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Wolford vs Marrone
Posted on 8/30/22 at 8:38 am
Posted on 8/30/22 at 8:38 am
Looks like Wolford will have to do more with less, or at least a draw relative to the OL personnel.
The line looks the same minus top ten pick Evan Neal, and what used to be considered our best guard in Cohen.
Heard the players and CNS mention in the preseason that the blocking schemes and the "mentality/energy" has been better with Wolford. Seems to be a safe bet he will be a better coach, (how could he not be?) but here in the preseason simply looking at things on paper it's hard to imagine a big step forward.
I dont mean this as bad as it sounds but for the sake of conversation you could argue the following as concerning for the OL:
Top ten pick at LT replaced with transfer
Best guard replaced with career backup at LG
Dalcourt back at center, but the only time the OL looked semi competent last season was with McLaughlin at center.
RT will be a promising prospect, but he couldn't beat out Chris Owens so need to see his progress translate to the field.
In short if Wolford takes this bunch and turns them into a better than average OL then Marrone had to be the worst hire of the Saban era.
I think next year when Wolford gets all his monsters on campus we will see the OL begin to transform back to what we've all grown accustomed to, but in the meantime I'm taking a wait and see approach into this season and hoping for the best.
The line looks the same minus top ten pick Evan Neal, and what used to be considered our best guard in Cohen.
Heard the players and CNS mention in the preseason that the blocking schemes and the "mentality/energy" has been better with Wolford. Seems to be a safe bet he will be a better coach, (how could he not be?) but here in the preseason simply looking at things on paper it's hard to imagine a big step forward.
I dont mean this as bad as it sounds but for the sake of conversation you could argue the following as concerning for the OL:
Top ten pick at LT replaced with transfer
Best guard replaced with career backup at LG
Dalcourt back at center, but the only time the OL looked semi competent last season was with McLaughlin at center.
RT will be a promising prospect, but he couldn't beat out Chris Owens so need to see his progress translate to the field.
In short if Wolford takes this bunch and turns them into a better than average OL then Marrone had to be the worst hire of the Saban era.
I think next year when Wolford gets all his monsters on campus we will see the OL begin to transform back to what we've all grown accustomed to, but in the meantime I'm taking a wait and see approach into this season and hoping for the best.
3
Posted on 8/30/22 at 8:45 am to PowHound
Just reading between the lines from Saban and some of the players is sounds like Marrone was the definition of an NFL coach who never made any sort of collegiate adjustment to coaching a position group - both in teaching technique and in philosophical adjustment.
The guy knows how to coach offensive line, but coaching and developing kids at a position that requires more development than probably any in football is much different in college than the NFL. College OL coaches are probably more developmental coaches than any other position. NFL OL coaches are much, much more technical, scheme teachers.
Wolford is clearly a solid development guy from his work at Kentucky and his reputation. Sounds like the guys and Saban are happy with him so far. We'll see how it plays out.
The guy knows how to coach offensive line, but coaching and developing kids at a position that requires more development than probably any in football is much different in college than the NFL. College OL coaches are probably more developmental coaches than any other position. NFL OL coaches are much, much more technical, scheme teachers.
Wolford is clearly a solid development guy from his work at Kentucky and his reputation. Sounds like the guys and Saban are happy with him so far. We'll see how it plays out.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 8:52 am to SummerOfGeorge
The question remains what should we reasonably expect from this years OL before we see them suit up ?
I think I would take average right now and be happy about it based on how things look on paper.
If Wolford takes this group and turns them into above average then there was a major disconnect with Marrone behind the wheel.
Agreed, reading between the lines it sounds like everyone in the building was very happy to see Marrone GTFO. Even CNS seemingly gave him a kick in the arse on the way out the door.
I think I would take average right now and be happy about it based on how things look on paper.
If Wolford takes this group and turns them into above average then there was a major disconnect with Marrone behind the wheel.
