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Peter Buck
Georgia Fan
Member since Sep 2012
8807 posts

Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
Shotgun/pistol dive is what we seemed to have run quite a bit this year. It is a hand off all the way. The backside DE may or may not be accounted for in the blocking scheme. It is power football from a traditionally not power football formation. You can run different blocking schemes as well....From the exact same formation and you can attack different gaps. It may look like the same play to us, but two consecutive runs may have actually been to different gaps using different blocking schemes.

Zone Read is out of the same core formation. The backside DE is not accounted for in the blocking scheme. The QB reads him. If the DE appears to be playing the dive, the QB keeps it. The backside LB has responsibility to contain this (unless he has some sort of run blitz thing happening) By having to contain this, he may be a step slower getting to help out the dive if it happens. The zone read doesn’t work if you can’t win at the point of attack for the dive though.

Zone Read Option is the above plus technically having another option, though I think you will hear the Zone Read be called the Read Option by announcers. At this point, you are getting into semantics I guess.

RPO is typically run out of the same formation types, but the option is reading the coverage. If the QB seas a quick pass will work, he may choose it over handing it off. To make this more confusing, you can have hot calls for receivers to run these same routes and it is pass all the way, though we may see it as a RPO.


We saw a lot of press coverage this year which limits the RPO and quick pass audibles.

We did use the jet sweep as a kind of read option play, though technically it isn’t. The jet came from the “play side”. Aka where the dive would go based on the formation, so, in other words, the jet guy was running the same direction that the QB would in a zone read, but he has a full head of steam and is one of your fastest players. 87 got this play a decent bit and we had pretty good success with it. It kind of has the same affect as the zone read, as it keeps the backside contain more honest. In fact, you can run the Zone Read Option with the jet, which we didn’t do very often, but we showed it some.

For any option play to work over the course of the game and season, you have to show it. If you don’t, it makes the option part of it less respected by the defense. Though, some coaches can lull a team into not respecting something and then burn them on it at a key time. Football is a game of measures and countermeasures .


RD Dawg
Georgia Fan
Atlanta
Member since Sep 2012
15589 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
quote:

RPO is typically run out of the same formation types, but the option is reading the coverage. If the QB seas a quick pass will work


Falcons running RPO with an OT



Peter Buck
Georgia Fan
Member since Sep 2012
8807 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
That is a pretty unique play there. File it under RPO trick plays.


RD Dawg
Georgia Fan
Atlanta
Member since Sep 2012
15589 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
Heard Matt Ryan talk about it.He picked rather quickly that the OT wasn't covered and knew it would be a win

You gotta have a QB who can make split second reads...not easy.


Peter Buck
Georgia Fan
Member since Sep 2012
8807 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
It takes a special brain to process that info. Why dudes with great mechanics and cannons sometimes don’t make it past high school. We sometimes forget they are making these decisions at field level with tall dudes in front of them blocking and other tall dudes trying to kill him.


K9
Georgia Fan
wayx....BOBO IN '19
Member since Sep 2012
17163 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
What are your thoughts on the FB position? Lot of NFL teams are having success using 21 personnel (yes I feel like a fancy boy for using that in context) and I always thought it helped to have the RB have his momentum going towards LOS on the handoff AND to have a lead blocker. We have still had success obviously running without a fullback but I'm interested in your opinion on what kind of impact it can have and if you think that would help us next year.


deeprig9
Member since Sep 2012
37541 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
You didn't ask me but I'm still going to answer.

The 11 personnel accomplishes the same thing when you have a true running qb where the running back leads to block. When Fields was here, we ran this quite a bit, into stacked boxes, in garbage time. The advantage over 22 personnel is you can have your monster te still in the formation, and three wr's you can use to spread out the defense. The 22 personnel is a little more obvious what you are going to do and brings more defenders into the tacklebox.


meansonny
Georgia Fan
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
10266 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
I'm a big fan of the FB.
You can accomplish a lot of the same plays with a 2 tight end set (HBack).

But the benefit of the fullback is the a ability to create a new gap anywhere along the offensive line. Just because there is an additional defender in the box does not mean that a new gap along the line is covered.
Those 2 way go's are why we would see huge runs from Gurley/Chubb/Sony. It is difficult for a linebacker and DB to cover the block and 2 gaps.

I also like the misdirection that is presented with the FB.


