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re: Why is there a playoff committee to begin with?

Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:34 pm to
Posted by WildTchoupitoulas
Member since Jan 2010
44071 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:34 pm to
quote:

and the next 2 highest ranked teams

Why should opini9ons ever factor in? Why not a simple, objective system where no one can cry about opinions?

If you're going to have opinions in the system, just have the whole thing based on opinions and stop trying to make it seem objective when it's not.
Posted by ReauxlTide222
St. Petersburg
Member since Nov 2010
83459 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:36 pm to
quote:

And the whole part about LSU getting punished for going 12-0 and having less time to prepare and rest than their opponent.



LSU didn't have enough time to rest :/
Posted by GamerAg
Member since Dec 2010
1666 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:37 pm to
Because there are times, as we have seen in recent history, where there is legitimate argument to be made that 2 of the best teams were from one conference. This still allows for that option without punishing a conference champion who by definition earned a shot at the playoffs.

Posted by BHMKyle
Birmingham, AL
Member since Feb 2013
5076 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:38 pm to
quote:

You actually believe that OkieState was a better team than 2011 BAMA?


No. But as the 13-0 SEC Champion who not only went through the entire SEC unscathed, but also beat #5 Oregon out of conference, and beat Alabama in Tuscaloosa, LSU earned the right to not have to give Bama a do-over.

The entire problem with the rematch is that after Bama won round two, you had LSU at 13-1 and Bama at 12-1, and each 1-1 against each other.... and LSU, unlike Bama, never had the luxury of playing one of those games in their home stadium.

LSU had the better resume EVEN AFTER losing to Bama. That's the entire point. It rendered winning your conference completely irrelevant. It rendered the regular season completely irrelevant. Why even play in the regular season if winning a game like that on the road is not going to be valued one bit?

This is the problem with letting Bama in that game.

LSU, Bama, and Oklahoma State were all either undefeated or had one loss. Bama had their chance in the regular season and failed. At home. Oklahoma State should have had their chance since Bama had already had it and failed.

If you want to argue that Bama was clearly one of the best two teams, have at it. You have a very valid point. But don't act as if questioning the decision of the voters isn't also a valid argument. There isn't always just one side to every argument.

Had the teams in question been turned on their heads, and had Oklahoma and Oklahoma State been the #1 and #2 teams when they played in the regular season... with OK State losing a close one to the Sooners AT HOME.... and had Bama been 12-1, SEC Champs with a loss to Texas A&M. And had the nation decided it wanted to see OU-OK State again, don't act as if you'd be cool with it. OK State got screwed. You'd feel the same way if it had happened to your team.
Posted by WildTchoupitoulas
Member since Jan 2010
44071 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:39 pm to
quote:

there is legitimate argument to be made that 2 of the best teams were from one conference.

If the conference champion isn't considered the best team in that conference, how can the national champion be considered the best team in the nation?

Either championships mean something, or they don't.

What the hell does "champion" mean?
Posted by labamafan
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2007
24264 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:44 pm to
quote:



If the conference champion isn't considered the best team in that conference, how can the national champion be considered the best team in the nation?

Either championships mean something, or they don't.





It doesn't mean a thing. I get you're antiBama and that's fine but theres no way regardless of the outcome of this seccg you can make an argument that Florida is a better team than Alabama or that Wisconsin or Penn state is a better football team than Ohio State.
Posted by Lsu19geaux94
Member since Oct 2015
1939 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:47 pm to
Everyone whined and fricking cried, remember 04 when USC claimed they were co national champs? frick that everyone whines and cries now it'll never change. But to say the playoff is LSUs fault is downright bogus.
Posted by GamerAg
Member since Dec 2010
1666 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:52 pm to
quote:

quote:
there is legitimate argument to be made that 2 of the best teams were from one conference.

If the conference champion isn't considered the best team in that conference, how can the national champion be considered the best team in the nation?

Either championships mean something, or they don't.

What the hell does "champion" mean?


It means you won the regular season for that conference... the same as it means for literally every other sport, both collegiate and professional.

That qualifies you to compete for the national championship via playoffs.

If you win that, you are considered the national champion.

Again, literally the way it works in every other sport.
This post was edited on 11/30/16 at 12:53 pm
Posted by WildTchoupitoulas
Member since Jan 2010
44071 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:57 pm to
quote:

I get you're antiBama

Actually, before the internet, I used to be VERY pro Alabama. My team was coached by a student of Paul Bryant, and while it was painful to watch him lose to the master every year, it was understandable. Alabama usually represented the conference well, and I pulled for them.

All that good will evaporated when football message boards arrived.

quote:

theres no way regardless of the outcome of this seccg you can make an argument that Florida is a better team than Alabama

So you're saying that it is meaningless if one team beats another?

Okay, then let's just go back to awarding championships by opinion poll.

But if you want to claim that if Florida beats Alabama, that doesn't mean Florida is better than Alabama, then CLEARLY Clemson was better than Alabama last year and should be awarded the championship.

Either winning a championship game means something or it doesn't, you can't have it both ways.

In spite of your ignorant opening remark, I'm making a case for Alabama's championship last year. Some might claim that just because Alabama won doesn't mean they were the better team.
Posted by OldPete
Georgia
Member since Oct 2013
2804 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 12:58 pm to
quote:

The fact that Penn St could win the Big 10, having beat Ohio State, and still get passed over in favor of Ohio State is beyond ridiculous. It needs to expand to 8 with 5 Power 5 Champs, best Group of 5 champ, and the next 2 highest ranked teams.