Agreed, reading between the lines it sounds like everyone in the building was very happy to see Marrone GTFO. Even CNS seemingly gave him a kick in the arse on the way out the door.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 8:55 am to PowHound
quote:
The question remains what should we reasonably expect from this years OL before we see them suit up ?
I think I would take average right now and be happy about it based on how things look on paper.
If Wolford takes this group and turns them into above average then there was a major disconnect with Marrone behind the wheel.
Agreed, reading between the lines it sounds like everyone in the building was very happy to see Marrone GTFO. Even CNS seemingly gave him a kick in the arse on the way out the door.
I think Steen sounds like he was an excellent addition. Grown man, lots of experience in this league playing against teams where his group was overmatched and he held his own. The interior is experienced and has had success. Latham is obviously talented but there will be a question there until he proves himself.
All in all I absolutely expect them to be more consistent than last season. Not 2020 level but a solid O-line.
This post was edited on 8/30/22 at 8:56 am
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:04 am to PowHound
Another angle of the conversation is how did we get here personnel wise ?
Its not often under CNS that you look up and realize that you suck at a position group, but this years OL is about as uninspiring as I can ever recall. On paper it looks worse than last year.
Brockermeyer not being ready to go like past blue chippers have been has certainly exacerbated the situation.
Its not often under CNS that you look up and realize that you suck at a position group, but this years OL is about as uninspiring as I can ever recall. On paper it looks worse than last year.
Brockermeyer not being ready to go like past blue chippers have been has certainly exacerbated the situation.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:08 am to PowHound
quote:
Another angle of the conversation is how did we get here personnel wise ?
Its not often under CNS that you look up and realize that you suck at a position group, but this years OL is about as uninspiring as I can ever recall. On paper it looks worse than last year.
Brockermeyer not being ready to go like past blue chippers have been has certainly exacerbated the situation.
I dunno, I don't really think we suck at OL. I mean we'll find out soon enough. I think a year of what sounds like non-development is a pretty huge issue when it comes to a position that even the most skilled incoming high school guys are extremely raw and have to be super developed.
I think if Latham is solid the group will be solid. And I don't know how to really grade the depth behind them when we never see them.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:24 am to SummerOfGeorge
After the Auburn game last year, someone needed to go.
It took until our last possession before the dumb arse o line coach figured out the sub we put in at RT was getting abused. That guy was being paid a lot of money to be incompetent. Hopefully the Vandy transfer is pretty good and the new RT has lost some weight and gotten quicker. If those two can hold their own, we should be fine.
It took until our last possession before the dumb arse o line coach figured out the sub we put in at RT was getting abused. That guy was being paid a lot of money to be incompetent. Hopefully the Vandy transfer is pretty good and the new RT has lost some weight and gotten quicker. If those two can hold their own, we should be fine.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:24 am to SummerOfGeorge
More focus on the run game should help the OL a great deal IMO.
No Metch or Jamo will likely lead to leaning on the stable of backs more.
Lots of experience in the interior.
Agreed, bottom line will be how the new tackles perform.
I have no idea if we face an elite pass rush this season, but those would likely be the games to circle.
No Metch or Jamo will likely lead to leaning on the stable of backs more.
Lots of experience in the interior.
Agreed, bottom line will be how the new tackles perform.
I have no idea if we face an elite pass rush this season, but those would likely be the games to circle.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:26 am to PowHound
100% agree
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:41 am to IB4bama
Chris Owens replaced the RT at halftime vs AU thank God. That guy had no business starting. Moultry abused him. I watched the game again recently wondering why they were getting so much pressure on BY. I also think Cohen will at some point resume guard play unless KR really stepped it up this camp.
This post was edited on 8/30/22 at 9:44 am
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:43 am to PowHound
After 4 games we should know the deal. JMO but the Doug hire was a big ole misfire.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:45 am to PowHound
We have been pretty balanced on Offense throughout the years under Saban.
