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re: Auburn in NFL draft 2023: Any top 100 picks?
Posted on 5/2/23 at 10:20 am to jangalang
Posted on 5/2/23 at 10:20 am to jangalang
Ahh, I see laughing at your friend has made you antsy as well.
Please show me where I've ever argued that Tank is better than Hunter. I think Hunter was the better of the two backs the past two seasons and was woefully underused. So not really sure what you're on about other than you usual Jang schtick.
Please show me where I've ever argued that Tank is better than Hunter. I think Hunter was the better of the two backs the past two seasons and was woefully underused. So not really sure what you're on about other than you usual Jang schtick.
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Posted on 5/2/23 at 10:37 am to jangalang
quote:
I provided stats that show Tank isn’t even elite enough to be best on last year’s team. Is there a skill or an attribute that makes Tank elite?
Hunter had a better YAC and Broken Tackles percentage. Even if Tank is elite there there is no drop off.
Again, you are comparing a backup to a starter. What you are describing isn't in any way unique. I'm pretty sure that Texas' #2 RB had a better YAC than Bijan Robinson did this past season. He was also drafted pretty high, but that doesn't mean that he's "better".
Would you not expect the guy who gets nearly half as many touches to be fresher? More able to power through hits? It's almost as if it's a bit easier to scheme plays for the #2 guy as well.
This shite gets beaten to death almost every season at Auburn. When Ben Tate was the guy, half the fanbase was convinced that Mario Fannin was better. Do you remember Tristan Davis? He spent his entire career as the mythical unicorn who "should have been the starter" lol.
Let's take a quick peek at 2017:
Kerryon Johnson: 4.9 YPC
Kam Martin: 6.1 YPC
Even if you look at the legendary 2013 offense:
Tre Mason: 5.7 YPC
Cameron Artis-Payne: 6.7 YPC
Anyway, Jarquez Hunter may very well prove to be better than Tank was, but to pretend like that has been concluded is asinine. Tank has real flaws: he is not a disciplined runner and he made far too many poor reads. However, the kid had to eat absolute shite his entire time at Auburn. Comparing him to previous backs/offenses is pointless. Did you really bring up Artis-Payne's season playing beside Nick Marshall with Sammie Coates and D'haquille Williams at WR lol? These seasons are incomparable.
The whole point is that Tank was a really good player who was playing on some of the absolute worst offenses in recent Auburn history (literally zero talent anywhere), and he actually gets crap from AU fans because what, he didn't break 15 tackles on every run? Meanwhile those same fans have spent the last 2-3 seasons slurping up guys like Landen King who accomplished literally nothing. The NFL just concluded that Tank is in fact a very good player. I hope that Jarquez can prove to be as good or better, but lets be real: it will be a big win for Hunter to get drafted in the 3rd round. I'm pretty sure that over the past 5 NFL Drafts, there have been a whopping ~5 RB's total drafted 1st Round.
Posted on 5/2/23 at 10:42 am to jangalang
quote:
I provided stats that show Tank isn’t even elite enough to be best on last year’s team. Hunter had a better YAC and Broken Tackles percentage. Even if Tank is elite there there is no drop off.
Hunter will end up in the league as well assuming he doesn't get hurt or something. Change of pace/number 2 backs very often have higher per carry stats than the starter. We are spoiled at RB - if you start at AU, you end up getting a shot in the league and it's the only position we seem to consistently "reload" at. If only we had other positions where that was the case, watching AU football would be a much more consistent experience.
quote:I would argue that Tank is a complete back in that he doesn't have a "weak" aspect to him, but isn't going to be a top NFL guy at any particular thing. A generic rotational 1 cut NFL back which is definitionally an elite college back.
Is there a skill or an attribute that makes Tank elite?
In other words, I don't expect him to be a game breaker in the league, but he's good enough to get carries, and any college team would be more than happy to have a NFL running back playing for them.
quote:I'd say yes. There are guys who are just on another level in college and are more of a once every decade or two players at their position, though that isn't a guarantee of NFL success.
Is there like an ultra elite?
Caddy
Cam
Fairley
G Robinson
D Brown
etc...
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 10:50 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 10:47 am to IAmNERD
quote:
I never saw that, but what's so funny is you're constantly wrong on evaluating football players. You're Gatewood fan club leadership cemented that a few years ago.
Yeah, so wrong you have to go back 4 years ago to find one instance. Look nerd, don’t be mad at me you got constant swirlies and wedgies during high school.
