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Stat I read on 247 that shows the difference between Kirby and Richt
Posted on 5/14/19 at 3:26 pm
Posted on 5/14/19 at 3:26 pm
"From 2017-2020, Georgia signed* seven top 50 overall offensive linemen.
From 2001-2016, Georgia signed two top 50 overall offensive linemen."
Verified it, and it's a great stat if all of these guys stay. Will say I haven't seen many O-Linemen decommit from Pittman.
From 2001-2016, Georgia signed two top 50 overall offensive linemen."
Verified it, and it's a great stat if all of these guys stay. Will say I haven't seen many O-Linemen decommit from Pittman.
This post was edited on 5/14/19 at 3:32 pm
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Posted on 5/14/19 at 3:32 pm to chillmonster
I think it's always been known OL recruiting was a major weak spot for Richt. Glad for his service but glad we've got kirby and pittman too.
Also this does NOT make up for the woeful lack of OL recruiting, but Richt sure did seem to have some rotten luck with OL injuries.
Also this does NOT make up for the woeful lack of OL recruiting, but Richt sure did seem to have some rotten luck with OL injuries.
Posted on 5/14/19 at 3:36 pm to WG_Dawg
Richt didn't seem to understand numbers.
You need 5 OL.
You need 5 to 6 DBs.
You can never cycle through a recruiting class with just 1 OL or DB recruit. It is insanity.
When you only start 2 ILB, you can get away with 1 ILB in a class. When you only start 2-3 WRs, you can get away with only 1 or 2 WRs per class.
To do so at DB or OL can be deemed nothing less than a failure of mismanagement.
You need 5 OL.
You need 5 to 6 DBs.
You can never cycle through a recruiting class with just 1 OL or DB recruit. It is insanity.
When you only start 2 ILB, you can get away with 1 ILB in a class. When you only start 2-3 WRs, you can get away with only 1 or 2 WRs per class.
To do so at DB or OL can be deemed nothing less than a failure of mismanagement.
Posted on 5/14/19 at 4:08 pm to meansonny
In defense of CMR's DB numbers, he had a tough time keeping them on the team.
Guys like Nick Marshall, JHC, Trigga Tray, Langley, Wiggins, etc. were supposed to be the future secondary but none of them were on campus longer than a year or two.
There's no doubt he should've targeted more quality players at the position, but when you sign these guys and all of them get PT as freshmen and they still leave the program early by transfer or dismissal, I don't know how that really falls on CMR.
Guys like Nick Marshall, JHC, Trigga Tray, Langley, Wiggins, etc. were supposed to be the future secondary but none of them were on campus longer than a year or two.
There's no doubt he should've targeted more quality players at the position, but when you sign these guys and all of them get PT as freshmen and they still leave the program early by transfer or dismissal, I don't know how that really falls on CMR.
Posted on 5/14/19 at 4:10 pm to WG_Dawg
quote:
Also this does NOT make up for the woeful lack of OL recruiting, but Richt sure did seem to have some rotten luck with OL injuries.
To be fair, Kirby and Pittman did last year too. That’s why recruiting the way they do matters so much. It’s nice to have a Cade Mays and Trey Hill to plug in in emergencies.
Posted on 5/14/19 at 4:33 pm to dawgdayafternoon
quote:
In defense of CMR's DB numbers, he had a tough time keeping them on the team.
Then you have to recruit more than 1 to keep your team solvent.
quote:
but when you sign these guys and all of them get PT as freshmen and they still leave the program early by transfer or dismissal, I don't know how that really falls on CMR.
It falls on CMR. But this is a great point. How frustrating is it to struggle with so many true freshmen with that much playing time. And instead of it paying off for us down the road, all of the kids are gone. That happened repeatedly. And it is a spirit breaker for sure.
Posted on 5/14/19 at 4:40 pm to chillmonster
The ability to enforce your will on the other team with blunt force is Handy when the passing game isn't working or momentum is slipping.
I have viewed the homercasts of all of last year's games and goal line play calling was atrocious and the QB shuffle hurt Fromms consistency in the passing game.
Chaney could not help himself but to call a dumbass gadget play inside the 3. Kirby went off into the headset several times due to this.
I have viewed the homercasts of all of last year's games and goal line play calling was atrocious and the QB shuffle hurt Fromms consistency in the passing game.
Chaney could not help himself but to call a dumbass gadget play inside the 3. Kirby went off into the headset several times due to this.
Posted on 5/14/19 at 4:54 pm to meansonny
quote:
To do so at DB or OL can be deemed nothing less than a failure of mismanagement.
