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re: Transfer portal out/in

Posted on 1/20/24 at 2:58 pm to
Posted by claydawg09
Covington
Member since Sep 2013
1809 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 2:58 pm to
Link basically claimed that because he was coming in after drop/ add that the process/ delay of getting him admitted opened the door for OSU. Idk. Probably not. If he was coming here we’d have bent whatever rules to make it happen.
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 4:06 pm to
quote:

And they want to play at UGA.

That's all I want in the NIL era. I don't care if you are a 6-star athlete... players only looking for a suitcase of money can go elsewhere.





No offense, but that is a very naive way to think. I can promise you thata every single one of our two deep is getting paid and most, if not all would leave if we gave them nothing.

Just because money is a part of it does not mean that it is the entire picture. But if you take money completely out of the picture, they would all leave. (Or most of them) They might take a bit less to come here, but money has been introduced and it will play a large role for the best players.

When so many on this board and the Rant were arguing, I tried to say that it was a genie they did not want out of the bottle. Now I dare say, you will find very few people who will admit they were all for NIL. Some will argue they were for NIL but with restrictions, but you never know what you will get when you argue for change. Same goes for the transfer portal.
Posted by meansonny
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
25753 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 6:25 pm to
It's a conundrum.

I argued against it because there would obviously be no way to regulate it and no way to put the genie back.

But I argued for it because the ncaa can't take away someone's rights (i.e. Sony Michel's ability to make music and profit from it.).

Blocking NIL was wrong. But the ncaa knew why they were fighting that battle.
This post was edited on 1/20/24 at 6:25 pm
Posted by Dirk Dawgler
Where I Am
Member since Nov 2011
2520 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:30 pm to
The people that will eventually be the most harmed by this is the 3 star type players in high school. The number of full rides being handed out will be reserved for high 4 star and 5 star rated players. Teams will not need to have 15-20 3 star players in a recruiting class. It is now a game of horse trading in the portal to form yearly rosters. The 3 star guys who used to make up at least half of recruiting classes at most schools are now going to get offered partials at Georgia State , Louisiana-Monroe, etc..
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:48 pm to
quote:

But I argued for it because the ncaa can't take away someone's rights (i.e. Sony Michel's ability to make music and profit from it.).



This is enteresting. I could be wrong, but I don't think the NCAA only has jurisdiction over football. His ability to make money with his music would be out of their purview, I think.

I mean, for years other conferences had football players that played other sports professionally at a point. As long as it was not football it was ok. It was the SEC that had a rule in which if someone played any sport professionally they could not be considered an amateur for Football. (The SEC has changed that rule now)

I think Michel could have made money with his music as long as it was kept separate from football.

Of course, I could be misremembering or just plain wrong, too.
Posted by td01241
Savannah
Member since Nov 2012
22856 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:49 pm to
It’s pretty undeniable CFB is worse off since NIL at least imo. It was also pretty shitty how the NCAA acted before it so like you I find it legally correct and am thankful for what we used to have. It can still be regulated though with the transfer portal, and it should be.
Posted by meansonny
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
25753 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:51 pm to
quote:

This is enteresting. I could be wrong, but I don't think the NCAA only has jurisdiction over football. His ability to make money with his music would be out of their purview, I think.



It was not out of purview.
They were impermissible benefits. If anyone with a UGA ball cap listened to a download, it was against the rules. I.e. UGA couldn't prevent the violation so the opportunity to make money of being Sony Michel was stripped.
Posted by meansonny
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
25753 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:54 pm to
quote:


I mean, for years other conferences had football players that played other sports professionally at a point.


They didn't do it simultaneously.
Their eligibility clock was deemed to not be activated because they were playing minor league baseball, in the military, or doing a religious mission trip.

No one played professional baseball while they were a student athlete. No one played professional baseball after they were a student athlete and then returned back to being a student athlete.
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:56 pm to
quote:

It was not out of purview.
They were impermissible benefits. If anyone with a UGA ball cap listened to a download, it was against the rules. I.e. UGA couldn't prevent the violation so the opportunity to make money of being Sony Michel was stripped.



Catches me by surprise. Thanks for the clarification.
Posted by meansonny
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
25753 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:56 pm to
quote:

It’s pretty undeniable CFB is worse off since NIL at least imo.


It's subjective.

It is undeniable that teams broke the rules before and got away with it.

Now, the colleges at least have a duty to report everything above the table to the ncaa.
quote:

It can still be regulated

NIL cannot be regulated. It is someone's personal name, image, and likeness. Even the NFL doesn't regulate its players endorsement deals.
quote:

the transfer portal, and it should be.

I have not heard a decent argument why the transfer portal shouldn't have a mandatory redshirt for undergrads. There, I agree.
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 7:59 pm to
quote:

They didn't do it simultaneously.


Again, I could be wrong, but I was thinking they did. Some played minor league baseball while playing football. Again, I could be wrong. I'll see if I can find something.

It could be I was thinking that the SEC would not let a player play football if he had eve played any sport professionally whether at the same time or separately....like you said. It's been a long time ago this was happening, though, so ...
Posted by meansonny
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
25753 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 8:03 pm to
If you find an example, I'm happy to admit I'm wrong.