I don't think we need more rushing game, because Gibbs/Jase/Roydell/Sander can get the yards need.. and I think there will be lot of homerun runs/passes
I don't think we need more rushing game, because Gibbs/Jase/Roydell/Sander can get the yards need.. and I think there will be lot of homerun runs/passes
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:51 am to Bamadave68
Morrone was the worst OL coach we've had in decades. Maybe ever. He was legit awful. Not a single OL improved under him. In fact, most regressed.
Saban is usually pretty honest about position groups if you know how to read between the lines with him. He seems pretty optimistic about the OL. I think they will be competent, and with our skill players, the offense should be able to outscore just about anyone we play with the defense we have.
At the end of the day, this OL doesn't have to be '12 or '20, they just have to be competent enough to allow us to score more than the other team every game. They do that, and Bama brings home the trophy.
Saban is usually pretty honest about position groups if you know how to read between the lines with him. He seems pretty optimistic about the OL. I think they will be competent, and with our skill players, the offense should be able to outscore just about anyone we play with the defense we have.
At the end of the day, this OL doesn't have to be '12 or '20, they just have to be competent enough to allow us to score more than the other team every game. They do that, and Bama brings home the trophy.
This post was edited on 8/30/22 at 9:52 am
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:58 am to tider04
quote:
Morrone was the worst OL coach we've had in decades. Maybe ever. He was legit awful.
Lol. How old are you? Have you forgotten Bucket Step Bob Connelly?
Posted on 8/30/22 at 9:59 am to PowHound
Marrone thought he was too good for the job last year and was checked out for a good chunk of the year. OL is a developmental position - probably the MOST developmental position. I'd argue it probably has the highest bust rate of any position as well. We have talent here. We haven't had great OL coaching in my opinion since Stoutland left. I hope that changes this year.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 10:21 am to Bham Bammer
quote:
OL is a developmental position - probably the MOST developmental position. I'd argue it probably has the highest bust rate of any position as well.
Absolutely - which is why more "3-star" types become great linemen than other positions. It's by far the hardest to evaluate in terms of potential with high school kids for a ton of reasons, and it's the one where incoming freshmen are the most raw.
Doesn't matter if you recruit all Top 100 linemen if you don't consistently develop them over 3-4 years.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 10:31 am to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
I think if Latham is solid the group will be solid. And I don't know how to really grade the depth behind them when we never see them.
If last year was any indicator, we know our backup LG (Cohen) and C (McLaughlin) are legit.
At RT, George seemed to struggle with the speed rush last year (I believe bamadave referred to the Auburn outing above), but maybe he has improved.
At LT, Kight had a good game against New Mexico State when he got extended playing time (but yeah, it's New Mexico State).
At RG, Booker is the real unknown, but the fact he's listed as the backup suggests he's made a good impression as a true Freshman.
So I'm cautiously optimistic about the depth on the OL.
This post was edited on 8/30/22 at 10:34 am
Posted on 8/30/22 at 10:42 am to CapstoneGrad06
quote:
Lol. How old are you? Have you forgotten Bucket Step Bob Connelly?
Connelly was horrible too but he was working with a depleted roster full of 2 and 3 star OL that wouldn't make our scout team now. Morrone took a room of 4-5 star studs (including a 1st rounder) and made them all worse. That's a special kind of suck.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 11:29 am to Bham Bammer
I thought Flood was very good at developing our offensive lineman. I still think our best five will be...
LT-Steen
LG-Cohen
C-Seth
RG-Emil
RT-JC
LT-Steen
LG-Cohen
C-Seth
RG-Emil
RT-JC
Posted on 8/30/22 at 12:07 pm to Joka2kold
To be honest I think it goes back to the covid shutdown and missing that entire spring. Yea our starters were dominant that year but the backups missed some very key development reps that year. Then when we needed someone to come in and develop them, we hired Marrone and we know how that went.
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