Started By
Message
re: TD’s evaluation of Tua vs Joe
Posted on 9/18/19 at 10:35 am to lsupride87
Posted on 9/18/19 at 10:35 am to lsupride87
quote:
Seriously though, what has been the Bama argument against these stats?
I don't really know about an argument, but our offense is trying to expand Tua's reads to avoid unnecessary risk when there is an open target in stride, especially since those targets all have the ability to take a 7 yard slant or stop to the house.
Tua has already proven he can throw the ball down the field, and there will be a game down the line where that will be required again. But our playbook last year was very boom/bust, and it showed more against good defenses. As for the % on long throws, I'm pretty sure we've tried like a grand total of 7 or 8 of them. So, kind of a small sample size.
The quick/intermediate passing game is a feature, not a bug.
This post was edited on 9/18/19 at 10:36 am
1
Posted on 9/18/19 at 10:43 am to calcotron
quote:
I really don't care about college football's annual beauty contest. I'm just happy to have a QB who isn't Danny Etling, Brandon Harris, Anthony Jennings, and the list goes on. Enjoying such things should be required after much suffering.
This is the right attitude that I think the silent majority of LSU fans on here have. A few loud trolls would make others think otherwise but I'm giving most of you the benefit of the doubt.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 10:44 am to SD Tider
I love Joe Burrow. I think he has a chance to be one of the best QBs in the country this year but he just hasn't put enough on tape yet. 3 games with 2 against bad opponents isn't enough. Yes he's played better than Tua so far this year but Tua has put better QB play on tape so far in his career. Could Joe end up better than Tua? Yes.... But he hasn't done enough yet to say for certain he is. Let the season play out and evaluate then.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 10:45 am to JudgeHolden
quote:Yes Lawd!
Tua’s been great.
Joe is looking great.
Pray they both stay healthy.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:17 am to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
And those stats are for a full season - not just 1 game against the Big XII and teams with directions in their names.
How about we look closer at those stats...
vs Power 5 teams w/ +.500 record:
20+ yards: 9/22 (40%) - 347 yards - 6 TD - 2 INT
9 completions - 6 TDs...
*cough* heave and hope *cough*
11+ yards: 29/60 (48%) - 769 - 8 TD - 4 INT
vs Non Power 5 teams or teams with -.500 record:
20+ yards: 15/20 (75%) - 597 yards - 8 TD - 0 INT
11+ yards: 40/59 (68%) - 1071 yards - 17 TD - 0 INT
This post was edited on 9/18/19 at 11:18 am
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:22 am to TwoDatBait
quote:
pile of shite
Who mentioned Mond?
Have an upvote!
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:29 am to WilliamTaylor21
quote:
vs Power 5 teams w/ +.500 record:
20+ yards: 9/22 (40%) - 347 yards - 6 TD - 2 INT
So Tua vs only good teams is still better than full seasons for every 2017 QB other than Baker Mayfield including their games vs bad teams like Elon and New Mexico?
Wow! That's even better than I thought!
This post was edited on 9/18/19 at 11:34 am
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:39 am to SummerOfGeorge
But for real Willy where you getting those charts? Dem is purty.
This post was edited on 9/18/19 at 11:40 am
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:43 am to SummerOfGeorge
Now, only trying to be fair based on this comparison, because the two of you are good people IMO.
If we extrapolate the same numbers for 2017 Baker vs Power 5 teams w/ .500 record in 2017, they look like this:
20+ yards: 25/41 (61%) - 1,002 yards, 8 TD - 0 INT
Unfortunately I don’t have fancy passing charts like William does.
If we extrapolate the same numbers for 2017 Baker vs Power 5 teams w/ .500 record in 2017, they look like this:
20+ yards: 25/41 (61%) - 1,002 yards, 8 TD - 0 INT
Unfortunately I don’t have fancy passing charts like William does.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:44 am to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
So Tua vs only good teams is still better than full seasons for every 2017 QB other than Baker Mayfield?
Lamar Jackson, Josh Rosen, Sam Darnold - definitely mAsTeRs oF tHe dEeP bALL in college!
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:44 am to The_Ultimate_Warrior
quote:
Unfortunately I don’t have fancy passing charts like William does.
The man needs to answer our questions
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:46 am to The_Ultimate_Warrior
quote:
20+ yards: 25/41 (61%) - 1,002 yards, 8 TD - 0 INT
quote:
20+ yards: 9/22 (40%) - 347 yards - 6 TD - 2 INT
Ehhhh Tomato Potato
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:50 am to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
But for real Willy where you getting those charts? Dem is purty.
https://www.bigdatasports.com/ncaa/quarterback/pass-chart-per-qb/0216447
This post was edited on 9/18/19 at 11:51 am
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:51 am to WilliamTaylor21
I haven't been rick rolled in many, many years
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:54 am to SummerOfGeorge
I had a feeling the ole fake URL for text trick would catch you off guard
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:54 am to SummerOfGeorge
I think Tua and Burrow are both great QBs excelling in their own respective offenses, that are both distinctively different:
The Bama offense is perfect for what they have, which is amazingly quick WRs. They can all blow the top of a defense, which forces most teams to play deep. If they don't, Tua has proven that he will throw the ball deep on them and score TDs in a hurry. If they do play deep, he will throw those quick slants and the WRs will make amazing plays from there. Tua gets his pre-snap read and I would imagine from there he throws it to his #1 guy at a pretty high rate. Its a great offensive scheme.
