re: Non-Sports: Gun Bill Would Curb U.S. Firearm Laws in Arkansas

quote:

---

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

---

Key phrase right there.

The government will get us under the table with ammo taxes and such before they actually get serious about taking our guns.

There is talk of a 500% increase of taxes on ammunition. They will get us with small steps, hi cap clips, ammo cost, etc, and then go for the actual gun controls.

quote:

---

How is 'the people' a well regulated militia?

---

If you don't know, the you are the one who needs to educate yourself. I would start with the Federalist papers. The writings of Alexander Hamilton and Thomas Jefferson will also be helpful. Here is an excerpt from the Militia Act. You might want to educate yourself on the founding fathers' definition of "well regulated."

The Militia Act of 1792, Passed May 8, 1792, providing federal standards for the organization of the Militia.

An ACT more effectually to provide for the National Defence, by establishing an Uniform Militia throughout the United States.

I. Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America, in Congress assembled, That each and every free able-bodied white male citizen of the respective States, resident therein, who is or shall be of age of eighteen years, and under the age of forty-five years (except as is herein after excepted) shall severally and respectively be enrolled in the militia, by the Captain or Commanding Officer of the company, within whose bounds such citizen shall reside, and that within twelve months after the passing of this Act. And it shall at all time hereafter be the duty of every such Captain or Commanding Officer of a company, to enroll every such citizen as aforesaid, and also those who shall, from time to time, arrive at the age of 18 years, or being at the age of 18 years, and under the age of 45 years (except as before excepted) shall come to reside within his bounds; and shall without delay notify such citizen of the said enrollment, by the proper non-commissioned Officer of the company, by whom such notice may be proved. That every citizen, so enrolled and notified, shall, within six months thereafter, provide himself with a good musket or firelock, a sufficient bayonet and belt, two spare flints, and a knapsack, a pouch, with a box therein, to contain not less than twenty four cartridges, suited to the bore of his musket or firelock, each cartridge to contain a proper quantity of powder and ball; or with a good rifle, knapsack, shot-pouch, and powder-horn, twenty balls suited to the bore of his rifle, and a quarter of a pound of powder; and shall appear so armed, accoutred and provided, when called out to exercise or into service, except, that when called out on company days to exercise only, he may appear without a knapsack. That the commissioned Officers shall severally be armed with a sword or hanger, and espontoon; and that from and after five years from the passing of this Act, all muskets from arming the militia as is herein required, shall be of bores sufficient for balls of the eighteenth part of a pound; and every citizen so enrolled, and providing himself with the arms, ammunition and accoutrements, required as aforesaid, shall hold the same exempted from all suits, distresses, executions or sales, for debt or for the payment of taxes.

quote:

---

Ok. I think that giant paragraph about muskets and gunpowder is a little out dated.

---

Well, if it is not worth the time and effort to read and understand, don't worry about it.

I'm sorry, but the Militia Act of 1792 is completely irrelevant in today's world. Are you seriously suggesting otherwise?

It calls for free, able-bodied white males to enroll with a Captain/CO of their local militia. The United States of today is so totally different from what it was in 1792--trying to apply those prescriptions to our country today is just ludicrous.

That's a reeeaallly big reach.

edit: BRB I need to go enroll with my local militia and get a flintlock, since I'm appropriately aged, able-bodied, and not dark-skinned.

The Supremacy Clause does not invalidate the Bill of Rights which includes the 2nd Amendment. In adddition, no law is meaningful unless the government can use it's police power to enforce it. When you have that many states outright opposing a law I question how the Feds will successfully enforce it. They don't have enough US Marshalls, FBI, ATF, etc.... to cover it without cooperation from the states. It will be interesting to see it unfold, hopefully we won't have to become active participants.

I anticipate we'll see something akin to AR's point, the laws that result will require stricter licensing and transparency and be much more expensive. JMHO, guess we'll see how it shakes out.

quote:

---

It will be interesting to see it unfold, hopefully we won't have to become active participants.

I anticipate we'll see something akin to AR's point, the laws that result will require stricter licensing and transparency and be much more expensive. JMHO, guess we'll see how it shakes out.

---

Good points all around. I don't think that any laws like this will get passed, because I don't think that a majority of Arkansas legislators will want to become active participants in something like that, even with the new makeup of the Ark Leg.

To me introducing something like this is just something to bring back to your base, even if you don't get it past committee. You can campaign that you were for a lost cause.

Anyway, the whole argument is framed in a bad way. Most gun owners feel like they're being implicated for gun deaths. They shouldn't be, and even my bleeding heart knows that. Guns are here to stay, so the argument is one that won't get us anywhere. The discussion should be about how we can reduce the numbers of gun deaths and how we can make sure that only certified and responsible people have access to firearms. Having a pissing contest about the intentions of the founding fathers isn't going to solve that problem, really.

Stop being obtuse. You wanted to know what they meant by "well-regulated militia" and you got it.

quote:

---

Does anyone else think that the firearms debate is a red herring to take attention away from other issues?

---

YUP

Thanks cuz, well stated.