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Defensive Scheme
Posted on 1/3/14 at 12:21 am
Posted on 1/3/14 at 12:21 am
Let's discuss.
Why is it that first year guys seem to especially struggle in our system? How can we simplify it so that we can set our younger players up for success?
Look at teams like Florida and LSU. They seem to have an easier system for their young defensive backs. Our system with all of its checks seems to be too complicated.
Is it time to abandon the 3-4? We have struggled mightily to find an elite nose. In light of that, should we try a 4-3?
Why is it that first year guys seem to especially struggle in our system? How can we simplify it so that we can set our younger players up for success?
Look at teams like Florida and LSU. They seem to have an easier system for their young defensive backs. Our system with all of its checks seems to be too complicated.
Is it time to abandon the 3-4? We have struggled mightily to find an elite nose. In light of that, should we try a 4-3?
8
Posted on 1/3/14 at 12:37 am to chattabama
I feel like this is more of a tomorrow type thread 
Posted on 1/3/14 at 12:38 am to chattabama
quote:
Is it time to abandon the 3-4? We have struggled mightily to find an elite nose. In light of that, should we try a 4-3?
I don't think so. The 3-4, imo, is better suited for stopping speed on the corners and has power up the middle if you have a dominate nose tackle.
The thing is, Bama didn't have a dominate rush linebacker and haven't had since Upshaw. That has been a real need on this Defense for a couple of years now.
On the other hand, Coach Stallings switched to a 4-3 in 93 or 94 because he didn't have the personnel to run a true 3-4. So maybe? If we do, gonna need some smaller, faster guys at DE. Our big guys are slow on D.
Posted on 1/3/14 at 12:38 am to chattabama
Try a 4-3? You serious? 
Posted on 1/4/14 at 6:30 pm to Libertyabides71
quote:
Try a 4-3? You serious?
What do you have against it?
Posted on 1/4/14 at 6:56 pm to chattabama
Abandon? No
Dumb it down? Yes
To a fault most 3-4 systems don't allow athletes to be athletes, but rather system role players. I played at SIU under Coach Kill (4-3) and left after the new coaching staff incorporated a 3-4 system that was more complex than the 4-3. I witnessed a drastic change in my and fellow teammates playing speed because we second guessed our reads and had a lot of pre-snap reads from the sideline. Now I know playing speed isn't a problem with the studs we have, but a lot of confusion happened once Vinnie went out. In the 3-4 you need a good solid NT, without a solid NT you are open to a lot of downfield pressure, which we seen this year. If anything I think an emphasis on tracking the ball with our CBs is needed and more combo blitz packages is a must especially with R. Foster, Robinson, Allen, and Hand coming up to bat. Just my 2 cents.
Dumb it down? Yes
To a fault most 3-4 systems don't allow athletes to be athletes, but rather system role players. I played at SIU under Coach Kill (4-3) and left after the new coaching staff incorporated a 3-4 system that was more complex than the 4-3. I witnessed a drastic change in my and fellow teammates playing speed because we second guessed our reads and had a lot of pre-snap reads from the sideline. Now I know playing speed isn't a problem with the studs we have, but a lot of confusion happened once Vinnie went out. In the 3-4 you need a good solid NT, without a solid NT you are open to a lot of downfield pressure, which we seen this year. If anything I think an emphasis on tracking the ball with our CBs is needed and more combo blitz packages is a must especially with R. Foster, Robinson, Allen, and Hand coming up to bat. Just my 2 cents.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 6:58 pm to 251_Dreaux
Meh, we have been tops in the SEC for a while now. It was more of a personell thing this year.
This post was edited on 1/4/14 at 6:59 pm
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:02 pm to Funky Tide 8
Agreed. I just was waiting for certain adjustments to happen with Kirby and Saban to make up for a personnel downfall, but it didn't happen. I just think in 2014 all hell will be let loose with these new quick twitch guys we have coming aboard and on-deck already.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:04 pm to 251_Dreaux
quote:
251_Dreaux
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:05 pm to 251_Dreaux
The reason the 2011 defense was so good was because of all the smart players with a lot of experience. Barron, Hightower, Upshaw, Lester, etc etc etc
They could make a lot of adjustments without all of Kirby's help and do it a lot faster. They knew what to call themselves.
Other than Mosley, Sunseri, and sometimes DePriest, it looks like the rest f the defense depends on Smart and it takes them too long to get ready. Anyone else agree with this?
They could make a lot of adjustments without all of Kirby's help and do it a lot faster. They knew what to call themselves.
Other than Mosley, Sunseri, and sometimes DePriest, it looks like the rest f the defense depends on Smart and it takes them too long to get ready. Anyone else agree with this?
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:06 pm to chattabama
It is not scheme. We may see the recruitment of more hybrid players. That's the only real changes I see on defense. Auburn and Oklahoma were able to expose our roster weaknessees on the peremeter.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:08 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
If that is the case, we need to simplify it for HUNH teams. At the same time, I think our players should have been able to make the adjustments after having a full season in the system.
If we don't simplify it, I have a very hard time believing guys like Humphrey will start out the gate like many of you think.
And why was Clinton-Dix not making more of the calls?
If we don't simplify it, I have a very hard time believing guys like Humphrey will start out the gate like many of you think.
And why was Clinton-Dix not making more of the calls?