Technically, it's a roaring success of mismanagement, as a failure of mismanagement would be good management.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 10:29 am to chillmonster
quote:
difference between Kirby and Richt by chillmonster
Can't just narrow it down to just OL recruiting. After the 2012 SEC Championship game, Richt signed a total of 9 top 50 recruits, 8 was 5*s.
Since 2017 Kirby has signed 24 top 50 recruits, 15 5*s. The only position that Kirby hasn't excelled is DT where he only signed one top 50(5*) at that position.
(I gave Richt credit for the 2016 class)
Posted on 5/15/19 at 10:34 am to DawgRff
Yes, but O-Line is the most important unit on the team and Richt neglected it. I'm not trying to rag on the guy, but it's just such a glaring oversight.
I am convinced better O-Line talent with some of the kids we had at skill positions would have produced at least one NC.
I am convinced better O-Line talent with some of the kids we had at skill positions would have produced at least one NC.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 11:14 am to chillmonster
quote:
I am convinced better O-Line talent with some of the kids we had at skill positions would have produced at least one NC.
I disagree. We had the offense and scored points to produce a double digit lead in all 3 games but couldn't stop Bama late in the game. We were lacking a dominant DT who could penetrate the middle like Bama and Clemson's first round DT picks.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 1:40 pm to DawgRff
quote:
We were lacking a dominant DT who could penetrate the middle like Bama and Clemson's first round DT picks.
We had John Jenkins at DT in 2012, he's still in the league so he is no slouch. What we lacked was depth, we were gassed in the 4th and they took advantage of it. Our starting D in 2012 is one of the most talented we've ever had, behind them though was a lot of underclassmen. One could say that the reason for that was a mismanaged roster, right?
Posted on 5/15/19 at 2:03 pm to chillmonster
To beat the dead horse (richt's roster management).
Mark Richt averaged 4.5 OL recruits per year. Not bad.
However, he would stack back to back classes with 3 OL recruits or fewer (2004=3 / 2005=1 ; 2009=3 / 2010=3).
Mark Richt averaged about 3.5 DBs per year. He stacked multiple classes with less than 2 DBs as well (2003=1 /2004=2 ; 2007=2 / 2008=2). 2009 and 2010 were only 3 DBs (not catching up from the prior small numbers and attrition).
We only signed 1 DB again in 2012.
How is Kirby different? He seems to recruit 2 more CBs per class than Richt (to help with nickel and dime packages). That makes up the 2 more DBs on average per class.
(It is almost like Richt didn't realize that DB numbers should mirror OL numbers because of the number of players you need on the field and depth at one time).
Kirby hasnt dipped under 3 OL in a class. And it doesn't appear that he will stack back to back classes at 3.
Mark Richt averaged 4.5 OL recruits per year. Not bad.
However, he would stack back to back classes with 3 OL recruits or fewer (2004=3 / 2005=1 ; 2009=3 / 2010=3).
Mark Richt averaged about 3.5 DBs per year. He stacked multiple classes with less than 2 DBs as well (2003=1 /2004=2 ; 2007=2 / 2008=2). 2009 and 2010 were only 3 DBs (not catching up from the prior small numbers and attrition).
We only signed 1 DB again in 2012.
How is Kirby different? He seems to recruit 2 more CBs per class than Richt (to help with nickel and dime packages). That makes up the 2 more DBs on average per class.
(It is almost like Richt didn't realize that DB numbers should mirror OL numbers because of the number of players you need on the field and depth at one time).
Kirby hasnt dipped under 3 OL in a class. And it doesn't appear that he will stack back to back classes at 3.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 3:54 pm to meansonny
Where did Richt spend the scholarships? I swear we are both better in the trenches and the skill players under Kirby....
Posted on 5/15/19 at 4:15 pm to lewis and herschel
Richt didn't spend the scholarships. That is the point.
To avoid the stigma of oversigning, we would sign our classes to the 85 man limit.
With 4 classes, that is 21 per class. With redshirts, you may be pushing that down to 17 per class.
Kirby consistently has us requiring about 4-6 player attrition per year by pushing the 25 recruit class limit.
To avoid the stigma of oversigning, we would sign our classes to the 85 man limit.
With 4 classes, that is 21 per class. With redshirts, you may be pushing that down to 17 per class.
Kirby consistently has us requiring about 4-6 player attrition per year by pushing the 25 recruit class limit.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 5:04 pm to meansonny
Which is fine given the natural attrition of 4-6 an off-season.
Posted on 5/20/19 at 6:17 am to chillmonster
I got bored and looked at some of the recruiting numbers on Richt’s OL recruiting vs Kirby/Pittman.
