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re: 12 Team Playoff
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:39 pm to 1BamaRTR
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:39 pm to 1BamaRTR
Wisconsin at least won their division. Iowa finished 3rd in their division, much less their conference. With Miami, you can at least say they were the best team out of x group of teams. Of which group could you say Iowa was the best? They were middle of the pack in their own division.
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Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:45 pm to TideSaint
quote:
This is stupid.
If certain conferences want in they need to get better. Period.
Don't water down the regular season.
Completely agree
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:46 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
With Miami, you can at least say they were the best team out of x group of teams.
And they were slotted appropriately in the Lending Tree Bowl.
Where they lost by 10 to Louisiana Lafayette.
But let's put an equivalent team in the playoffs because of muh feels.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:47 pm to TideSaint
quote:
But let's put an equivalent team in the playoffs because of muh feels.
Could you use more buzzwords that don't have shite to do with what we're talking about? This has nothing to do with feelings or emotions.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:48 pm to 14&Counting
quote:
Automatic tie-ins and more at larges seems to me a way to keep interest and keep the game from being an regional sport. Otherwise the Bama's and Ohio State's will continue to dominate and the rest of the country loses interest.
Sounds like the same argument made for adding bowl games and more conference tie-ins. Did not build excitement and the same result.
Two teams will always play for the NC no matter the format.Adding more pretenders will not change that. The same teams will end up in the NC for the most part so after 10 other teams fall fall so will the interest once again if not your team.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:50 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
Could you use more buzzwords that don't have shite to do with what we're talking about? This has nothing to do with feelings or emotions.
Does inclusion make you feel better?
That's precisely what you are advocating for.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 12:52 pm
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:53 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
With Miami, you can at least say they were the best team out of x group of teams.
Arguing that an 8-5 MAC team has a better argument for making a CFB playoff than a P-5 team that won more games against better competition is quite the hill to choose to die on.
The reality is that neither of them deserve it, but I'd bet my house that any P-5 team that is good enough to win 9-10 games would run the table against a MAC schedule. Going undefeated should literally be the starting point of any legitimate conversation about a G-5 team getting into a playoff.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 12:55 pm
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:55 pm to TideSaint
Inclusion of more conference champs would be more accurate. If you don't win your conference, much less your division, then I think you kind of lose any sympathy for not making any playoffs that don't have automatic spots for 2nd or 3rd place teams.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:56 pm to Robot Santa
I'd love to scrap the whole system and start anew (that's definitely a hill I will gladly die on), but if we're left to argue over the 4 vs 12 team options, I know which one I'm taking.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 12:58 pm
Posted on 6/11/21 at 12:59 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
With Miami, you can at least say they were the best team out of x group of teams.
With Miami, you can at least say they were worse then Iowa because Iowa BEAT them by 24 points. See once again I can do it too.
Are you seriously going to look at this:
quote:and tell me Miami (OH) had the better resume?
Miami (OH)
Record 8-5
SOS 82nd
Point differential NEGATIVE 4 points
Three ranked games played (0-3 vs top 25)
Had losses of 24, 22, and 72 (!) points to them
Also had 22 point loss to 7-5 MAC team and 14 point loss to a 5-7 MAC team
Iowa
Record 9-3
SOS 22nd
Point differential 11.8 points 4 ranked teams played (1-3 vs top 25)
Had losses of 7, 5, and 2
Beat Miami (OH) head to head by 24 points
quote:
Of which group could you say Iowa was the best?
That’s pretty easy, they were among the best of the top 25 teams in the country. They were the best of the bottom 10 of the top 25 ranked teams. Miami (OH) wouldn’t even be among the top 50.
You do realize when you look at accomplishments, you have to consider other factors? Do you go through real life making decisions just based on face value? Do you make big purchases without looking at other factors? In this case, you’re COMPLETELY ignoring level of competition.
By saying your statement, you are equating the MAC conference to close to or on the same level as the Big 10. The same Big 10 which routinely beats the best MAC teams by 20-50 points.
