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Howard Richards Speaks The Plain Truth.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 5:55 pm
Posted on 10/27/15 at 5:55 pm
LINK
Radio interview on 920 today.
Lays the OL problems on the players and (indirectly) the coaches.
Says if Mizzou is going to compete in the SEC they're going to have to step up recruiting.
Also talks Mauk and Lock.
Radio interview on 920 today.
Lays the OL problems on the players and (indirectly) the coaches.
Says if Mizzou is going to compete in the SEC they're going to have to step up recruiting.
Also talks Mauk and Lock.
This post was edited on 10/27/15 at 5:58 pm
Posted on 10/27/15 at 6:21 pm to Mizz-SEC
Good overview of our program.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 7:12 pm to Mizz-SEC
I don't recall any claims of recruiting not allowing us to "compete" the past two years. In fact, I recall most people saying GP made the star system look silly.
Not only that...."recruit better" is about the silliest thing people spout off. It's just not that simple.
People overreact to down years.
Not only that...."recruit better" is about the silliest thing people spout off. It's just not that simple.
People overreact to down years.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 7:41 pm to JesusQuintana
We hate to admit it but recruiting matters.
Yes Pinkel has done well with the talent on the roster, you can also state he has done exceptionally well on that regard but the reality is we do not have a national championship roster let alone a conference championship roster.
This is a fact validated through data analysis and not gut feeling or black and gold colored glasses. We will not be able to compete for more than the division with our current roster because we will always be overmatched from a "jimmies and joes" standpoint versus the champion of the SEC West.
Yes Pinkel has done well with the talent on the roster, you can also state he has done exceptionally well on that regard but the reality is we do not have a national championship roster let alone a conference championship roster.
This is a fact validated through data analysis and not gut feeling or black and gold colored glasses. We will not be able to compete for more than the division with our current roster because we will always be overmatched from a "jimmies and joes" standpoint versus the champion of the SEC West.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 8:31 pm to countrygrammar
We weren't overmatched in 2013. We just lost. It happens. That team was absolutely loaded with NFL talent and was NC caliber in my estimation.
NC caliber teams lose every year, but the difference is a lot of blue blood schools are going to have one 6-7 times in a decade and we MIGHT have 1. That's just reality.
Recruiting certainly matters, but there are several reasons we don't recruit top 5 classes regularly and most have nothing to do with the coaches. That's why its not just as simple as "recruit better"
The original point though was that we won't compete in the SEC unless we recruit better and that's patently false. It's already been proven. We just won't be at the top as regularly as most teams and there is little that can be done to change that outside of cheating our asses off. In fact, making it into the top grouping at all, let alone the regularity that we do, is almost a small miracle. The big difference in the SEC is the amount of schools that legitimately have a NC ceiling.
NC caliber teams lose every year, but the difference is a lot of blue blood schools are going to have one 6-7 times in a decade and we MIGHT have 1. That's just reality.
Recruiting certainly matters, but there are several reasons we don't recruit top 5 classes regularly and most have nothing to do with the coaches. That's why its not just as simple as "recruit better"
The original point though was that we won't compete in the SEC unless we recruit better and that's patently false. It's already been proven. We just won't be at the top as regularly as most teams and there is little that can be done to change that outside of cheating our asses off. In fact, making it into the top grouping at all, let alone the regularity that we do, is almost a small miracle. The big difference in the SEC is the amount of schools that legitimately have a NC ceiling.
This post was edited on 10/27/15 at 8:32 pm
Posted on 10/27/15 at 8:33 pm to countrygrammar
Agree that recruiting matters, but good luck convincing all these 4 and 5 star recruits to leave the South to come hundreds to miles up north from family and friends to Columbia.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 8:35 pm to JesusQuintana
Well said.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 10:34 pm to CRDNLSCHMCPSN11
quote:
Agree that recruiting matters, but good luck convincing all these 4 and 5 star recruits to leave the South to come hundreds to miles up north from family and friends to Columbia
I recognize the difficulties in recruiting the south with so many top tier football programs in a recruits backyard. But this idea that we should just accept our fate as an outpost that won't compete for high value targets is crazy to me. There are multiple ways to acquire talent outside of the Blue Blood formula.
Before James Franklin left he was working to bring in consecutive top 25 classes to Vanderbilt, that's right Vanderbilt. We watched Ole Miss change perception in 2 classes that put them in the national conversation to make them more attractive in the CFP picture as well as further recruiting.
In all honesty all we need is more classes similar to our 2015 classes that can put us in the 18-25 range year in and year out to take a drastic next step. To me that is a task that is doable.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 10:54 pm to JesusQuintana
quote:
We weren't overmatched in 2013. We just lost. It happens. That team was absolutely loaded with NFL talent and was NC caliber in my estimation.