Here are the 247 composite ratings for every OL recruit in Richt’s last 5 recruiting classes:
***-NOTE: I’m listing all and only players who were recruited as OLinemen. There were obviously guys like Gaillard who shifted from DL to an outstanding OL and guys who shifted from OL to DL, but they are not accounted for on this list because the point is to highlight recruiting.
John Theus - .9915
Isaiah Wynn - .9474
Brandon Kublanow - .9226
Pat Allen - .9166
Dyshon Sims - .9084
Kendall Baker - .8997
Watts Dantzler - .8904
DeVondre Seymour - .8884
Greg Pyke - .8857
Zach DeBell - .8832
Sage Hardin - .8782
Sam Madden - .8760
Xzavier Ward - .8706
Jake Edwards - .8665
Josh Cardiello - .8656
Aulden Bynum - .8640
David Andrews - .8630
Mark Beard - .8530
Mirko Jurkovic - .8519
Hunter Long - .8291
Nathan Theus - .7954
Glenn Welch - .7798
That’s 22 recruits over 5 years (more than 4 per year).
Now, here’s OL recruits in Kirby’s first 5 years:
Jamaree Salyer - .9956
Broderick Jones - .9921
Isaiah Wilson - .9904
Clay Webb - .9877
Cade Mays - .9869
Tate Ratledge - .9792
Andrew Thomas - .9791
Trey Hill - .9692
Netori Johnson - .9588
Ben Cleveland - .9565
Xavier Truss - .9158
Warren McClendon - .9131
Warren Ericson - .9070
Akinola Ogunbiyi - .9044
D’Marcus Hayes - .8950
Owen Condon - .8830
Justin Shaffer - .8828
Solomon Kindley - .8408
That’s fewer commits (granted, the 2020 class is still in progress), 18 to be exact.
Here’s the big number: average rating of those recruit lists -
Last 5 years of Richt: .8816
First 5 years of Kirby: .9409
To put that in perspective:
Isaiah Wynn was the second-highest rated OL recruit for Richt. He’s the average under Kirby.
Justin Shaffer has been the second-lowest rated OL recruit under Kirby. He’s the average under Richt.
Wow.
Here are the 247 composite ratings for every OL recruit in Richt’s last 5 recruiting classes:
***-NOTE: I’m listing all and only players who were recruited as OLinemen. There were obviously guys like Gaillard who shifted from DL to an outstanding OL and guys who shifted from OL to DL, but they are not accounted for on this list because the point is to highlight recruiting.
John Theus - .9915
Isaiah Wynn - .9474
Brandon Kublanow - .9226
Pat Allen - .9166
Dyshon Sims - .9084
Kendall Baker - .8997
Watts Dantzler - .8904
DeVondre Seymour - .8884
Greg Pyke - .8857
Zach DeBell - .8832
Sage Hardin - .8782
Sam Madden - .8760
Xzavier Ward - .8706
Jake Edwards - .8665
Josh Cardiello - .8656
Aulden Bynum - .8640
David Andrews - .8630
Mark Beard - .8530
Mirko Jurkovic - .8519
Hunter Long - .8291
Nathan Theus - .7954
Glenn Welch - .7798
That’s 22 recruits over 5 years (more than 4 per year).
Now, here’s OL recruits in Kirby’s first 5 years:
Jamaree Salyer - .9956
Broderick Jones - .9921
Isaiah Wilson - .9904
Clay Webb - .9877
Cade Mays - .9869
Tate Ratledge - .9792
Andrew Thomas - .9791
Trey Hill - .9692
Netori Johnson - .9588
Ben Cleveland - .9565
Xavier Truss - .9158
Warren McClendon - .9131
Warren Ericson - .9070
Akinola Ogunbiyi - .9044
D’Marcus Hayes - .8950
Owen Condon - .8830
Justin Shaffer - .8828
Solomon Kindley - .8408
That’s fewer commits (granted, the 2020 class is still in progress), 18 to be exact.
Here’s the big number: average rating of those recruit lists -
Last 5 years of Richt: .8816
First 5 years of Kirby: .9409
To put that in perspective:
Isaiah Wynn was the second-highest rated OL recruit for Richt. He’s the average under Kirby.
Justin Shaffer has been the second-lowest rated OL recruit under Kirby. He’s the average under Richt.
Wow.
This post was edited on 5/20/19 at 6:43 am
Posted on 5/20/19 at 6:37 am to BranchDawg
Damn Branch, that's a fine piece of work. Good on ya! 
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