But like Saint said, the fact that you completely ignored by question even though I asked you twice before, is enough to show me you yourself are not confident in the response you just gave me. You are really choosing the worst hill to die on.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 1:01 pm
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:05 pm to 1BamaRTR
You're essentially arguing over who the 12th team is. I'm definitely taking the conference champ over the 3rd place in the division.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:07 pm to 1BamaRTR
quote:
By saying your statement, you are equating the MAC conference to close to or on the same level as the Big 10. The same Big 10 which routinely beats the best MAC teams by 20-50 points.
How is comparing the conference champ to the ~5th place team in the conference putting the 2 conferences on the same level? What I've argued for is just the same thing that happens in several other tournaments in other sports.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 1:11 pm
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:11 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
You're essentially arguing over who the 12th team is. I'm definitely taking the conference champ over the 3rd place in the division.
Why? Iowa had a better resume. Miami (OH) only won their conference because they had a FAR easier path. I’m definitely taking the team that won more games, higher MOV, beat them head to head, and all the whole had a FAR tougher SOS.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:12 pm to 1BamaRTR
quote:
Miami (OH) only won their conference because they had a FAR easier path
But they did win their conference.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:14 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
How is comparing the conference champ to the ~5th place team in the conference putting the 2 conferences on the same level?
Because the 5th place team in the B1G any given year would absolutely demolish a MAC schedule. It's not like you're comparing a 9-3 Pac-12 champion to a 9-3 4th place B1G team. The B1G is a better conference, but they don't have 8 teams that would run the table in the Pac-12. If you want an expanded playoff but also don't want the 2nd and 3rd place teams from major conferences to get in, the inevitable result is basically just what we have now but with more steps. If you want compelling football then the extra teams need to be the ones that finish 2nd, 3rd, 4th in major conferences, not the tallest dwarf from the MAC or Sun Belt.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:16 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
How is comparing the conference champ to the ~5th place team in the conference putting the 2 conferences on the same level?
Because you are acting like winning a shitty conference is on the same level as winning a better conference. You’re going to say you don’t but you’re equating 1st place in one conference to 1st place to another, 2nd to 2nd, 3rd to 3rd, etc.
You are also comparing Miami’s conference title to Iowa’s 5th place conference finish. You are comparing what they did in their respective conferences to each other. In order to do a one to one comparison, things have to be on the same level.
It is much harder to finish 5th place in the Big 10 then it is to win the MAC.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:30 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
But they did win their conference.
They won a weaker conference. Why is it that winning a conference, no matter shitty it is or otherwise how horrible the rest of your resume is, means you can completely ignore the strength of schedule?
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:31 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
But they did win their conference.
I’m curious how far you extend this. This seems inconsistent with your staunch defense of the MLS, one of the only closed leagues in the world, on the soccer board.
Do you think each European teams should get only one Champions League qualifier or that the Cyprus league champions should qualify straight to the group stage? Do you think a USL champion should have a shot over a MLS third place team?
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:34 pm to 1BamaRTR
quote:
It is much harder to finish 5th place in the Big 10 then it is to win the MAC.
I don’t know. Northwestern made the B1G title game in 2018 after losing to an Akron team that went 4-8.
It seems like mid tier B1G teams lose pretty often to MAC schools.
Posted on 6/11/21 at 1:42 pm to TomRollTideRitter
quote:
I don’t know.
This is why I think context matters because in 2019 it was hard to finish where Iowa did. This is why I wouldn’t be opposed to a 13-0 or even 12-1 MAC team. My main issue is doing auto bids and allowing a possible 8-5 team in. You have to consider all factors and not completely ignore the entire resume.
That being said I will also say that just because NW lost that doesn’t mean it was easier to win the Big 10 west then to win the MAC. In 2019 MAC, Miami (OH) lost to two MAC teams by double digits yet they still won the conference. It was easier for them to beat Miami but it wasn’t easier for them to win the conference.
This post was edited on 6/11/21 at 1:46 pm
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