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Division IV: Good Or Bad For SEC?

Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:29 pm
Posted by Mizz-SEC
Inbred Huntin' In The SEC
Member since Jun 2013
19257 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:29 pm
John Pennington at MrSEC.com has laid out the possibilities of a world where the B1G and Pac-12 (with the ACC being swing voters) dictate policy and athletic working conditions to SEC schools if a new Division IV takes place in the name of autonomy.

Read the full opinion piece here... LINK



Highlights

Background: The Power Five have already been discussing how to take advantage of autonomy should it be granted. The presidents of the Pac-12 sent out a letter to the leaders of the other 53 Power Five schools last month. In it they proposed full-cost-of-tuition scholarships, better medical insurance, guaranteed scholarships (so long as a player is in good academic standing), decreased demands for student-athletes by nixing “voluntary” practices that circumvent the 20-hour rule, decreased out-of-season demands on student-athletes, strengthened APR requirements for postseason eligibility, liberalized rules for athletes wanting to transfer between schools and more. If given autonomy, the 65 schools will need to have some way of deciding on those types of rule changes. Mike Slive at last week’s SEC meetings suggested a 60 percent majority be required for acceptance of a proposal within the Power Five.


The takeaway: The 26 schools of the Big Ten and Pac-12 are likely going to form one voting bloc in the autonomy/Division IV world to come. Now take a look at what is being proposed by the Pac-12 and, for the most part, backed by the Big Ten — less time on the field/court for athletes, tougher academic standards for postseason play, guaranteed scholarships, eased transfer rules, etc. Think your friendly neighborhood SEC football coach would be in favor of such proposals?

Southeastern Conference presidents and chancellors are in a tight spot (to borrow a line from “O Brother Where Art Thou?”). Many would be in favor of just those types of notions. But their schools also benefit financially from being the Kings of Football and football might not best be served if some of the Pac-12 proposals become the law of the autonomous land.

Like it or not, the Big Ten and Pac-12 are viewed as athletic conferences as well as “big academics” leagues. The SEC? Not so much. There are exceptions to the rule, of course, and no SEC schools are diploma mills. But the Big Ten and SEC do have very different reputations when it comes to the views of pointy heads. The Big Ten boasts some of the biggest research schools in the country. The SEC is seen as a jockocracy (which is why Slive and league’s presidents are pushing the SECU academic initiative in order to “advance the academic reputation of SEC universities beyond their traditional regions”). The SEC has also raised its academic standards in recent years.

In a new 65-school structure, the Big Ten and Pac-12 will likely push academics first — not that that’s a bad thing — in such a way as to level the football playing field with the boys down South. For that reason, don’t be surprised to see the SEC and Big 12 buddy-up when it comes to votes on new rules and new regulations. Their 24 schools share more in common with one another than with the Big Ten and Pac-12 schools. Yes, there are fine schools in the Big 12, but that league is also seen as a football-first conference by many. When you read the words “football factory” which schools and which conferences do you think of?
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:35 pm to
The SEC, the Big 12, and the AAC will be able to block anything the Pac 12 and the Big Ten propose.
Posted by Monticello
Member since Jul 2010
16197 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:43 pm to
quote:

and the AAC


You mean ACC? The AAC will not be in the Big 5. Also, I would not count the ACC in as an automatic SEC vote. They have a lot of high end academic schools to keep happy as well. There are more Duke's and UVA's in the ACC than FSU and Clemsons.
This post was edited on 6/2/14 at 5:45 pm
Posted by Mizz-SEC
Inbred Huntin' In The SEC
Member since Jun 2013
19257 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:54 pm to
quote:

You mean ACC? The AAC will not be in the Big 5. Also, I would not count the ACC in as an automatic SEC vote. They have a lot of high end academic schools to keep happy as well. There are more Duke's and UVA's in the ACC than FSU and Clemsons.


And I wonder what kind of enforcement system is being proposed and who gets to hand down the punishments?

This could set up as the latest case of Yankee states trying to dictate terms to the South.
Posted by FourThreeForty
Member since May 2013
17290 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:54 pm to
Big 10 will always try and find any little thing to level the playing field with the SEC, including academics. Pussies.
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 5:55 pm to
quote:

The AAC will not be in the Big 5


My bad...for some reason I thought in my brain the AAC would be involved as they were the Big East.

If the Big 12 can get back to 12 or even go up to 14 teams, I think we will be able to block most of this crap the Big Ten and Pac 12 tries to shove down our throat with the help of some schools from the ACC.