Everyone I know enrolled in college in their 20s and played after they had given up on their baseball career.
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 8:07 pm to
quote:

If you find an example, I'm happy to admit I'm wrong.

Everyone I know enrolled in college in their 20s and played after they had given up on their baseball career.




I think I found it. Please read until the end. It mentions the rule and one or two players that have done it.

3. Pro money in a different sport. In the NCAA's confusing world of amateurism, you can be deemed an amateur in one sport while clearly a professional in another. A pro athlete paid in one sport can simultaneously play college athletics in a different sport and receive a scholarship. It doesn't happen much, but the sport most frequently impacted is a college football player who also participates in minor league baseball. In 2010, Kyle Parker was Clemson's quarterback after he got a $1.4 million signing bonus from the Colorado Rockies. Russell Wilson had a $200,000 signing bonus with the Rockies, some of which he had to return to the club when he left to play quarterback at Wisconsin. Roscoe Crosby had a $1.75 million signing bonus from the Kansas City Royals while a Clemson wide receiver in the early 2000s.

ETA
Michel's case, obviously would be different from that, so I bow to your expertise and knowledge on that.
This post was edited on 1/20/24 at 8:08 pm
Posted by grey
Member since Aug 2015
3346 posts
Posted on 1/20/24 at 8:30 pm to
quote:

most, if not all would leave if we gave them nothing


CFB without school pride or meaningful rivalries is lame as hell. If this is true (I don't think it is), then I need a new hobby.
Posted by devils1854
Franklin
Member since Aug 2014
6351 posts
Posted on 1/21/24 at 6:38 am to
quote:

The people that will eventually be the most harmed by this is the 3 star type players in high school. The number of full rides being handed out will be reserved for high 4 star and 5 star rated players. Teams will not need to have 15-20 3 star players in a recruiting class. It is now a game of horse trading in the portal to form yearly rosters. The 3 star guys who used to make up at least half of recruiting classes at most schools are now going to get offered partials at Georgia State , Louisiana-Monroe, etc..


In the past 4 recruiting cycles, there have been a total of 1,741 players ranked at least a 4* by the 247 composite.

There are 133 D1 football teams with 85 man scholarship roster. That comes out to 11,305 Division 1 college football players on scholarship each season.

Maybe you meant major conference. If you mean Big 2(SEC/B1G) then there are 34 teams at 85 men, or 2,890 major conference players.

Is that not right. ACC and B12 could be considered major conferences at least for now, so thats 67 schools, or 5,695 players on scholarship.

Please let me know your work and how you got to the point that 3 star players will be the most harmed in this. Roughly 1750 4 and 5 star players in school per 4 year cycle. Over 11,000 total players in D1 annually.
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/21/24 at 6:58 am to
quote:

CFB without school pride or meaningful rivalries is lame as hell. If this is true (I don't think it is), then I need a new hobby.

Your perception is your perception. We have always had and will allways have a number of players that go to a given school because:

1> Location
2. Favorite coaches
3. Better coaches
4. Chance to win championship
and a lot of other reasons. Do you think players went to Alabama because of school pride. There are tons of reasons a kid might choose a school. Hopefully school pride is developed while there, but put yourself in their place.

You love the University of Georgia. You get here and you are a highly rated player, but Georgia has been stockpiling talent. Another school comes along and offers you a million dollars to play, develop and help you get to the NFL.

Would you honestly stay at Georgia?
Rivalries are primarily for fans. The players feel it, but it is not the overarching influence it is with fans.
Posted by MacDawg
Austin, TX
Member since Nov 2015
363 posts
Posted on 1/21/24 at 10:15 am to
NIL isnt about Name, image and likeness. A very, very small percentage are signing endorsements or licensing agreements. The vast majority are getting money from funds set up by the school, without any regulation, that pay the kid just to sign with that school. They are now simply player signing bonuses.
Posted by Peter Buck
Member since Sep 2012
12415 posts
Posted on 1/21/24 at 10:28 am to
This is correct. The NIL slush funds were the eventual unintended consequence of the mess they are in.
Posted by DawgsLife
Member since Jun 2013
58925 posts
Posted on 1/21/24 at 10:52 am to
quote:

NIL isnt about Name, image and likeness. A very, very small percentage are signing endorsements or licensing agreements. The vast majority are getting money from funds set up by the school, without any regulation, that pay the kid just to sign with that school. They are now simply player signing bonuses.


Yes, I agree. But that has always gone on. Just on a much smaller scale. The very top recruits always got extra incentives, whether in the form of housing, money or other benefits. It just spread to a lot more players, out in the open and on a larger scale.

No, it isn't being done in the way it was intended, but very few things are done as intended. Look at targeting, holding and other penalties which are not being enforced properly. It's not surprise that the Transfer Portal and NIL is operating in a way that was never intended.
Posted by Violent Hip Swivel
Member since Aug 2023
2660 posts
Posted on 1/21/24 at 12:54 pm to
quote:

We probably didnt even want him. He's not that good. Id rather have Carson Beck starting at safety


Carson Beck is bigger and has better awareness.
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