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re: Best defensive units in SEC per SECN
Posted on 8/9/23 at 11:29 pm to CelticTiger
Posted on 8/9/23 at 11:29 pm to CelticTiger
1) you do know that PFF does not get the playcalls.
2) you do know that PFF does not know the presnap and post snap adjustments.
3) you do know that PFF does not know the individual techniques taught at each school (they are most definitely not the same)
4) you do know that some of those reviews are with TV copy (not even all 22s).
And that ignores personal biases (Michael Jordan pushoffs. Greg Maddux's strike zones, etc..)
2) you do know that PFF does not know the presnap and post snap adjustments.
3) you do know that PFF does not know the individual techniques taught at each school (they are most definitely not the same)
4) you do know that some of those reviews are with TV copy (not even all 22s).
And that ignores personal biases (Michael Jordan pushoffs. Greg Maddux's strike zones, etc..)
0
Posted on 8/9/23 at 11:36 pm to meansonny
quote:
Where am I wrong?
The bigger question is where is PFF wrong. Anecdotally close to home for me, Nick Bolton had a score of 74.7 his senior year at Mizzou.
His PFF with the Chiefs last year was 75.7 (pretty consistent) in a year where he was 2nd in the league in solo tackles, 2nd in the league in assists and 4th in the league in interceptions among NFL linebackers. Had a pretty damn good SB as well.
In this instance it appears that his PFF score was an excellent measure of his performance.
Posted on 8/9/23 at 11:42 pm to CelticTiger
You needed PFF to tell you how good Bolton was?
Honestly, I would have assumed it was higher than that in college.
I don't follow the NFL other than to know that he tore it up as a rook.
If you want to lock on to PFF, then by all means.
But it is like using biblical references to an atheist in order to make a moral argument.
"Professionals" don't have any faith in it for the reasons that I listed.
Honestly, I would have assumed it was higher than that in college.
I don't follow the NFL other than to know that he tore it up as a rook.
If you want to lock on to PFF, then by all means.
But it is like using biblical references to an atheist in order to make a moral argument.
"Professionals" don't have any faith in it for the reasons that I listed.
Posted on 8/9/23 at 11:43 pm to lsufan1971
quote:
It’s a good thing Jimbo has lived up to the hype for your fan base. All those championships. I wish LSU would be competing like Aggie.
I didn't wanna upvote it but ... I had to upvote it.
A conscience thing.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:06 am to meansonny
quote:
You needed PFF to tell you how good Bolton was?
You missed the point on this one. Just demonstrating a positive correlation between his grade and his performance.
I’m not saying that PFF is the sole criteria to make personnel decisions, far from it. I am saying it is an attempt at ONE indicator to assess performance. You touted that your linebackers were 5-star guys. You think the Dawg coaches relied solely on that? I’m pretty sure they did not, yet you tout a 5-star ranking and dismiss PFF grades. Seems a little inconsistent to me.
I’ll take you at your word that you are an insider with the professionals and they’ve told you that they completely disregard the grades, but until someone comes up with a better way to rank subjective performance, I’ll take notice as apparently many sportswriters do.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:11 am to CelticTiger
quote:
I am saying it is an attempt at ONE indicator to assess performance
Sure. One indicator for fans.
quote:
You touted that your linebackers were 5-star guys.
Fair point.
The NFL draft is another.
Our non-starter linebackers are getting drafted in the first round.
Our 2 star WR/RB athletes who switch to linebackers as upperclassmen are getting drafted and starting in the NFL.
The 5 star reference was for athleticism (which is coveted by the NFL).
All starters since 2016 references the level of coaching and scheme taught at UGA.
Like I said... it isn't a knock on Mizzou.
It is ignoring the obvious about our linebackers.
I'd honestly put our linebackers ahead of our DBs. We are stacked with 3 NFL safeties (and the depth behind them is great for college). But we have question marks at CB. I wouldn't be shocked if we weren't top 3 or 4 in the SEC because of the questions at CB alone.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:48 am to CelticTiger
quote:
Missouri Tigers linebacker Chad Bailey leads all returning SEC players at his position with a grade of 84.2, followed by fellow Missouri Tiger Ty'ron Harper (77.4), LSU Tiger Harold Perkins (77.1), Arkansas Razorback Chris Paul Jr. (76.2), Texas A&M Aggie Jurriente Davis (75.3), Arkansas Razorback Jaheim Thomas (74.7), Alabama Crimson Tide Deontae Lawson (74.3), Florida Gator Mannie Nunnery (74.2), and Georgia Bulldog Jamon Dumas-Johnson (72.6).
Since we're using PFF
Top ten LBer units
They haven't released their secondary group rankings
But they have UGA at 1 on DL and 2 at LBer. Mizzou does crack their top ten at LBer.
This post was edited on 8/10/23 at 12:51 am
Posted on 8/10/23 at 7:10 am to CelticTiger
quote:
You laughing about those 4 points you crushed us by last year.
Mizzou played a great game last year against us, and very well could give us problems this year. But i think his laugh was in reference that the strength of our defense is actually our linebackers. It should be strong all over, but our LBs are particularly a strength.
I am not saying that our LBs are better than Mizzou...mainly because I am not really familiar with Mizzou's LB group. It just seems odd, though.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 7:55 am to CelticTiger
Dude just give up. Georgia fans still think a deer is what caused the tragic accident last year.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 8:25 am to DawgsLife
quote:
It just seems odd, though.
This originally was what I thought he was using as his sole criteria.
quote:
But i think his laugh was in reference that the strength of our defense is actually our linebackers. It should be strong all over, but our LBs are particularly a strength.
As we continued the discussion however, whether I ultimately agreed with him or not, he presented some grounded reasoning, and yes, I now understand his “lol” to be based on his perceived strength of the Georgia LBs rather than the weakness of MUs.