Posted on 5/2/23 at 10:56 am to ALhunter
quote:
Is there like an ultra elite?
quote:
I'd say yes.
Ok. Well then how I define elite isnt the issue. It's actually you. There is elite and then there are tiers down the ladder. I cannot possibly know all the tiers above elite if you feel it necessary to go any further.
Tank can get included with Charbonnet or Devon Achane, but not someone like Gibbs that draws comparisons to Kamara.
Same for Kerryon. He can be included with talents like Guice, (coincendentally both loved the video games and did phenomenal in 2017) however he really isnt on the same level as a Nick Chubb. He never had the homerun ability for that.
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 11:01 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:00 am to metafour
quote:
Did you really bring up Artis-Payne's season playing beside Nick Marshall with Sammie Coates and D'haquille Williams at WR lol? These seasons are incomparable.
Did you miss where I said I would not call CAP elite. Youre so silly.
quote:
Let's take a quick peek at 2017:
Kerryon Johnson: 4.9 YPC
Kam Martin: 6.1 YPC
I implore you: dont be an idiot. Martin did well in the nonconference cupcakes. Hunter could outshine Tank on any given day and often did so.
Check the early disparity over a five game sample size when Hunter was only a true freshman.
quote:
The Auburn run game is led by freshman Jarquez Hunter (42 carries, 447 yards) and Tank Bigsby (74-430), while Nix has tucked it 25 times and has 133 yards from the quarterback position.”
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 11:09 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:07 am to jangalang
quote:If you can't differentiate between an elite player and a generational talent or a heisman candidate, that's on you. Players drafted in the first few rounds are definitionally elite college players.
Ok. Well then how I define elite isnt the issue. It's actually you. There is elite and then there are tiers down the ladder. I cannot possibly know all the tiers above elite if you feel it necessary to go any further.
Tank can get included with Charbonnet or Devon Achane, but not someone like Gibbs that draws comparisons to Kamara.
Same for Kerryon. He can be included with talents like Guice, (coincendentally both loved the video games and did phenomenal in 2017) however he really isnt on the same level as a Nick Chubb. He never had the homerun ability for that.
For example, a four star HS player is elite. Five star players still exist and there are still top 10 players that are even more elite than a five star. Then you have a guy like Clowney who was so good at the high school level that he would probably be drafted straight to the NFL if it was allowed.
Multi millionaires are definitionally elite. Billionaires are even more elite and then you have guys like Bill Gates, Elon Musk, and Jeff Bezos who are on an entirely different level from even normal billionaires. Just because you have difficulty differentiating between levels of elite, doesn't mean that all of us do.
I'm actually baffled that this is difficult to grasp.
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 11:11 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:12 am to ALhunter
quote:
If you can't differentiate between an elite player and a generational talent or a heisman candidate, that's on you.
I think it is fricking stupid to have semantics in category above elite. There is no cant nor could to it. Youre like my wife :No, I love you the mostest". "No, I do!"
They are either haves or have nots. A third round guy is a mixed bucket. Great shot the guy is a have, and another shot that he is a have not. See Kerryon. See Johnathon Taylor. They are not one and the same.
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 11:14 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:20 am to jangalang
quote:
I think it is fricking stupid to have semantics in category above elite. There is no cant nor could to it. Youre like my wife :No, I love you the mostest". "No, I do!"
They are either haves or have nots. A third round guy is a mixed bucket. Great shot the guy is a have, and another shot that he is a have not. See Kerryon. See Johnathon Taylor. They are not one and the same.
Elite: "a select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group or society"
Are the top 100 players in college football superior to other college football players or no? There are over 120 division 1 teams so that's less than 1 guy per team.
I can't help with your marital issues my guy... you may think it's stupid but that doesn't change facts and there is certainly differentiation even among elite athletes. Michael Jordan is the all time greatest basketball player, doesn't mean others aren't elite.
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 11:30 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:24 am to jangalang
quote:Ooof... this doesn't prove what you think it does. Hunter had a 94 yard touchdown run in garbage time against Alabama State when we were up by 50 points. That's precisely the type of situation where second string backs pad stats and leads to skewed per carry stats that mislead people.
Check the early disparity over a five game sample size when Hunter was only a true freshman.
quote:
The Auburn run game is led by freshman Jarquez Hunter (42 carries, 447 yards) and Tank Bigsby (74-430), while Nix has tucked it 25 times and has 133 yards from the quarterback position.”