While I agree with your sentiment, I disagree with it going to 8 teams. I used to be a proponent of an 8-team playoff but, after seeing the CFP the past 3 years, I think 4 is the right call...

If you go to 8, it'll diminish the regular season greatly. The Ohio State - Michigan game this past weekend would've meant nothing if an 8-team play-off was in play as both teams would've been in regardless of the outcome...that game felt like a playoff game. In the past 2 seasons, after Bama lost to Ole Miss, every game they played afterwards felt like a playoff game. In an 8-game playoff, as long as you win your conference championship, nothing else really matters...and then every few years, you'll get a 3 or 4 loss conference champion in that shouldn't be there...

The primary issue with the CFP as it is now is how the 4 are chosen. In a year like 2015, the four teams were pretty much cut and dry with no controversy. In 2014, it appeared that conference championships and head-to-head matchups were major factors. This year however, as it stands right now, if Penn State were to win the Big 10, they'd likely be the odd man out (providing Washington, Bama, & Clemson all win), so it doesn't appear that those 2 factors matter as much. It gives the appearance that the standards for getting into the CFP vary each year, depending on the teams in the running, which will lead to conspiracy theories and accusations of bias.

If the scenario plays out with Bama/Washington/Clemson/Penn State winning this weekend, it'll be interesting to see how the committee rationalizes their picks...but as whacked as this season has been, now watch 3 (or even all 4) lose this weekend...then chaos will really reign supreme.
Posted by Scoreboard
Madison, AL
Member since Apr 2012
2011 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:00 pm to
As far as major college football, every "champion" has been a "mythical champion" or MNC, even with a 4-team play-off. Now if you include 8 or more objectively-chosen teams in the play-off, I think you could rightly crow about a championship. Until then, you could definitely be leaving out a team that could potentially win it, right TCU?
Posted by bona fide
Burma
Member since Jun 2010
8972 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:02 pm to
Fans and media whined non-stop about the BCS and the selection process.

The playoffs were then started and a committee was formed. Everyone rejoiced. Somehow everyone thought giving more power to the voters (committee) was a great idea.

Now everyone is unhappy and want to expand the playoffs. Every year the same people say this is the year that shows the playoffs need to expand. No matter the scenarios, expansion is the answer. If anything, this year shows four teams is too many.

The same people scream for conference expansion, then whine after it happens because things have changed.
Posted by GamerAg
Member since Dec 2010
1666 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:03 pm to
quote:

If you go to 8, it'll diminish the regular season greatly.


That same sentiment was espoused as reason not to expand to 4. There is still drama. There will still be drama with 8. Obviously if you go undefeated until the last week of the season, there will be no drama. But if Bama loses to Ole Miss mid-season, the risk of dropping another game and possibly missing the playoffs becomes a very real scenario. Hence, drama.
Posted by GregAl
Mobile
Member since Aug 2014
3659 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:06 pm to
A committee was formed to give a boost to the Big 10. Looks like it is working.
Posted by OldPete
Georgia
Member since Oct 2013
2804 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:10 pm to
quote:

If the conference champion isn't considered the best team in that conference, how can the national champion be considered the best team in the nation?

Either championships mean something, or they don't.

What the hell does "champion" mean?


Good point...which is another reason why I like the 4 team playoff. Most years you'll most likely get the 4 highest ranked conference champs. Perhaps the criteria should be changed to reflect that...the regular season would still matter as not all Power 5 champs would be automatically in...and the occasional undefeated Group of 5 champ could have a chance if they beat a decent Power 5 team during the season...
Posted by OldPete
Georgia
Member since Oct 2013
2804 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:15 pm to
quote:

But if Bama loses to Ole Miss mid-season, the risk of dropping another game and possibly missing the playoffs becomes a very real scenario. Hence, drama.

Not so much with 8 teams. Last couple of years Bama could've dropped a couple of games and still had a good chance to make it. This year, Michigan would easily be in with 2 losses...heck, USC would have a shot with 3 losses. Hence, much less drama...
Posted by ConwayGamecock
South Carolina
Member since Jan 2012
9121 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:22 pm to
The Power Five conferences need a human-staffed committee to decide the playoffs. So there'd be that political element involved when statistically a non-Power 5 school is shown to deserve entry more than a Power 5 school does. When humans are involved in things that really do not require human involvement, the reason is always political....
Posted by GamerAg
Member since Dec 2010
1666 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:24 pm to
quote:

Not so much with 8 teams. Last couple of years Bama could've dropped a couple of games and still had a good chance to make it. This year, Michigan would easily be in with 2 losses...heck, USC would have a shot with 3 losses. Hence, much less drama...


Easily being in with 2 losses would not necessarily be true. If there are only 2 wildcard spots, then Bama, Michigan, or whoever would likely be competing with several other 2-loss teams, possibly even some 1-loss teams like Ohio State this year, who weren't conference champions for those 2 spots.

Still drama in who makes it in, just less BS to deal with like exists in the current system.
Posted by MeatPants
Member since Nov 2015
8853 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:25 pm to
Because the BCS was an unmitigated disaster
Posted by Capo Losi
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2016
2193 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 1:40 pm to
Playoff with all the conference champions. It's the only objective system. I'm sick of hearing the term better team from the committee. When those better teams lost games that matter and others didnt.

There's your drama. There's why the regular season still matters. There's your fairness.

Added benefit is better ooc games on the schedule because of the minimal penalty for losing.
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