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re: Who has the best resume? (11-1 Bama, 11-1 Arky, 11-1 LSU)
Posted on 11/23/11 at 12:34 pm to hogfan870
Posted on 11/23/11 at 12:34 pm to hogfan870
That's an interesting way to look at it, and I must say that's one of the first logical/reasonable points that an Arkansas fan has made.
(kind of excluding OOC to break the SEC tie)....
Of course, we all know they don't do that, especially given that the SEC uses the BCS reanking in its tiebreakers. I think you make a good case that the BCS rankings shouldn't be used in breaking an SEC tie.
My only counter-point to that would be a question: Does Arkansas' performance against Vandy and Ole Miss outweigh or at least somewhat mitigate Arky's tougher SEC schedule?
(kind of excluding OOC to break the SEC tie)....
Of course, we all know they don't do that, especially given that the SEC uses the BCS reanking in its tiebreakers. I think you make a good case that the BCS rankings shouldn't be used in breaking an SEC tie.
My only counter-point to that would be a question: Does Arkansas' performance against Vandy and Ole Miss outweigh or at least somewhat mitigate Arky's tougher SEC schedule?
This post was edited on 11/23/11 at 12:37 pm
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Posted on 11/23/11 at 12:40 pm to hashtag
quote:
Arkansas - sorry, even though you played ranked teams that are on average ranked higher than Alabama, you are still Arkansas and no one outside of your state cares.
Posted on 11/23/11 at 1:19 pm to hogfan870
No offense to arky fans but it don't matter where the game was played against bama. Championship caliber teams overcome and win those big road games. That makes the difference between good and great teams.
This post was edited on 11/23/11 at 1:23 pm
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:23 pm to PortCityTiger82
IMO, it might be a little different had Arky played Bama close, but they got throttled.
And many Arkansas fans just want to eliminate September and October from this conversation like those months didn't happen.
And many Arkansas fans just want to eliminate September and October from this conversation like those months didn't happen.
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:33 pm to JPLSU1981
quote:
And many Arkansas fans just want to eliminate September and October from this conversation like those months didn't happen.
Rightly or wrongly, games at the end of the season have usually been given more weight than games at the beginning. When two teams have the same record, and pretty equal SOS, but one team lost early in the season and one team loses late in the season, the team with the earlier loss will usually end up ahead of the team with the later loss. The college football season is unique in that way, and why it is pretty much a "playoff" in itself.
quote:
IMO, it might be a little different had Arky played Bama close, but they got throttled.
If Arkansas beats LSU with everyone watching for the last game of the season, I'm almost certain voters, the media, and popular opinion outside of Louisiana and Alabama will put much more weight on that win than Bama's 24 point win over Arkansas earlier in the season. It's just how it is.
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:37 pm to Jon Ham
Oh I'm well-aware of the importance of late-season wins and losses.
But as an LSU fan, I'm also aware that voters do the right thing in the end typically....see 2007. LSU lost late, they should be out of it, right? But, in the end, the most deserving team got the shot at the title.
LSU was the most deserving team then, and it appears will be the most deserving team again in 2011, even with a loss on Friday.
But as an LSU fan, I'm also aware that voters do the right thing in the end typically....see 2007. LSU lost late, they should be out of it, right? But, in the end, the most deserving team got the shot at the title.
LSU was the most deserving team then, and it appears will be the most deserving team again in 2011, even with a loss on Friday.
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:40 pm to JPLSU1981
In response to the Vandy and Ole Miss question, I would say maybe so. Maybe there should be a tiebreaker that involves margin of victory (at least up to something like 21 points, so people don't complain about running up the score). The only thing I will say about that is that if that had been the rules at the time, everybody's scores may have been somewhat different.
For example, in the two games you mentioned, Vandy and Ole Miss, in our last possession of both games, we had the lead and Petrino called two running plays and then a conservative pass play. Both ended in three and outs. I remember both, because I was mad that we weren't more aggressive both times, but that is how Petrino is with the a lead in the fourth quarter, he tries to run the ball to wear the other team out and run the clock. The problem is, we don't run the ball very consistently. If Petrino had known margin of victory mattered, he may have been more aggressive. I'm sure there are comparable games for LSU and AL. Arkansas beat Ms. St. by 27, while AL and LSU only beat then by 17 and 13. Would AL and LSU have scored more against Ms St. if they knew margin of victory mattered? Maybe so. I honestly haven't run the margin of victory numbers for the three teams, but I would expect AR would come in last place on that scale.