Meanwhile, the LSU passing game is essentially what the Saints have been doing. The first read alot of the times is the RB. If there is no LB on him, it makes for a quick easy dump off and a gain of 5+ yards. If there is one on him, it typically means there is a vacated zone in the middle of the defense (in zone coverage). This is where Jefferson has thrived, 10-15 yard routes right in the middle of the field. Teams will get destroyed playing zone coverage on us this way. They ultimately switch to man coverage, where our 3 WRs will win most matchups. This does require Burrow to go through his progression and hold onto the ball a little longer though.
... All that to say, lets not get confused with who is better at what based off their offenses. I think Joe's offense will make him more experienced in reading defenses and going through a progression. However, I think Tua is a better QB prospect. I think Tua has a better arm, Joe is obviously bigger and more useful in the run game, I think they are about even in terms of accuracy.
The Bama offense is perfect for what they have, which is amazingly quick WRs. They can all blow the top of a defense, which forces most teams to play deep. If they don't, Tua has proven that he will throw the ball deep on them and score TDs in a hurry. If they do play deep, he will throw those quick slants and the WRs will make amazing plays from there. Tua gets his pre-snap read and I would imagine from there he throws it to his #1 guy at a pretty high rate. Its a great offensive scheme.
Meanwhile, the LSU passing game is essentially what the Saints have been doing. The first read alot of the times is the RB. If there is no LB on him, it makes for a quick easy dump off and a gain of 5+ yards. If there is one on him, it typically means there is a vacated zone in the middle of the defense (in zone coverage). This is where Jefferson has thrived, 10-15 yard routes right in the middle of the field. Teams will get destroyed playing zone coverage on us this way. They ultimately switch to man coverage, where our 3 WRs will win most matchups. This does require Burrow to go through his progression and hold onto the ball a little longer though.
... All that to say, lets not get confused with who is better at what based off their offenses. I think Joe's offense will make him more experienced in reading defenses and going through a progression. However, I think Tua is a better QB prospect. I think Tua has a better arm, Joe is obviously bigger and more useful in the run game, I think they are about even in terms of accuracy.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:57 am to WilliamTaylor21
quote:
I had a feeling the ole fake URL for text trick would catch you off guard
Not gonna lie, those charts and stat packs you posted wet my little whistle. I was antsy.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 11:59 am to GeauxPack81
quote:
I think Tua and Burrow are both great QBs excelling in their own respective offenses, that are both distinctively different:
The Bama offense is perfect for what they have, which is amazingly quick WRs. They can all blow the top of a defense, which forces most teams to play deep. If they don't, Tua has proven that he will throw the ball deep on them and score TDs in a hurry. If they do play deep, he will throw those quick slants and the WRs will make amazing plays from there. Tua gets his pre-snap read and I would imagine from there he throws it to his #1 guy at a pretty high rate. Its a great offensive scheme.
Meanwhile, the LSU passing game is essentially what the Saints have been doing. The first read alot of the times is the RB. If there is no LB on him, it makes for a quick easy dump off and a gain of 5+ yards. If there is one on him, it typically means there is a vacated zone in the middle of the defense (in zone coverage). This is where Jefferson has thrived, 10-15 yard routes right in the middle of the field. Teams will get destroyed playing zone coverage on us this way. They ultimately switch to man coverage, where our 3 WRs will win most matchups. This does require Burrow to go through his progression and hold onto the ball a little longer though.
... All that to say, lets not get confused with who is better at what based off their offenses. I think Joe's offense will make him more experienced in reading defenses and going through a progression. However, I think Tua is a better QB prospect. I think Tua has a better arm, Joe is obviously bigger and more useful in the run game, I think they are about even in terms of accuracy.
Pretty solid summation. Our 2019 offense is definitely more read and progress oriented, and Tua has clearly been throwing to his 2nd/3rd/4th option much more than he did in prior years.
Will be fun to watch the rest of the season - I really do want to see both of them play against good defenses to see ultimately how much better each has gotten.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 12:24 pm to GeauxPack81
Yes both are fine QBs, I really don't understand is LSU poster trying to say Burrow is doing something different than what basically what Tua did early last year. It's been a heavy RPO sets, with a of sprinkle under the center sets. Matter of fact 8 of Burrow's TD are from RPO reads.
What hurt Tua was Mike Locksley failed to adjust and add wrinkles in RPO sets. Teams started playing a 2 high(not quite cover 2) look with CBs playing inside technique.
RPO are all about creating false steps by the Mike and Will linebacker depending on what hash the ball is placed on. If that linebacker comes down you throw that inside slant off his inside shoulder. If that safety takes a poor angle it's BBQ chicken.
What hurt Tua was Mike Locksley failed to adjust and add wrinkles in RPO sets. Teams started playing a 2 high(not quite cover 2) look with CBs playing inside technique.
RPO are all about creating false steps by the Mike and Will linebacker depending on what hash the ball is placed on. If that linebacker comes down you throw that inside slant off his inside shoulder. If that safety takes a poor angle it's BBQ chicken.
Posted on 9/18/19 at 12:32 pm to SD Tider
LSU fans will make themselves believe anything, smh. Tua is the 1st pick in the draft next year, Joe isn't close to a 1st round pick. Joe will likely go in the 4/5 round.
Page 5 of 6
Popular
Back to top
Follow SECRant for SEC Football News