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10
K9
Georgia Fan
wayx....BOBO IN '19
Member since Sep 2012
17163 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
Makes sense for shotgun/pistol plays, but I was really talking about having a fullback in for under center snaps. I'd be curious to see what percentage of snaps were under center vs shotgun for us this year....maybe 30-70? Like Sonny said having the ability to create a gap is valuable.

Which I get using the shotgun to spread out the defense to run the ball. Seems like we never did the opposite of that tho and that is to throw out of the heavy set. Which is what San Fran and some other teams have had success doing.

If any of you guys are on Twitter, follow Warren sharp, he is a big analytics guy who breaks down a lot of the nerdy stuff


deeprig9
Member since Sep 2012
37541 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
Explain to me what yall mean when say "create extra gaps" with fullback


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K9
Georgia Fan
wayx....BOBO IN '19
Member since Sep 2012
17163 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
I'm no expert but my understanding is if your normal B gap is filled with a defender, the fullback blocking that defender head on creates two subgaps to the fullbacks left and right.

Or if you're running off tackle, the fullback picking up a defender on the edge creates another cutback gap on the outside of the tackle or TE.

All that could be wrong tho lol


deeprig9
Member since Sep 2012
37541 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
I guess it is hard to talk about personnel packages without talking about formations and even deeper, playcalls.


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10
runningdog
Georgia Fan
Dawg Nation
Member since Jan 2011
652 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
I went for a nice run today. In other words, I have no f’ing idea what you jokers are talking about. I played left corner, man coverage in a veer/wishbone league.

I just wanted to post that the weather was nice, and I had a good run for an old man.


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40
lewis and herschel
Georgia Fan
Member since Nov 2009
4090 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
I think the Titans run the offense we are trying to run.

KC runs a version of what LSU runs.

I look forward to next season more than any I can remember.


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meansonny
Georgia Fan
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
10266 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
K9 has it right.

There is a "gap" to the right and left of the center.
There is a gap to the right and left of each guard.
There is a gap to the right and left of each tackle.
There is a gap to the right and left of the tight end.

When you run power, you are creating gaps with your fullback and often a pulling guard.

An average linebacker (christian robinson) would make life hell for the safety because he would not meet the fullback/guard in the hole. He meets the blocker 2-4 yards downfield. That neutralizes a great safety. The safety cant shoot downhill because the running back/QB has a 2 way go (and aggressive safety play would often leave a great running seam for the ballcarrier).

With the fullback in an I, you can throw him into A, B, or C gap (C gap is often best from and HBack spot for leverage, but the I fullback can hit any of those). The stress on the defense is making sure they have numbers playside.
This leaves huge opportunities for misdirection and counters when the defense has to be so aggressive reading the lead blocks.


deeprig9
Member since Sep 2012
37541 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
Im aware of the a, b, c gaps, still unclear how fb "creates additional gaps" ... hes just blocking at or through an existing gap. Is this just a terminology disconnect?


meansonny
Georgia Fan
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
10266 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
The gaps are to the left and right of the blocker. The fullback creates 1 extra gap when he commits to a hole.

There are lots if different styles of defense. When the defense is trying to be gap sound, power football can have a lot of success overloading a side.


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Coach7
Georgia Fan
GA
Member since Apr 2016
415 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
quote:

RPO is typically run out of the same formation types, but the option is reading the coverage.


Usually with RPO you’re reading one defender. For example the overhang defender to determine whether to hand it off or throw a slant. Not much reading of the overall coverage unless it’s Presnap. Key in determining if it’s an RPO is to look at the OL. Are they blocking for quick game or running a run concept?

quote:

We did use the jet sweep as a kind of read option play, though technically it isn’t.


You can read whether the overhang expands with the sweep so it’s a read.

Pretty good summary for fans.






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Coach7
Georgia Fan
GA
Member since Apr 2016
415 posts

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
quote:

thoughts on the FB position?


Use an Hback. I thought Woerner did a pretty good job.


meansonny
Georgia Fan
ATL
Member since Sep 2012
10266 posts
 Online 

re: Shotgun/Pistol Dive vs zone read vs read option vs RPO
quote:


Use an Hback. I thought Woerner did a pretty good job.


There are a lot of benefits at the HBack spot.

You might disagree, but it doesnt often benefit to a power scheme on interior runs (and I think we saw that the past 2 seasons.

Use both would be my recommendation


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