Posted by Mizz-SEC
Inbred Huntin' In The SEC
Member since Jun 2013
19257 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:05 pm to
quote:

Big 10 will always try and find any little thing to level the playing field with the SEC, including academics. Pussies.


It's not the academics and you know it. It's the limiting of the practice time.

Although if I'm a B1G school, I need all the practice time I can get to compete with Big Boy Football.
Posted by Surd
Member since Jun 2013
52 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:15 pm to
You have to remember that the NLRB ruling at Northwestern, that football players are employers, was based on two primary things. Revenue generated and time spent generating that revenue. NCAA's "20 hour rule" didn't carry any weight with the labor board when it was shown how much actual time football players spend on football when all the "voluntary" workouts, team meetings, film study, and travel were added up.

The recommended time restrictions are primarily a response to the NLRB ruling, not at the SEC. Since the conferences currently spend the same amount of time on football, I just don't see how putting additional limitations on time spent on football puts the SEC at a disadvantage. All conferences would still be operating under the same rules.
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:18 pm to
quote:

All conferences would still be operating under the same rules.


With higher academic standards, we will force the SEC and Big 12 schools to cut corners because, let's face it, these two conferences don't hold their athletes to the same standards the Pac 12 and Big Ten do. So, in the long run, it will hurt the student athletes of the SEC because schools will make it so they are taking easy, non-helpful courses so as to keep them eligible for play.

That might be good for us fans and the teams we support, but that won't be good for the individual athlete.
This post was edited on 6/2/14 at 6:21 pm
Posted by Surd
Member since Jun 2013
52 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:23 pm to
quote:

So, in the long run, it will hurt the student athletes of the SEC because schools will make it so they are taking easy, non-helpful courses so as to keep them eligible for play.


Isn't that already happening?
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:25 pm to
quote:

Isn't that already happening?



Yes. But you'll see it increase substantially with these new rules the Big Ten and Pac 12 plan on force feeding the rest of the Big Five.
Posted by Surd
Member since Jun 2013
52 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:30 pm to
Well, I'm a little biased. I started 4 years in small college football, where we actually did only spend about 20 (maybe 25) hours a week on football. I'm a huge fan of bringing the Student back into student-athlete, and would love to see most of the proposals passed.
Posted by Riseupfromtherubble
You'll Never Walk Alone
Member since Jun 2011
38380 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:31 pm to
quote:

decreased demands for student-athletes by nixing “voluntary” practices that circumvent the 20-hour rule


They can keep that pussy shite out west.
Posted by WonderWartHawg
Member since Dec 2010
10408 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:44 pm to
The best talent will still be in the SEC, regardless.
Posted by Kentucker
Cincinnati, KY
Member since Apr 2013
19351 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 6:59 pm to
The ACC distinguishes athletics from academics, as evidenced by admitting FSU and Louisville. They will be a firm ally of the SEC, as will most of the Big 12.

The Big X and the PAC will try to run things but won't succeed. They're simply outnumbered.
Posted by nebraskafaninwi
Member since Mar 2013
2655 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 7:26 pm to
quote:

The ACC distinguishes athletics from academics, as evidenced by admitting FSU and Louisville. They will be a firm ally of the SEC, as will most of the Big 12.


UNC is the political dictator of the ACC.
Posted by dcbl
Good guys wear white hats.
Member since Sep 2013
29712 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 7:52 pm to
The ACC sure as hell is one of the Big 5

Who the hell else would it be?

One good thing I see is that division IV would force Notre Dame to join the ACC full time or maybe even the B1G

I would like to see the big 12 bring in at least 2 teams if this happens - say boise and BYU - those are 2 programs that should have a seat at this table IMO
Posted by Kentucker
Cincinnati, KY
Member since Apr 2013
19351 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 8:58 pm to
quote:

UNC is the political dictator of the ACC.


Yes, and they are pro-athletics. They're the single reason Louisville was admitted. Now if it was Duke calling the shots...
Posted by Kentucker
Cincinnati, KY
Member since Apr 2013
19351 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 9:02 pm to
quote:

One good thing I see is that division IV would force Notre Dame to join the ACC full time or maybe even the B1G I would like to see the big 12 bring in at least 2 teams if this happens - say boise and BYU - those are 2 programs that should have a seat at this table IMO


I think ND would join the ACC. They despise the Big X.

Boise, yes. BYU? I don't know. They're the prima donna of the West. Could they and Texas co-exist?
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 6/2/14 at 9:03 pm to
quote:

BYU? I don't know. They're the prima donna of the West. Could they and Texas co-exist?


They're the only mid-major with an MNC to their name. BYU deserves to be in the Big Five, as does Boise State.

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