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re: Johnny Manziel Could Be Done
Posted on 8/7/13 at 7:38 am to TrueSon2014
Posted on 8/7/13 at 7:38 am to TrueSon2014
Call the NCAA what you want people, but their job is to level the playing field. Paying players does not accomplish this.
The NCAA if it is to survive will need to STOP selling merchandise and leave that to schools. It will need to mandate maximum budgets that every school can afford. It will likely have to implement maximum revenues, too. Anything over those revenue limits would likely have to go to the academic side for when it happens.
Going the other way and letting schools open up the checkbooks would be a catastrophic failure. Some schools would be able to set up autograph sessions for piddly recruits and pay them thousands while other schools could not. There would be no way to monitor and control it.
As for current scholarship values, KSU's AD recently released a letter that outlined theirs. KSU is a cheap school. If you throw in things like health insurance, work out facilities, etc, a scholarship at KSU is worth over $50k/year and end up with almost $700/month OF PURE SPENDING MONEY since food, rent, etc. is all covered from stipends. $700/month was my total budget when I was in school that covered rent, food, gas, car payment, insurance, etc. How many HS grads can get a first job worth that much and live that well?
The NCAA if it is to survive will need to STOP selling merchandise and leave that to schools. It will need to mandate maximum budgets that every school can afford. It will likely have to implement maximum revenues, too. Anything over those revenue limits would likely have to go to the academic side for when it happens.
Going the other way and letting schools open up the checkbooks would be a catastrophic failure. Some schools would be able to set up autograph sessions for piddly recruits and pay them thousands while other schools could not. There would be no way to monitor and control it.
As for current scholarship values, KSU's AD recently released a letter that outlined theirs. KSU is a cheap school. If you throw in things like health insurance, work out facilities, etc, a scholarship at KSU is worth over $50k/year and end up with almost $700/month OF PURE SPENDING MONEY since food, rent, etc. is all covered from stipends. $700/month was my total budget when I was in school that covered rent, food, gas, car payment, insurance, etc. How many HS grads can get a first job worth that much and live that well?
This post was edited on 8/7/13 at 7:41 am
2
Posted on 8/7/13 at 12:29 pm to notsince98
quote:
notsince98
Very good pints, ad I agree with you 100%. Chances are though, that the NCAA is going to have to change big-time as it relates to football, or risk losing the big 5 conferences. I really hope that if they go down the road of paying players, it's a small amount that is set and schools can't exceed. And that they then crack down hard on any athlete receiving anything extra.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 12:35 pm to notsince98
quote:
As for current scholarship values, KSU's AD recently released a letter that outlined theirs. KSU is a cheap school. If you throw in things like health insurance, work out facilities, etc, a scholarship at KSU is worth over $50k/year and end up with almost $700/month OF PURE SPENDING MONEY since food, rent, etc. is all covered from stipends. $700/month was my total budget when I was in school that covered rent, food, gas, car payment, insurance, etc. How many HS grads can get a first job worth that much and live that well?
This needs to be highlighted more in the media. But media has an agenda to tear down the NCAA. It equals more money for them if they can cut them out.
Your normal college athlete is getting more than enough. It's the small percent that want to live the 'baller' life that need more.
Should they get video games that have their likeness in the game, yes, absolutely. Not sure why every team isn't given an allotment of NCAA football each season.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 2:20 pm to mograyback
quote:
I really hope that if they go down the road of paying players, it's a small amount that is set and schools can't exceed.
If they pay players then the players should in turn have to pay tuition. Schools make money off of academic research being done by scholarship students (Mizzou gets a ton for Biology research of transferring organs from pigs to humans) and those students who are spending all the time doing the research that gets schools millions of dollars in donations and grants do not get paid and the credit for their work goes to the professor. I can not repeat this enough. If athletes start getting paid, they should start paying tuition.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 2:31 pm to Mizzou23
quote:
If they pay players then the players should in turn have to pay tuition.
Agreed.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 2:36 pm to Mizzou23
quote:
If they pay players then the players should in turn have to pay tuition. Schools make money off of academic research being done by scholarship students (Mizzou gets a ton for Biology research of transferring organs from pigs to humans) and those students who are spending all the time doing the research that gets schools millions of dollars in donations and grants do not get paid and the credit for their work goes to the professor. I can not repeat this enough. If athletes start getting paid, they should start paying tuition.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 2:36 pm to mograyback
quote:
media has an agenda to tear down the NCAA. It equals more money for them if they can cut them out.
Agree.
quote:
Your normal college athlete is getting more than enough.
Eh, can't really go with you on that one.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 2:41 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Eh, can't really go with you on that one.
What's your reasoning, TBird? And are you OK with college athletes being paid, but then having to pay tuition?
Posted on 8/7/13 at 2:45 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Your normal college athlete is getting more than enough.
Eh, can't really go with you on that one.
How come you no agree?
I even said average athlete, not average football player.
You're tellin me that the kid on the swim team that is getting 50k a year worth of stuff isn't getting a fair deal?
Even the average football player is getting more than a fair deal. The kid that isn't out for rims, big watches, a closet full of shoes, stereo systems ect ect has more than enough to get by. These kids are totally taken care of and living a higher standard of life than almost anyone in the world. And they're being given the tools to excel in life after college (for free).
Do I think it's wrong that TAMU can make 20k off a dinner with Johnny, and the kid get's nothing.. yeah. Is it wrong that they can sell jerseys and the kids get nothing, yeah. Should the kids get video games for free when their likeness is being used? Yes, of course. The system needs some adjustments, but to deny that the average college athlete isn't getting more than a fair deal is tomfoolery.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:04 pm to mograyback
Is the normal college athlete even on a full ride? Obviously football and basketball a majority but not all are. Baseball, no. Would assume softball, no. Same for the other non-revenue sports.
