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re: Arkansas State Football team forced to remove Christian crosses from helmets
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:49 am to sorantable
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:49 am to sorantable
quote:
impeding the free exercise of religion
Of =\= from, stonehog
1
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:49 am to pvilleguru
quote:
Based on how they described the law, I don't think there was any issue with the cross.
I am pretty sure the cross was the entire issue. It was the "religious imagery."
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:50 am to Stonehog
quote:
Stonehog
You are getting absolutely pwn'd in this thread. There is literally no bigger loser than you. If I were you, I'd kill myself.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:51 am to sorantable
quote:
The fact is that the first amendment gives them the right to endorse a religion if they choose to. Not the opposite.
The university is a state institution.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:52 am to Stonehog
quote:Did Arkansas State University force any of its students to practice a particular religion?
The university is a state institution.
This post was edited on 9/12/14 at 11:53 am
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:52 am to Rebelgator
Perhaps they are endorsing the Swiss Army knife:
OR encouraging all to
Donate blood:
OR encouraging all to
Donate blood:
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:53 am to sorantable
Do the students own the property they are putting it on in this case? Aren't the uniforms considered property of Arkansas State?
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:53 am to Vols&Shaft83
quote:
quote:Stonehog You are getting absolutely pwn'd in this thread. There is literally no bigger loser than you. If I were you, I'd kill myself.
The lesson here is don't listen to everything you hear from some leftwing retard. Go and actually read a document before you try to throw it in someone's face as a justification for your stance.
If you don't want to see the cross on Arky State's helmet...turn the friggin channel or leave the stadium and get over it. I'm sure the overwhelming majority of people really don't give a crap, but for some reason America chooses to let these loons be the louder voice.
This post was edited on 9/12/14 at 11:57 am
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:54 am to sorantable
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Then somehow applied to the States through the activist decisions of the supreme court via the 14th Amendment:
Amendment 14
Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Now tell me how those two texts read together should prohibit a football team from wearing a cross memorializing a classmate. Oh, it can be done. But the argument barely passes the straight face test.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Then somehow applied to the States through the activist decisions of the supreme court via the 14th Amendment:
Amendment 14
Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Now tell me how those two texts read together should prohibit a football team from wearing a cross memorializing a classmate. Oh, it can be done. But the argument barely passes the straight face test.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:57 am to Eric Nies Grind Time
quote:
Do the students own the property they are putting it on in this case? Aren't the uniforms considered property of Arkansas State?
I can assure you, that if even one player had a problem the sticker, the sticker wouldn't be there. Nobody is being forced to practice any religion.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:57 am to Aux Arc
quote:
Now tell me how those two texts read together should prohibit a football team from wearing a cross memorializing a classmate. Oh, it can be done. But the argument barely passes the straight face test.
I'm uncertain if it forces anything, but a state institution is not a place to make a religious statement (which the cross is considered symbolic). Although, I do believe this would be considerably different if they were wearing Islamic Crescents on their helmets.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:57 am to Aux Arc
quote:Oh yeah, read the liberal antireligious rulings. It all deals with vague "societal norms" "position of authority" and "cultural influence." Apparently these totally unproveable, philosophical concepts have taken legal precedent. We have to ban all religion, or people will get brainwashed, basically. It's totally transparent rationalization and bigotry. They hate religion, they've fricked our Constitution and really more than anything what our country was built on (anyone can do any religious thing they want).
Oh, it can be done.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:58 am to Vols&Shaft83
quote:
Nobody is being forced to practice any religion.
I don't even think that's the issue here (forcing players to practice a certain religion I mean). I think the issue is just with the public institution putting religious imagery on the public property.
I am obviously not a lawyer though.
This post was edited on 9/12/14 at 12:00 pm
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:01 pm to StrawsDrawnAtRandom
quote:
I'm uncertain if it forces anything
Let me help you out then, IT DOESN'T!!! I know you hate anything that even suggest that someone, somewhere, may believe in Jesus, BUT THIS DOESN'T FORCE ANYONE TO PRACTICE ANY RELIGION.
MAGMA frickING DAMNIT
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:03 pm to Eric Nies Grind Time
quote:
I think the issue is just with the public institution putting religious imagery on the public property.
Obviously. It's just a matter of personal preference. You can't use the constitution to argue that it's illegal.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:04 pm to sorantable
It just seemed like people were trying to twist it to saying that the issue was with the students being forced to practice a religion.
I don't think that's the issue or at least I was not reading it that way.
I don't think that's the issue or at least I was not reading it that way.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:04 pm to Vols&Shaft83
quote:
Let me help you out then, IT DOESN'T!!! I know you hate anything that even suggest that someone, somewhere, may believe in Jesus, BUT THIS DOESN'T FORCE ANYONE TO PRACTICE ANY RELIGION.
MAGMA frickING DAMNIT
There can be unsaid pressure to be apart of the gang -- whether or not that's an appropriate response is up for debate. The fact remains (even if it's unpopular) that state institutions should not bear religious imagery.
It's really not even up for debate any longer.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:05 pm to Eric Nies Grind Time
quote:
I am obviously not a lawyer though.
I'm also not a lawyer, but I do play one on TV, again I go back to the players likely having more of a say on whether or not the cross was on the helmet than the university. I'm sure the University had to approve it, but they certainly didn't come up with the idea.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:05 pm to genro
quote:
Did Arkansas State University force any of its students to practice a particular religion?
Just forced them to wear religious symbols on their heads
If there's no problem with that then why do you think they removed the decals?
Posted on 9/12/14 at 12:06 pm to Stonehog
quote:Did they?
Just forced them to wear religious symbols on their heads
quote:Because of terrible un-American decisions on a lot of people's part over the decades.
If there's no problem with that then why do you think they removed the decals?
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