For example, in the two games you mentioned, Vandy and Ole Miss, in our last possession of both games, we had the lead and Petrino called two running plays and then a conservative pass play. Both ended in three and outs. I remember both, because I was mad that we weren't more aggressive both times, but that is how Petrino is with the a lead in the fourth quarter, he tries to run the ball to wear the other team out and run the clock. The problem is, we don't run the ball very consistently. If Petrino had known margin of victory mattered, he may have been more aggressive. I'm sure there are comparable games for LSU and AL. Arkansas beat Ms. St. by 27, while AL and LSU only beat then by 17 and 13. Would AL and LSU have scored more against Ms St. if they knew margin of victory mattered? Maybe so. I honestly haven't run the margin of victory numbers for the three teams, but I would expect AR would come in last place on that scale.
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:41 pm to JPLSU1981
quote:
LSU was the most deserving team then, and it appears will be the most deserving team again in 2011, even with a loss on Friday.
I agree. That's why voters should do the right thing and move Bama down to 3 if Arkansas beats LSU.
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:43 pm to hogfan870
Didn't vandy miss a last second field goal? Yall didn't have a chance to run up the score
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:46 pm to JPLSU1981
Arkansas did get throttled, thats no secret. I ask this and let me preface it by saying this is a honest question not a prediction as i believe LSu clearly has the advantage.
-If Arkansas beats LSU by a good margin like Alabama beat Arkansas what happens then?
Seriously, who will be able to claim what?
One more thing, if by some chance (again not a prediction) Arkansas beats LSU then one of the top 3 teams in the nation - all with the same record - will not get a BCS bowl! Regardless of who comes out on the crappy end of that stick, that is just wrong...
-If Arkansas beats LSU by a good margin like Alabama beat Arkansas what happens then?
Seriously, who will be able to claim what?
One more thing, if by some chance (again not a prediction) Arkansas beats LSU then one of the top 3 teams in the nation - all with the same record - will not get a BCS bowl! Regardless of who comes out on the crappy end of that stick, that is just wrong...
Posted on 11/23/11 at 2:55 pm to TigerBait1127
Like I said, we had the ball and the lead in on our last possession. We ran the ball twice (not our strong suit), threw a short pass and punted. Had we been more aggressive, we may have won that game by 10. Maybe not, but if we had been playing to build up our margin of victory points, I would think we would have called different plays.
Posted on 11/24/11 at 8:05 am to hogfan870
I watched that game....vandy shoulda won
Posted on 11/24/11 at 8:08 am to JPLSU1981
quote:
I watched that game....vandy shoulda won
Well they didn't...next
I was told by an LSU fan last season that sometime you just have to survive when you are fighting for a championship...That came after the UT game
LSU is going down and below us in the rankings
Posted on 11/24/11 at 8:12 am to HWY 7
If elephants can sing opera what happens then?
It's about as probable a situation
It's about as probable a situation
Posted on 11/24/11 at 8:20 am to ironsides
The only problem with this thread is LSU will beat Arky by 3
TDs
TDs
Posted on 11/24/11 at 8:42 am to sugatowng
True....Arkansas beat vandy, it's a W, and that's really all that matters.
But if these 3 teams end up tied at 11-1 and in a dead-lock, I think it's completely reasonable to take a closer examination of each team's schedules/performances over the course of the season
But if these 3 teams end up tied at 11-1 and in a dead-lock, I think it's completely reasonable to take a closer examination of each team's schedules/performances over the course of the season
This post was edited on 11/24/11 at 8:44 am
Posted on 11/24/11 at 9:28 am to JPLSU1981
This is all irrelevant. It's not like voters are going to look at resumes so indepth like this. They'll see that LSU lost and Alabama won and bump Alabama to #1. Only question is how far does LSU drop in the BCS, #2 or #3? With their computer ranking still higher than Arky, I'd expect #2, sending LSU to ATL and leaving #1 Alabama and #3 Arky at home. Personally I'd be ok with this, because it would make Alabama even harder to jump for some crap team like Ok St.
Posted on 11/24/11 at 10:49 am to hogfan870
quote:
Like I said, we had the ball and the lead in on our last possession. We ran the ball twice (not our strong suit), threw a short pass and punted. Had we been more aggressive, we may have won that game by 10. Maybe not, but if we had been playing to build up our margin of victory points, I would think we would have called different plays.
that doesn't make any sense. Yall weren't trying to put the game away only up 3? You have to have the game in hand before you can run up the score. Yall were holding on for yalls SEC life
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