This post was edited on 1/4/14 at 7:11 pm
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:10 pm to UAFanFromNOLA
As I think most of us recall, we did simplify it this last offseason. I don't know by how much, but there was a lot of talk, even from Saban, that it was being dumbed down a bit.
I'd like to see us, even against teams like Auburn, stay in the face of WRs with our Corners. A&M and Oklahoma in the first half had so much success because we gift wrapped them short throws and then they made our DBs miss. Against A&M it was like we refused to play in the face of anyone not named Mike Evans, and that didn't even matter for Evans because he still dominated.
I'd like to see us, even against teams like Auburn, stay in the face of WRs with our Corners. A&M and Oklahoma in the first half had so much success because we gift wrapped them short throws and then they made our DBs miss. Against A&M it was like we refused to play in the face of anyone not named Mike Evans, and that didn't even matter for Evans because he still dominated.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:10 pm to UAFanFromNOLA
quote:
If we don't simplify it, I have a very hard time believing guys like Humphrey will start out the gate like many of you think.
I think the key to young guys starting is whether or not they Enroll Early.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:11 pm to CapstoneGrad06
My biggest frustration is that our defense is not set and is looking toward the sidelines when the ball is snapped against the HUNH.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:13 pm to UAFanFromNOLA
I think our main weakness this year was our lack of top flight CBs. We played Nickel way too much to try to overcome that deficiency.
We get better CB play (more experience) and a beast at NG (Elam or Frazier) and we'll be fine. I wouldn't mind big Brandon Hill moving over to NG next year. He's bigger than Cody and played the position in high school. I honestly don't think he has the footwork to play OG anyway.
We get better CB play (more experience) and a beast at NG (Elam or Frazier) and we'll be fine. I wouldn't mind big Brandon Hill moving over to NG next year. He's bigger than Cody and played the position in high school. I honestly don't think he has the footwork to play OG anyway.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:39 pm to TideSaint
From what I know and what I have seen, The key to stopping these "NASCAR" type teams is having athletes up front and having ends/olbs who can set an edge. We had OLB's this year that would "chase" instead of setting the edge. Most of these "fast" offenses do nothing but make people think on the fly on the field and do things that they are not suppose to do. Kinda how everyone jumped down Cyrus throat for coming up on Marshall in the iron bowl, but if placed in the same position 95% of college and professional CB's would come up to prevent a long run especially once your end and olb have been out flanked on a play. Saban will not abandon his overall defensive scheme, because 1.) Older coaches are stubborn and 2.) It is "his" defense, but with the newer guys we have you can see that he is willing to adapt and "tweak" with the concept.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:42 pm to 251_Dreaux
251_Dreaux made several good points. With the Saban 3-4 (over/under, multiple)our D was missing a few very important thing. First you need an "on the field" coach at both levels. Cj handled the front 7 extreamly well but when VS went down we had nobody who was able to step up and make the on-field adjustments needed against a HUNH. You can't get them from the sideline when the game is in NASCAR mode. Second you must have complete trust that everyone will do their job. LC spent so much effort trying to jump other people's responsibility that he ended up hurting us at times by not being where he should have been. Third our D is at its best when we can blitz from anywhere on the field. To do that, the person calling those blitzes cannot be worried about covering for some DB that may or may not be where he is supposed to be. Our corners never had enough consistancy for the coaches to be able to unleash the dogs. Forth your DL has to have enough push on pass rush to make the QB watch them rather than be able to find the weak link in the secondary. Lastly the NT has to stuff the middle so the line cannot slip to the second level and catch the scraping LB. Not having that from the NT opens up cutback lanes (think Auburn).
The fix...The return of VS and more experience in the secondary. Better nose play. DePriest stepping up into Cj's shoes. Our two freshman DE's being a year further along and taking the DL as their own rather than being situational subs.
I will also suggest that the play of Dillon Lee will be critical next year. I think he would be the key to our HUNH and Nickle play next year.
The fix...The return of VS and more experience in the secondary. Better nose play. DePriest stepping up into Cj's shoes. Our two freshman DE's being a year further along and taking the DL as their own rather than being situational subs.
I will also suggest that the play of Dillon Lee will be critical next year. I think he would be the key to our HUNH and Nickle play next year.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 7:49 pm to 251_Dreaux
So much of our adjustments have already taken place in recruiting.
Just look at the depth from our rsoph, soph, and fresh class next season. Plus bringing in Reed and DJ. We are going to play more guys and vary their position based on opponents.
Hopefully we will balance our conditioning to keep our guys agile
I think next year you might see XD Lake Robinson Duvall line up against spread teams. As I recall during the Utah game was the first time Hightower was added as a pass rusher. I think we will be as prepared for the hung next year as we were UF in 09.
Just look at the depth from our rsoph, soph, and fresh class next season. Plus bringing in Reed and DJ. We are going to play more guys and vary their position based on opponents.
Hopefully we will balance our conditioning to keep our guys agile
I think next year you might see XD Lake Robinson Duvall line up against spread teams. As I recall during the Utah game was the first time Hightower was added as a pass rusher. I think we will be as prepared for the hung next year as we were UF in 09.
Posted on 1/4/14 at 8:12 pm to CrimsonTusk
As a retired coach, I ran the 5-2 for years. That's all the 3-4 is. When teams started throwing the ball more and got away I formation football, our adjustment was playing more athletic guys at Outside LB. I think we need to park the body types we have now and play more athletic guys at that position. Ronnie Clark may be the type we are looking for.
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