re: 2018 Recruiting Thread: Sprint to NSD.

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We had 6 guys in that class when he was hired. He signed 15. So you agree it was his class? Good to know.

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I generally try to stay out of your recruiting thread (some things should be reasonably sacred) but I'm really lost on this one. I was sure that I was told that Kirby's first class was really Mark Richt's... Regardless of the fact that he had to essentially rerecruit all of them (save maybe Cleveland, who was pretty locked in).

To the both of you: Their classes would have looked/been different had they actually been on campus the entire year.

McElwain was in mop up duty, trying to get whoever he could and the class was awash.

Is it HIS fault that it was awash because the man before him didn't recruit more than 6 players and he was left scurrying to get whatever he could? Of course not. It's Muschamp's fault that the class was wrecked, he lost the games, he failed to manage the roster, he was fired.

I've always maintained: Kirby should get neither praise nor guilt over that class. He didn't recruit Eason (for instance), and it's not his fault that Fromm is playing better than Eason. It's not his great capacity as a coach that Eason is playing better, either, though. That's just how the cookie crumbles sometimes -- guys have different minds for the position.

It's a lot more nuanced than you want to look into it, TJ, which is why it's hard to actually debate you. Everything is black and white, you only use numbers when they're on your side. Yards gained per game is more important than wins, if it's wins, they have to be the right wins -- the wins that you deem important. LSU (last year), Georgia (last year and the year before), Ole Miss, Iowa and Tennessee his first year were pretty decent wins for what was left. For you, it's not. Simply isn't. You always say ''no notable wins'' when clearly there are quite a few, a good step up from what we had before. How many notable wins did Muschamp have in his last two years before getting the boot?

tl;dr: You can't be responsible for something you only took part in 1/12th or even 1/6th of the time.

How many pages in the recruiting thread must this go on???

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Straw... you are literally unable to give Smart credit for anything.

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bullshite. See below.

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He's recruiting has been top notch since he arrived.

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He has, but that's not new to Georgia. He's not doing anything much differently. If recruiting a few slots above the average 8th recruiting class that they've enjoyed for five years before he came, forgive me for not being astounded.

Good/Great recruiting at Georgia didn't show up out of no where.

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It's taken McElwain a couple of tries to get his bearings, and we all know it. Things SEEM better now, looking at the 2018 and 2019 classes and how they are progressing.

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Don't you think leaving the entire football program in shambles by Muschamp had a lot to do with recruiting?

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You can't just be absolved of responsibility because the scenario you come into is less than ideal. You do the best with what you have. Mac did a good job salvaging what he could in 2015. Kirby did a good job keeping a strong 2016 class together and even adding to it.

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...Yes, yes you can. ''Less than ideal'' isn't where we were. The roster was fricked, we were near the last in offense for five years when McElwain stepped on campus. It's not like these problems weren't here when he came.

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You can't just be absolved of responsibility because the scenario you come into is less than ideal. You do the best with what you have. Mac did a good job salvaging what he could in 2015. Kirby did a good job keeping a strong 2016 class together and even adding to it.

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Color me shocked that a coach at Georgia managed to recruit well. It's amazing. Spectacular.

Kind of average, since that's been a staple of Georgia football for half a decade.

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They both deserve praise for that, and yes, if some of those players don't work out, they deserve some of the responsibility too, because they are the current head coaches and those are their players and it's their job to develop them.

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Some is acceptable -- but what you're asking is for me to say: Kirby winning with 17 starters that he didn't scout, recruit or get commitments from is the sign of great coaching.

Running 80% of time with two players that he didn't do that with -- genius.

I mean, Kirby may very well be a good coach but it would be outlandishly difficult to not be successful at Georgia with a well-managed roster. Outside of OL (and ours was far, far worse than Georgia's when McElwain came. Many of them will say no, but it's not even debatable. Their C had more starts and games under his belt than our entire line combined) their team had very few real deficiencies. In fact, they were better recruited and managed at every offensive position.

This conversation is pretty much over, and I don't know why we have to go 'round and 'round. Kirby is making a program that was decent look good.

McElwain is taking a once-was garbage program and winning 10 games with it, and now a team that was basically gutted before it started and at least managing to make us look serviceable. That we outgained Alabama and held A&M to less yards with essentially a skeleton-crew is disregarded here, there's no praise to be heard of just because we couldn't get our green quarterback to march it down the field without his top three wide receivers.

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Latest updates on recruiting to get us back on track:

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I think we do actually need to put more attention on the defense -- the only problem is that we're returning almost the entire defense next year, which means next year will probably be when we fill those needs.

At safety, even if Harris doesn't get a Grey Shirt (I'm unsure of his status at this point), any one of the underclassman safeties will step in his place anyway. At CB we've got our numbers for at least two years on the outside, inside we'll see but Henderson and Wilson are the real deal.

At Linebacker, while we're still thin at the position we literally don't have an upperclassman starting. Moon, Reese and Joseph are all sophomores. Really we're recruiting backups.

DE is fine for at least another year.

DT is really the only place where we need bodies -- if Richerd Desir-Jones is permitted to return to the team, it will help a shite-ton with depth at the very least.

On offense it looks like they're putting a lot of emphasis on the O-Line and Receiver positions. Go Gators, hope we beat Georgia.

Oh, more turbulence? That's why I hate flying

It is going to be important to have a new coach named as soon as possible...but with coaches still at their schools...its impossible to name them...and you would think we will get a coach who has a bowl game and our new coach will have to be named after the regular season is over, if the old school allows him to coach the bowl game that is ok...as long as we can name him at conclusion of season.

A coaches old school will not want to pay him if he is recruiting for UF between end of season and bowl game and they will want staff recruiting for them of course.

Corrals commitment seems to be stronger than initially thought for y'all.

I think Copeland and Chase sign elsewhere, however.

Sailor, anyone we hire will be going to be in a bowl game unless 1) school cuts ties to let him leave 2) he decides to leave anyway....not likely. A lot depends on their contract. I don't foresee a new coach on campus in early December but hope I'm wrong.

Some coaches have worked out deals to allow them to p/t recruit for their new school as long as they dedicate a lot of energy towards their current school. I believe the UL AD was fired (basketball scandal), so Petrino has a brand new AD...more reason to leave. UL is a basketball school like UK and I'm sure Petrino is ready to be top dog in funding and resources.