We were a good team in 2013 no doubt but I would like you to revisit that SEC Championship game and specifically look at our D-Line vs their O-Line. I remember watching that game at the dome and seeing our D-Line 3-5 yds down the line of scrimmage due to us getting dominated at the line of scrimmage. Scheme played a part but Robinson & CO had a field day against our front 7.
quote:
Recruiting certainly matters, but there are several reasons we don't recruit top 5 classes regularly and most have nothing to do with the coaches. That's why its not just as simple as "recruit better"
Not asking for top 5 classes year in and year out but a 15-25 recruiting class a year will elevate us through our current ceiling.
quote:
We just won't be at the top as regularly as most teams and there is little that can be done to change that outside of cheating our asses off.
I will say this about "cheating", and I will say this based on what I know. Everyone does it to an extent. I have seen guys at multiple schools get dapped up and walk away with thousands. I have seen guys get Visa gift cards and pre paid debit cards. That's just apart of the game. So recognizing that is already on the table we have to ask what are the other variables that account for the lack of our recruiting abilities.
Outside a friend of mine from Georgia whose brother is a 4 star with an offer I don't have the ability to talk to guys I know with commitable offers like I did back in the day. I will reach out to some friends and see why we are still not desirable after back 2 back East titles.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 11:12 pm to countrygrammar
quote:Do you mind sharing some of this? Would be interested in seeing it.
This is a fact validated through data analysis
Posted on 10/27/15 at 11:21 pm to countrygrammar
I remember the 2013 championship game quite well. It's the one in which instead of playing the scheme we had played all year we scrapped it entirely with 1 week to prepare. Our DL was not at a mismatch whatsoever. In fact, our entire two deep (sans Hoch who was a good college player) either was drafted, will be drafted or signed as a UDFA. Including a 1st round pick, two second round picks (Brantley and Augusta TBD) and two SEC defensive POY.
The defensive staff blew that game plain and simple. Again, we were more than good enough to win. We just didn't.
As for recruiting. Cheating...yeah, everyone probably does some of it but In willing to bet that our bagmen do not have as big of pockets as the vast majority of the league.
That aside, is it really that hard to figure out why we are "not desirable"?
Our stadium is in the bottom half of the league, facilities, fanbase, budget, in state talent, history...all the same. So it's no surprise that's where we end up in recruiting. In the SEC a top 25 national recruiting class is still going to be outside the top 10 in the league.
There is a reason that the same handful of teams win every year. CFB is the most uneven playing field in all of sports, and it's only getting more so. It's ALMOST impossible to break through for a program not in that grouping. We damn near did it twice under Pinkel but we fell just short.
The defensive staff blew that game plain and simple. Again, we were more than good enough to win. We just didn't.
As for recruiting. Cheating...yeah, everyone probably does some of it but In willing to bet that our bagmen do not have as big of pockets as the vast majority of the league.
That aside, is it really that hard to figure out why we are "not desirable"?
Our stadium is in the bottom half of the league, facilities, fanbase, budget, in state talent, history...all the same. So it's no surprise that's where we end up in recruiting. In the SEC a top 25 national recruiting class is still going to be outside the top 10 in the league.
There is a reason that the same handful of teams win every year. CFB is the most uneven playing field in all of sports, and it's only getting more so. It's ALMOST impossible to break through for a program not in that grouping. We damn near did it twice under Pinkel but we fell just short.
Posted on 10/27/15 at 11:47 pm to Tigersessed
Posted on 10/28/15 at 8:22 am to JesusQuintana
quote:
Not only that...."recruit better" is about the silliest thing people spout off. It's just not that simple
But that is pretty much what Don James told him to do while they were golfing one day
Posted on 10/28/15 at 8:48 am to JesusQuintana
quote:
I don't recall any claims of recruiting not allowing us to "compete" the past two years. In fact, I recall most people saying GP made the star system look silly.
Not only that...."recruit better" is about the silliest thing people spout off. It's just not that simple.
People overreact to down years.
This ^. Everyone is just overreacting to a bad season where everything seems to be going wrong.
As for winning championships...winning is a habit. So is losing. Once you do something once, as a program, it is much easier to do it again. You see it at every level, especially in HS. The same HS's win year after year...and it isn't because they have better athletes. They might have better coaching, but the law of averages says they should go down sometimes.
But that doesn't happen. Winning is a habit.
Missouri will never be a Top 10 recruiting class school. Sorry. Not going to happen. Our best is snagging a few 5 stars of home state, and then find the diamonds in the rough.
But a bowl game is absolutely critical. THAT is something you can bank on. No recruit wants to go to a school that doesn't make a bowl every year. 2012 was devastating. Have to make a bowl.
Posted on 10/28/15 at 9:18 am to JesusQuintana
I respectfully disagree that "we just are what we are"...
Recruiting is about relationships and from my perspective one of the biggest missteps by the program is not hiring individuals that are either younger or with more established resources in our new footprint.
There was a reason Vanderbilt was able to recruit talent to Nashville. There is a reason Hugh Freeze gets talent to Oxford and it ain't just because of their history, facilities, and budget.