Again - I think Jarquez is really good and probably ends up in the league. Would be great if he goes in the third round. Doesn't take away from Tank though or mean Tank wasn't elite as well. Ronnie Brown had higher YPC that Caddy....
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 11:28 am
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:30 am to ALhunter
quote:
lite: "a select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group or society"
Are the top 100 players in college football superior to other college football players or no?
Well hell, 247 rankings such as the Top 247 is suddenly applicable.
quote:
Are the top 100 players in college football superior to other college football players or no?
Not every class is draft eligible and using the draft to call him a top 100 player is the wrong metric. Sure, he is probably RB2 level on the team, and possibly one of the better backs in the SEC, but there is usually some air between superiority between the elite- and fringier backs like Achane...Kerryon
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:34 am to jangalang
quote:OK let's look at it technically then.
Not every class is draft eligible and using the draft to call him a top 100 player is the wrong metric. Sure, he is probably RB2 level on the team, and possibly one of the better backs in the SEC, but there is usually some air between superiority between the elite- and fringier backs like Achane...Kerryon
Would you consider the top 1.5% of a group "a select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group or society" or no?
By the numbers
FBS Teams 133
Players 85
Junior/RS Soph or Above 51
Draft Eligible Players 6,783
First 3 Rounds 102
Percentile 1st 3 Rounds 1.5%
Posted on 5/2/23 at 11:55 am to ALhunter
True cream of the crop RBs were drafted in the top 12 picks. There is a clear difference in demand between the top and the next tier down. It’s evident.
The 1.5% percent stuff you’re doing is retarded.
The 1.5% percent stuff you’re doing is retarded.
Posted on 5/2/23 at 12:29 pm to ALhunter
quote:
Ooof... this doesn't prove what you think it does. Hunter had a 94 yard touchdown run in garbage time against Alabama State when we were up by 50 points.
In said 5 game sample size he also outperformed Tank as a true freshman against LSU.
So stop coming at me with the Kam Martin bullshite like Martin would ever outplay our RB1
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 12:33 pm
Posted on 5/2/23 at 12:39 pm to jangalang
Hunter also squats 600 plus pounds in cowboy boots.
Kam Martin
Get The frick Outta Here
Kam Martin
Get The frick Outta Here
Posted on 5/2/23 at 1:12 pm to jangalang
quote:Would you call the top 1.5% of a population elite or not? Simple question.
The 1.5% percent stuff you’re doing is retarded.
Now math and stats are retarded because they frustrate you and cowboy boot squats define elite? What am I reading
You have good takes sometimes and always have an opinion... but digging your heels in on this one is starting to look silly.
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 1:20 pm
Posted on 5/2/23 at 1:29 pm to ALhunter
quote:Same variables or criteria…. Sure.
Would you call the top 1.5% of a population elite or not? Simple question.
The day when I figure out there is a subsection of the 1.5 that stand out above the rest of the group will be the the day a new class will stand on its own.
quote:
You have good takes sometimes and always have an opinion... but digging your heels in on this one is starting to look silly.
I’m not the one calling top 100 players elite just because they were once considered top 100 nevermind the many variables at play. I’m not the one saying Tank is elite when in reality, he wasn’t.
Posted on 5/2/23 at 1:41 pm to jangalang
quote:Awesome then Tank is an elite college football player per NFL evaluators.
Same variables or criteria…. Sure.
quote:Now you're creating an ultra-elite, which I thought was what your wife does and you get upset about it? You're going in circles.
The day when I figure out there is a subsection of the 1.5 that stand out above the rest of the group will be the the day a new class will stand on its own.
quote:Last week. People who make a living evaluating player talent made this determination last week.
I’m not the one calling top 100 players elite just because they were once considered top 100 nevermind the many variables at play. I’m not the one saying Tank is elite when in reality, he wasn’t.
This post was edited on 5/2/23 at 1:43 pm
Posted on 5/2/23 at 1:45 pm to ALhunter
quote:
Now you're creating an ultra-elite. You're going in circles.
No. The standards just changed.
Is the elite OL from 1970 going to be elite today?
Posted on 5/2/23 at 1:51 pm to ALhunter
quote:
Last week. People who make a living evaluating player talent made this determination last week.
I’ve heard this in rebuttal quite a bit yet my batting average is doing well so far.
Ball is looking fat and I’m hitting it.
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