauta stumbling and falling down. Aside from the bad read, we don't know how "bad" the throw was because the intended receiver wasn't able to complete his route. Interceptions happen all the time when receivers and QBs aren't on the same page but unless the QB got confused or threw the ball way off from the route of the target, it's not necessarily the QB's fault.

Fromm's 2nd pass was good because Wimms had about 5 yards of separation between him and his defender. If you've got an easy open pass, why not take it? I don't fault Eason for hitting his receiver on a short pass.

Fromm's 3rd pass was really good. It was thrown where only the receiver could get it and would have picked up a quarter of the total yards of the field if Hardman catches it. Can't fault Fromm for that one and that was the point: it wasn't an incompletion because Fromm screwed up with a bad throw.

Fromm's 4th pass was bad like I said. He was trying to hit his receiver on a slant but both line backers went straight for his intended target. Chalk it up to a rookie mistake. Like I said before, he had one bad throw, one questionable throw (Nauta fell down) on a bad read and two good throws. Eason only had the one good throw.

quote:

---

So while Fromm delivers 2 balls on the money, he squeaks by with 2 *very* bad throws. None of Eason's balls had a chance of resulting in a turnover. If we're giving credit for the well delivered ball that was dropped, we've got to take points away for giving the opponent a chance to flip possession. In no scenario does that decision making (Kirby's criteria for evaluation more so than results) "look better".

---

In fairness, we don't know if his first incompletion was a *very* bad throw. Receivers falling down during their routes tend to make throws look bad even if the throw was accurate and on time assuming a good route. If you want to take points away, I'll take a point away from his 4th throw where the receiver looked like he did what he was supposed to do but the ball wasn't delivered well. Eason didn't have any defenders sitting behind his receivers that could have resulted in an interception but I won't give credit for luck just like I'm not giving Fromm credit for luck. I am also not going to take points away from Fromm for bad luck (receiver falling down). Worst case scenario based on what actually happened when comparing those four passes is that Fromm did as well as the QB who had another half of a season under his belt.

quote:

---

Until a reasonable sample size has been generated, it's really not a comparison that is worth making. Fromm has thrown the ball 2000% more than Eason this season. Let's at least look at something that's not orders of magnitude different before we try to claim that Fromm has "seized his opportunity".

---

Every snap counts. All players are vying for playing time and want chances to prove themselves. Some players only get a few snaps to show what they can do and when they don't perform, it doesn't inspire confidence in their coaches or their fans. Ramsey had a few chances to show that he has improved. He's been in the program for years now and he looked ugly out there. Fromm as a true freshman without taking a snap in a college game before came in cold and got the offense moving by completing some passes. He made the most of his first few snaps against App State. Eason has only thrown the ball 4 times so far but he has not made the most of his chances by hitting his targets.

It’s a pre-teen fight you have had a pretty heavy hand in, Bella.