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re: Catholic couple fined $13,000 for refusing to host same-sex ‘wedding’
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:05 pm to the808bass
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:05 pm to the808bass
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:08 pm to Kentucker
Cute quote.
Bigotry isn't always bad. It's bad when it's based on the wrong things. You and I will obviously disagree on those things.
And the quote ignores the possibility that the "weaker" isn't truth. I have no duty to tolerate lies, weak or strong.
Eta: I misread the quote. But my basic principle applies. Might doesn't make right. There is objective right and wrong which exist outside of force. Ignoring these truths is fun and enlightened. And then you die.
Bigotry isn't always bad. It's bad when it's based on the wrong things. You and I will obviously disagree on those things.
And the quote ignores the possibility that the "weaker" isn't truth. I have no duty to tolerate lies, weak or strong.
Eta: I misread the quote. But my basic principle applies. Might doesn't make right. There is objective right and wrong which exist outside of force. Ignoring these truths is fun and enlightened. And then you die.
This post was edited on 11/10/14 at 7:12 pm
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:09 pm to Vols&Shaft83
I hate these semantic games.
I wouldn't support a business that wouldn't serve black people. The current way doesn't allow me to know who's a racist because they have to follow the given law.
I wouldn't support a business that wouldn't serve black people. The current way doesn't allow me to know who's a racist because they have to follow the given law.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:21 pm to the808bass
quote:
And the quote ignores the possibility that the "weaker" isn't truth.
No, no it doesnt. Not at all.
The premise has literally nothing to do with what is and is not actually true, but with the hypocritical and illogical nature of human thinking. Regardless of whether or not a given belief is true, people demand their beliefs be tolerated when they are the minority, and demand other beliefs be trampled asunder when they are the majority. We are all guilty of this on some level, as human consciousness places self-preservation of thought above objective reality and tolerance.
This post was edited on 11/10/14 at 7:23 pm
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:23 pm to the808bass
quote:
Might doesn't make right.
It shouldn't but might often determines what is "right" for a society.
quote:
There is objective right and wrong which exist outside of force.
These are human constructs and therefore have to be subjective.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:23 pm to Duke
quote:
I wouldn't support a business that wouldn't serve black people. The current way doesn't allow me to know who's a racist because they have to follow the given law.
It's better to have the laws and hide discrimination than otherwise.
For instance, there might be a restaurant owner who has his business robbed 4 times in a month by black kids. Given no laws, his response might be to refuse to allow black people into his restaurant even though he harbors no ill will towards black people in general.
If I knew the facts, I would not think the man a racist and would not avoid his business because of it. Stereotypes become more truthful as the radius of their influence decreases.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:23 pm to Kentucker
quote:
human constructs
That's your position. Not shocked.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:27 pm to PrivatePublic
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PrivatePublic
Good point. Giving my perspective a second thought.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:29 pm to Duke
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The current way doesn't allow me to know who's a racist because they have to follow the given law.
The purpose of some laws is to prevent racism, in this example, from becoming an acceptable social more. It's a legal stigma meant to change something that may be practiced widely to something that is perceived to be negative for society at large. It works.
This post was edited on 11/10/14 at 7:30 pm
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:29 pm to the808bass
All the objective, observable evidence from human existence and recorded history indicate that morality is subjective and evolves with time and place.
Could morality be objective? Sure, but there's no good reason to believe it is outside the inner comfort it can bring.
Could morality be objective? Sure, but there's no good reason to believe it is outside the inner comfort it can bring.
This post was edited on 11/10/14 at 7:30 pm
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:35 pm to Kentucker
You and PrivatePublic bring up good points. Worth a second thinking of my position.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:35 pm to the808bass
quote:
That's your position. Not shocked.
Well, yeah.
I don't think of right and wrong applying to any nonhuman species. Good and bad, maybe. Good if it promotes the species' wellbeing, bad if it causes harm. Only humans think in terms of right and wrong.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:40 pm to Duke
Yeah, lots of people seem to want the "opportunity" to decide for themselves whether to patronize businesses that discriminate. Magnanimity, however, has no place within the laws of a society.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:48 pm to Kentucker
quote:
I don't think of right and wrong applying to any nonhuman species. Good and bad, maybe. Good if it promotes the species' wellbeing, bad if it causes harm. Only humans think in terms of right and wrong.
Humans think we are special because we have the cognitive capacity to do so and no other reason. There is no objective reason to believe we are anything more than primates with large frontal lobes if we are honest with ourselves.
The problem is that the special nature of humanity is so ingrained into human thinking that we would be incapable of existing without it now. Society would crumble without the idea that we are somehow apart from and superior to nature.
This post was edited on 11/10/14 at 7:49 pm
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:50 pm to Roger Klarvin
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. There is no objective reason to believe we are anything more than primates with large frontal lobes if we are honest with ourselves.
I am superior to the rest of you monkeys
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:54 pm to Vols&Shaft83
quote:
I am superior to the rest of you monkeys
Keep telling yourself that and watch your asian overlords laugh!
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:55 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
All the objective, observable evidence from human existence and recorded history indicate that morality is subjective and evolves with time and place. Could morality be objective? Sure, but there's no good reason to believe it is outside the inner comfort it can bring.
Free yo mind, Big Rog.
There is more similarity in morality throughout the course of human history than dissimilarity. At the risk of cliche, the exceptions prove the rule. Theft, adultery, murder are almost universally proscribed. Public property and family are protected. Parents are set up as the authority over children.
That tribe in New Guinea which celebrates lying isn't a strong argument for a subjective morality. Despite what your Comparative Religions professor said.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:57 pm to Cheese Grits
quote:
Keep telling yourself that and watch your asian overlords laugh!
I'm planning on creating some half asian superhumans with my super sperm, I know my super sperm can do it Grits.
Posted on 11/10/14 at 7:57 pm to Kentucker
quote:
Only humans think in terms of right and wrong.
And?
Is your position on this correct?
Posted on 11/10/14 at 8:02 pm to the808bass
quote:
There is more similarity in morality throughout the course of human history than dissimilarity.
Well that's certainly an interesting opinion.
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