ETA - Truly don't know and was wondering what percentage of all college athletes at Mizzou, for example, are actually on a full ride or have that full $50,000 in benefits.
ETA - Truly don't know and was wondering what percentage of all college athletes at Mizzou, for example, are actually on a full ride or have that full $50,000 in benefits.
This post was edited on 8/7/13 at 3:06 pm
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:09 pm to reedus23
quote:
Is the normal college athlete even on a full ride? Obviously football and basketball a majority but not all are. Baseball, no. Would assume softball, no. Same for the other non-revenue sports.
ETA - Truly don't know and was wondering what percentage of all college athletes at Mizzou, for example, are actually on a full ride or have that full $50,000 in benefits.
I took the 50k from a comment I saw elsewhere on the board. I guess I should research, huh.
This is taken from the NCAA site.
The average value of a full scholarship at an in-state, public school is $15,000 a year. For an out-of-state public school, the average value is $25,000 a year. Full scholarships at private schools average $35,000 a year. The real value of athletics scholarships is intangible. Without them, many student-athletes would be unable to pursue their athletics and academic dreams.
However, I don't think that 15k takes into account the money a school may spend on dining, clothes, housing ect. I think its just the average for the tuition, not the secondary benefits of being a student athlete (I think).
Pretty good page, actually.
LINK
This post was edited on 8/7/13 at 3:11 pm
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:18 pm to mograyback
No, I'm not doubting the $50,000 figure. But I assumed that that number was based on a kid getting a full ride. I was simply wondering what percentage of college athletes at Mizzou are actually on a full ride.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:20 pm to reedus23
quote:
No, I'm not doubting the $50,000 figure. But I assumed that that number was based on a kid getting a full ride. I was simply wondering what percentage of college athletes at Mizzou are actually on a full ride.
I don't know this..
But baseball, and the other sports do give full rides...
But from what I remember those sports spread them around a little more. A guy is more likely to get a 2/3 or 1/4 scholarship in those sports.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:21 pm to reedus23
That is a good page. I agree, the $15,000 or $25,000 doesn't include the other benefits such as insurance and other things the ordinary student doesn't have access to or has to pay for. Do you know of a page that will tell me how many athletes are at Mizzou and how many of them are on scholarship or at least how many total athletic scholarships the school gives out?
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:23 pm to reedus23
No.. I would think that would be available, though.
I haven't really tried looking for it yet, but it may be out there.
I haven't really tried looking for it yet, but it may be out there.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:23 pm to mograyback
quote:
But baseball, and the other sports do give full rides...
But from what I remember those sports spread them around a little more. A guy is more likely to get a 2/3 or 1/4 scholarship in those sports.
Exactly. They may have 10 full scholarships to divide amongst 20 players as they deem best.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:24 pm to mograyback
quote:
I haven't really tried looking for it yet, but it may be out there.
Ok, thanks. I've tried looking before but couldn't find it. I was just curious how the non-revenue sports stack up when it comes to scholarships. In other words, should I have my son take up quiditch because everyone there has a full ride.
Posted on 8/7/13 at 3:58 pm to reedus23
The $50k number comes from a recent release from the KSU AD. The actual number their AD published closer to $47k or so and included Pell Grant numbers, but KSU is a super cheap school. Their numbers did not include health insurance costs, medical costs, free food costs, academic support costs, exercise usage facility costs, etc.
Now, only the poor athletes are the ones getting the Pell Grants (up to $5500k/year), but those are the players complaining about not having money to eat. That Pell Grant comes out to $450+/month of pure spending money. They also have stipends for food, rent, clothing, etc. KSU gives Pell Grant eligible athletes something like $300-500/year to buy new clothes for the school year.
By the time you take the unspent stipend money for rent, books, food, etc. They usually have well over $6-700/month to spend on whatever they want.
Obviously, if you start looking at more expensive schools, the total compensatory package a student athlete receives can break $100k/year in no time flat.
Now, only the poor athletes are the ones getting the Pell Grants (up to $5500k/year), but those are the players complaining about not having money to eat. That Pell Grant comes out to $450+/month of pure spending money. They also have stipends for food, rent, clothing, etc. KSU gives Pell Grant eligible athletes something like $300-500/year to buy new clothes for the school year.
By the time you take the unspent stipend money for rent, books, food, etc. They usually have well over $6-700/month to spend on whatever they want.
Obviously, if you start looking at more expensive schools, the total compensatory package a student athlete receives can break $100k/year in no time flat.
This post was edited on 8/7/13 at 3:59 pm
Posted on 8/8/13 at 7:36 pm to mograyback
quote:
to deny that the average college athlete isn't getting more than a fair deal is tomfoolery.
Not necessarily.
My little brother made the a&m team as a walk on his freshman year and LOST academic scholarships due to NCAA rules. He's still in the hole in debt to a&m because of that even though he's no longer on the team. And I know firsthand he's not the only one to have had troubles.
Posted on 8/8/13 at 7:42 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
My little brother made the a&m team as a walk on his freshman year and LOST academic scholarships due to NCAA rules. He's still in the hole in debt to a&m because of that even though he's no longer on the team. And I know firsthand he's not the only one to have had troubles.
Not trying to be that guy, but the benefits he lost put him on the same level as most other students that went to college and almost all his peers while he was in college.
If he thought the athletic scholarships wouldn't be better than the academic scholarships he should have played intramurals.
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