I don’t know who has the better linebackers for 2023 either. My point was simply with MU returning two guys with 2022’s highest PFF grades, the author wasn’t simply talking out his arse.
It seems too many base their opinions on the label (Mizzou) with little or no analysis. Sometimes we get a couple of position groups right, and those kids deserve recognition when we do.
(btw…for his edification, it’s not me downvoting him [except on the original lol of course]. I can appreciate a respectful discussion)
This post was edited on 8/10/23 at 8:31 am
Posted on 8/10/23 at 8:33 am to koreandawg
quote:
But they have UGA at 1 on DL and 2 at LBer. Mizzou does crack their top ten at LBer.
Objective evidence noted. Looks like they have MU at 7. Some respect at least.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 8:40 am to CelticTiger
quote:
You laughing about those 4 points you crushed us by last year.
You'll learn that if your team isn't UGA/Bama/LSU then they shouldn't be winning any best unit awards. They're very sensitive about that.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 8:44 am to gamecockman12
I said in the thread that I wouldn't be shocked if UGA was #3 or #4 for DBs.
We probably have 3 of the best safeties in the conference. But our corners either have limitations or no experience.
Linebacker at UGA is another story. It is the defensive equivalent to our tight end room on offense. It is crazy how much talent and how much success we have had at the linebacker position.
We probably have 3 of the best safeties in the conference. But our corners either have limitations or no experience.
Linebacker at UGA is another story. It is the defensive equivalent to our tight end room on offense. It is crazy how much talent and how much success we have had at the linebacker position.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 8:54 am to LSUstephen17
Too early to be drunk.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 11:53 am to meansonny
I think the UGA CBs will be fine as long as the EDGE problem last year is fixed. The latter was thin to begin with and then decimated by injury. Recruiting has hopefully shored up some of the depth, and the youngsters last year should hopefully come into their own this year. Hopefully the injury bug moves on. It is one reason I think the DL will be fine without a Carter in there. UGA desperately needed him demolishing double teams last year. With a stronger EDGE group this year, really good DL should help swallow the run game without having to be all-world in passing game. Also, I think Stackhouse is underrated.
With the offensive-minded rules in football holding sway, the best way to defend the passing game is to disrupt the QB. And with holding no longer a penalty it seems, I think slipperiness is a more useful trait than strength.
With the offensive-minded rules in football holding sway, the best way to defend the passing game is to disrupt the QB. And with holding no longer a penalty it seems, I think slipperiness is a more useful trait than strength.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:05 pm to PassingThrough
You just said that UGA would be fine at CB this year.
Look at our linebacker group.
Look at our safeties.
Look at our tight ends.
Look at our wide receivers.
None of those are going to be lumped in with a throw away word like "fine".
It is different. And that's exactly my point.
Lassiter is an excellent player.
But is he Deandre Baker?
Baker was the last #1 CB at UGA to run over a 4.45 forty time. That is a big ask for Lassiter (to essentially play the position perfect like Baker because he doesn't have the recovery speed of Stokes, Campbell, or Ringo).
We have that athleticism on the other side. But how long did it take Stokes to be Stokes? Campbell to be Campbell? And Ringo never fully mastered the position and his potential as a shut down corner.
Look at our linebacker group.
Look at our safeties.
Look at our tight ends.
Look at our wide receivers.
None of those are going to be lumped in with a throw away word like "fine".
It is different. And that's exactly my point.
Lassiter is an excellent player.
But is he Deandre Baker?
Baker was the last #1 CB at UGA to run over a 4.45 forty time. That is a big ask for Lassiter (to essentially play the position perfect like Baker because he doesn't have the recovery speed of Stokes, Campbell, or Ringo).
We have that athleticism on the other side. But how long did it take Stokes to be Stokes? Campbell to be Campbell? And Ringo never fully mastered the position and his potential as a shut down corner.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:06 pm to LSUstephen17
GA DB talent is insane.
That’s the ONLY part of the prognostication that is legitimate.
The rest is conjecture. We will see.
That’s the ONLY part of the prognostication that is legitimate.
The rest is conjecture. We will see.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:08 pm to CelticTiger
quote:
I don’t know who has the better linebackers for 2023 either. My point was simply with MU returning two guys with 2022’s highest PFF grades, the author wasn’t simply talking out his arse.
It'll be interesting to see how the season plays out. With us feeling like our LBs are a huge strength, it should make y'all feel really good about your LB situation...and rightfully so.
quote:I don't know why people down vote posts. That said, I can respect a down vote if the person sticks around to say why.....which you did. So....
(btw…for his edification, it’s not me downvoting him [except on the original lol of course]. I can appreciate a respectful discussion)
Posted on 8/10/23 at 12:39 pm to meansonny
Kendrick was pretty “slow”, but managed to do well enough knowing where he should be.
Like I said, with modern rules almost always favoring the offense, your best bet is to disrupt the passing game at the QB. The best DB can’t completely cover a good WR for more than a few seconds without getting a penalty in today’s game. Therefore, a defense’s best chance is to make a QB make a decision as quickly as you can.
Like I said, with modern rules almost always favoring the offense, your best bet is to disrupt the passing game at the QB. The best DB can’t completely cover a good WR for more than a few seconds without getting a penalty in today’s game. Therefore, a defense’s best chance is to make a QB make a decision as quickly as you can.
Posted on 8/10/23 at 1:01 pm to LSUstephen17
Honestly, I think Mizzou’s DB’s are the real stars.
Linebackers are outstanding but the back 5 are unreal. I’d be interested to see top3 at each group.
Linebackers are outstanding but the back 5 are unreal. I’d be interested to see top3 at each group.
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