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Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

I'm going to give him a chance and recognize the 2 wins isn't as simple as him being a bad coach.


I just disagree, I think he's a bad coach. 16-32 kind of proves that to me.

Bielema averaged a top 25 class, that's enough to win more than two games. It's enough talent to not get blown out by North Texas and Vandy at home. It's enough to not lose 52-6 to Mississippi State and 38-0 to Mizzou.

We recruited about the same as Mississippi State the last few years, they had a first year coach last season too and he went 8-5 and beat the shite out of us. I think that's a much more appropriate comparison. Literally every other first year SEC coach last year did better than Chad and they didn't all recruit better than we did.


gohogs141
Arkansas Fan
Fayetteville
Member since Jun 2011
5186 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

I just disagree, I think he's a bad coach. 16-32 kind of proves that to me.


He took over 1-11 and 4-8 teams and hasn’t had a season where he’s regressed from the year prior.

quote:

Bielema averaged a top 25 class, that's enough to win more than two games.


It took a miracle to escape losing to a 3-9 Sun Belt team and finishing 3-9 ourselves in Bielema’s last year. Some of you must have short memories.

quote:

We recruited about the same as Mississippi State the last few years, they had a first year coach last season too and he went 8-5 and beat the shite out of us.


And State fans were expecting 10 wins and wanted Moorehead fired during parts of the year. They had THREE first round picks. Even Ole Miss had three players picked in the first two rounds. We were by far the least talented team in our division. Morris beat North Texas three years in a row at SMU, why did he all of a sudden get blown out by them with better talent if it was all coaching?


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

Morris beat North Texas three years in a row at SMU, why did he all of a sudden get blown out by them with better talent if it was all coaching?


That first year North Texas was 1-11. One of the only teams worse than SMU.

And you're acknowledging that he had better talent at Arkansas when he lost to them. If he had better talent then you have to blame the coaching.


Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

it was the system that caused Chad to keep playing Cole Kelley against North Texas after he already threw three interceptions.
You're going to pretend what was behind Kelley was any significant improvement? There wasn't a single capable QB on the roster. He walked into an absolute dog shite roster situation and half of them didn't even want to play for him. You also like to bring up Bert's recruiting classes but never bring up what has already been discussed here in the amount of those recruits that ended up transferring out, getting in trouble, or being complete duds. I think it was the class from 4 years ago now that Bert had somehow only managed to retain less than half of the total class and even fewer had contributed any kind of meaningful playtime. If that's not roster issues, then there isn't a single team in this level of football with roster issues. You can slap all the blame on Chad all you want, but it's just flat out not true.

As I said earlier, every team that beat us including OOC had better talent at the QB position and some at the O-Line position than us last year and it was blatantly apparent on the field. That's not being significantly better if you aren't even better at the most critical position on the offensive side of the ball, and that's only the most glaring example.
This post was edited on 7/22 at 8:49 pm


Hawgnsincebirth55
Arkansas Fan
Gods country
Member since Sep 2016
8239 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
He’s not acknowledging he had better talent last year. He’s saying we had worst talent last year than he did at smu. Honestly if chad was still at smu last year and they played us from last year led by bert I believe smu wins. They had better talent than how bad bert is it roster management and player development. I don’t think Bert was a bad recruiter I think he is one of the worst player development coaches that I have ever seen. It’s like Houston mutt was with qbs but with half of the positions on the field. Skill players got slower and we were still never strong enough to be either really physical or just hit somebody and get a yard when we needed it. I can remember bert somehow had horrible success rates in short yardage situations even though his calling card was supposed to be smashmouth football. I think bert just wasn’t focused on football here


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

You're going to pretend what was behind Kelley was any significant improvement? There wasn't a single capable QB on the roster.


So now we're blaming Bielema for recruiting two 4 star in-state quarterbacks?

quote:

the amount of those recruits that ended up transferring out, getting in trouble, or being complete duds.


That happens everywhere.


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

He’s not acknowledging he had better talent last year. He’s saying we had worst talent last year than he did at smu.


That's absurd.


Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

So now we're blaming Bielema for recruiting two 4 star in-state quarterbacks?
Why is there a need to blame anyone for that at this point? He went after small-time in-state kids with good ratings and they were duds. It's not some huge shock, but it's also not something you can put on the new guy, either. Which is what you're trying to do. Chad was forced to work with what he had, and what he had wasn't a lot.

quote:

That happens everywhere.
Nowhere near at the rate Bert was losing/kicking kids. From the start of 2018 to the end, 20 players left the team. That's nearly a 3rd of the roster in less than a year. It was very clear that even of the guys Bert managed to keep, they sure as hell wanted nothing to do with Morris which, again, showed on the field.
This post was edited on 7/22 at 9:18 pm


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Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

That's absurd.
Sometimes I wonder if you even paid attention to the games. It was pretty clear watching the guys on the field that we were completely devoid of talent in many areas.

WRs that couldn't get separation against secondaries like CSU and North Texas, mediocre RBs at the very best, an abysmal O-line, and QBs that topped out at D II starters at best.

We weren't good. Even when Chad asked them to do simple things, they'd find a way to frick it up. I don't envy having to call plays for a team like that. Having no real option at QB specifically for Chad absolutely kills the effectiveness of his offense, which is why it was such a huge deal to bring in Starkel. Expect tremendous improvement in overall offensive execution this year.
This post was edited on 7/22 at 9:22 pm


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

Sometimes I wonder if you even paid attention to the games. It was pretty clear watching the guys on the field that we were completely devoid of talent in many areas.


SMU's recruiting classes were in the 70's and 80's, Arkansas averaged a top 25 class. Are you seriously going to argue that SMU was more talented?


Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
Starting from 2016, North Texas' recruiting classes were ranked 102, 115, 102, and 75. Are you seriously going to argue North Texas wasn't more talented than us last year?

You really need to get off the recruiting classes branch. It's a thin one. If they told the whole story, Texas would have way more success recently and we would never leave the top 30.
This post was edited on 7/22 at 9:29 pm


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

Starting from 2016, North Texas' recruiting classes were ranked 102, 115, 102, and 75. Are you seriously going to argue North Texas wasn't more talented than us last year?

You really need to get off the recruiting classes branch.


Holy shite. The only thing keeping Chad alive is the ranking from one class, and now you wanna say recruiting rankings don't matter when it suits your argument.


Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

The only thing keeping Chad alive is the ranking from one class
Or most people aren't dumb enough to pull the plug after one season with someone else's players? The class was a step in the right direction and proof that he has the moxie to pull off a good class coming off a 2 win season. He filled many direct needs we had in the personnel department very well even with the unattractive debut season. How is that not a positive? That doesn't guarantee success in his coming seasons, which is why judgement should still be, and is, being reserved among those with developed critical thinking/reasoning ability.
This post was edited on 7/22 at 9:47 pm


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

he has the moxie to pull off a good class


We'll see. Class rankings don't tell the whole story remember? That was your argument five minutes ago.


Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

Class rankings don't tell the whole story remember?
On the field.

Being able to attract that kind of talent after winning 2 games in year 1 is a talent in and of itself. I also said it doesn't guarantee success in his coming seasons remember?

Nice try, not as clever as you thought it was though.



gohogs141
Arkansas Fan
Fayetteville
Member since Jun 2011
5186 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

That first year North Texas was 1-11. One of the only teams worse than SMU.


And that one game is what gave SMU the better record.

quote:

And you're acknowledging that he had better talent at Arkansas when he lost to them. If he had better talent then you have to blame the coaching.



So then he forgot how to coach from one year to the next?


Stonehog
Iona Fan
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Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

So then he forgot how to coach from one year to the next?


You're implying that he knew how to coach while compiling a 14-22 record. He's not even head coach material. He's now 16-32 and people are trying to call him a good coach based on the ranking of one class that hasn't even seen the field yet.


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Stonehog
Iona Fan
Platinum Rewards Club
Member since Aug 2011
28986 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

Being able to attract that kind of talent after winning 2 games in year 1 is a talent in and of itself.


We don't know how talented they are because class rankings don't tell the whole story.


Drewbie
Arkansas Fan
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
40758 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

We don't know how talented they are because class rankings don't tell the whole story.
True, but I'd rather have a coach getting the potential studs for sure. If his guys don't work out over the course of their development here, it will fall on Chad as either poor evaluation of talent or lack of development. What we know for sure is he brought in two huge upgrades at QB and players that are much faster. These were major concerns.
This post was edited on 7/22 at 11:14 pm


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boogiewoogie1978
Arkansas Fan
Little Rock
Member since Aug 2012
9414 posts

re: Arkansas picked last in the West
quote:

We don't know how talented they are because class rankings don't tell the whole story.


True.
My question is how many games would Saban have won with last year's talent? Keep in mind the number of players we've had drafted over the past 2 years.


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