Honestly you have to truly commit to be competitive and allocating a young brother that can go into the Muck or Liberty City or the SWATs and help identify what Pinkel is looking for is a start.
Another issue I hear is that outside our natural recruiting area is it takes a long time for Mizzou to offer prospects. I don't know if their evaluation program is that robust that it takes a ridiculous amount of time but you are already at a disadvantage when you begin to establish that relationship.
I acknowledged that scheme played a part and that we had a good team but the reality is we were beat at the line of scrimmage. Multiple times Ealy and Ray were pushed to the sideline in one on one match ups against the LT. In that 3-3-5 look our NT did not demand the double team which made flow to the ball carrier impossible due to their OG's and pulling OT's to get to the second level easily. They engaged with our DL and it was over, Mason would reach the back end with Gaines and company making most of the tackles. That doesn't mean we didnt have NFL players, it just means we got beat. The same way we beat A&Ms first rounders on their O-Line with our prowess, sometimes teams get beat.
Recruiting is about relationships and from my perspective one of the biggest missteps by the program is not hiring individuals that are either younger or with more established resources in our new footprint.
There was a reason Vanderbilt was able to recruit talent to Nashville. There is a reason Hugh Freeze gets talent to Oxford and it ain't just because of their history, facilities, and budget.
Honestly you have to truly commit to be competitive and allocating a young brother that can go into the Muck or Liberty City or the SWATs and help identify what Pinkel is looking for is a start.
Another issue I hear is that outside our natural recruiting area is it takes a long time for Mizzou to offer prospects. I don't know if their evaluation program is that robust that it takes a ridiculous amount of time but you are already at a disadvantage when you begin to establish that relationship.
quote:
I remember the 2013 championship game quite well. It's the one in which instead of playing the scheme we had played all year we scrapped it entirely with 1 week to prepare. Our DL was not at a mismatch whatsoever. In fact, our entire two deep (sans Hoch who was a good college player) either was drafted, will be drafted or signed as a UDFA. Including a 1st round pick, two second round picks (Brantley and Augusta TBD) and two SEC defensive POY.
I acknowledged that scheme played a part and that we had a good team but the reality is we were beat at the line of scrimmage. Multiple times Ealy and Ray were pushed to the sideline in one on one match ups against the LT. In that 3-3-5 look our NT did not demand the double team which made flow to the ball carrier impossible due to their OG's and pulling OT's to get to the second level easily. They engaged with our DL and it was over, Mason would reach the back end with Gaines and company making most of the tackles. That doesn't mean we didnt have NFL players, it just means we got beat. The same way we beat A&Ms first rounders on their O-Line with our prowess, sometimes teams get beat.
Posted on 10/28/15 at 9:24 am to countrygrammar
quote:Thanks, I'll check them out tonight.
Here are some SB Nation Links that did a data dive:
Posted on 10/28/15 at 9:33 am to countrygrammar
You can disagree all you like but it's reality.
Ole Miss is a good example of how to overcome it. You cheat your arse off. It will catch up with them eventually. They already got a taste of it this year with Tunsil. Treadwell posted a picture on Instagram after he signed with Ole Miss holding about 20k in cash. Why would a 5* WR out of IL go to Ole Miss? He really likes Beavers?
Ole Miss is a good example of how to overcome it. You cheat your arse off. It will catch up with them eventually. They already got a taste of it this year with Tunsil. Treadwell posted a picture on Instagram after he signed with Ole Miss holding about 20k in cash. Why would a 5* WR out of IL go to Ole Miss? He really likes Beavers?
This post was edited on 10/28/15 at 9:37 am
Posted on 10/28/15 at 9:42 am to Mizz-SEC
Mizzou's 2015 class was pretty good no?
Problem is Missouri doesn't produce 4/5 star products out of high school every year. They are at a huge disadvantage to schools in Alabama, Georgia, Florida, and Texas.
Problem is Missouri doesn't produce 4/5 star products out of high school every year. They are at a huge disadvantage to schools in Alabama, Georgia, Florida, and Texas.
Posted on 10/28/15 at 9:53 am to TigerCruise
Recruiting better doesn't necessarily mean just getting 4 & 5 star recruits.
When Butch Davis rebuilt Miami in the late '90's he did both getting his share of elite recruits with a bunch of the type of guys Mizzou recruits. Included among those are players like Clinton Portis that weren't hardly being recruited. His 2000 or 2001 team had over 40 guys drafted.
Mizzou's Dline is a great example. There are several 4 star guys, but Harris, Brady, & Frazier were all 2 star or less out of high school.
When Butch Davis rebuilt Miami in the late '90's he did both getting his share of elite recruits with a bunch of the type of guys Mizzou recruits. Included among those are players like Clinton Portis that weren't hardly being recruited. His 2000 or 2001 team had over 40 guys drafted.
Mizzou's Dline is a great example. There are several 4 star guys, but Harris, Brady, & Frazier were all 2 star or less out of high school.
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