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re: OT: Alabama Coronavirus Thread (see link in OP for case numbers and death totals in AL)
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:01 pm to TidalSurge1
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:01 pm to TidalSurge1
quote:
The biggest procrastination failure was not promptly shutting down all international airline and cruiseship travel to/from the U.S. It's not that hard or costly to do, compared to trying to keep it from spreading after its infected people within our country. The virus probably could've been kept out of the U.S.
Look at the timeline I posted on the last page. How could we have known to shut down the country when China was reporting for a month that this thing wasn't transmittable from human to human?
ETA:
quote:
January 1: The Wuhan Public Security Bureau issued summons to Dr. Li Wenliang, accusing him of “spreading rumors.” Two days later, at a police station, Dr. Li signed a statement acknowledging his “misdemeanor” and promising not to commit further “unlawful acts.” Seven other people are arrested on similar charges and their fate is unknown.
Also that day, “after several batches of genome sequence results had been returned to hospitals and submitted to health authorities, an employee of one genomics company received a phone call from an official at the Hubei Provincial Health Commission, ordering the company to stop testing samples from Wuhan related to the new disease and destroy all existing samples.”
According to a New York Times study of cellphone data from China, 175,000 people leave Wuhan that day. According to global travel data research firm OAG, 21 countries have direct flights to Wuhan. In the first quarter of 2019 for comparison, 13,267 air passengers traveled from Wuhan, China, to destinations in the United States, or about 4,422 per month. The U.S. government would not bar foreign nationals who had traveled to China from entering the country for another month.
Let that sink in. 175,000 people left Wuhan on January 1st. One month after the first reported case.
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 1:04 pm
2
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:05 pm to TideSaint
We did very well considering the information we were getting from China and WHO. Hard to know what you’re dealing with when you aren’t getting truthful information. Again, Trump was labeled as racist when he stopped flights from China.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:07 pm to TideSaint
quote:Why trust the Chinese, given the risk and potential consequences.
How could we have known to shut down the country when China was reporting for a month that this thing wasn't transmittable from human to human?
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:10 pm to TidalSurge1
quote:
Why trust the Chinese? The risk was too huge to do that.
How could we "trust" something they weren't reporting on a global level?
They shut down all internal discussions about the virus between medical personnel. Hell, they arrested at least 8 doctors telling colleagues about it.
ETA:
quote:
Three weeks after doctors first started noticing the cases, China contacts the World Health Organization.
3 weeks without telling anyone outside their state run media. How were we supposed to know the situation?
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 1:13 pm
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:18 pm to Cobrasize
The major failures we have had dealing with this seems to be:
1. Wishy-washy response early February when it was obvious to almost expert that it was on it's way here/already here:
A. TESTING + CONTACT TRACING -- Early, Abundant, Organized Free Testing + Contact Tracing seems to be how the countries that have gotten a better handle on this did so. (Not just South Korea, Germany but Singapore, Bahrain etc being more prepared to employ widescale early testing and contact tracing, just for example!).
B. MEDICAL SUPPLIES Making sure hospitals were prepared at very least when it seemed extremely likely they would be getting overrun. (for ex, things like FORD + others now producing respirators seemed to be invented on the fly and are starting now instead of a few weeks ago and will now not be ready until mid-June)
C. Limiting Spread -- Our response was indecisive, spotty and disorganized
We pretty much followed the Italy/Spain timeline in these security measures even though we had 2-3 weeks head start to see what results that had already produced.
2. National/Homeland Security: Probably more importantly -- for a country that throws around the amount of money we do toward National/Homeland Security -- to come off so "fly by the seat of our pants" in what is the largest threat to our "homeland security" most of us who weren't here 80 years ago in WWII have faced is patently absurd.
If you just look it like an American citizen and not try to spin it for a certain political talking point, it's really a failure across the board.
1. Wishy-washy response early February when it was obvious to almost expert that it was on it's way here/already here:
A. TESTING + CONTACT TRACING -- Early, Abundant, Organized Free Testing + Contact Tracing seems to be how the countries that have gotten a better handle on this did so. (Not just South Korea, Germany but Singapore, Bahrain etc being more prepared to employ widescale early testing and contact tracing, just for example!).
B. MEDICAL SUPPLIES Making sure hospitals were prepared at very least when it seemed extremely likely they would be getting overrun. (for ex, things like FORD + others now producing respirators seemed to be invented on the fly and are starting now instead of a few weeks ago and will now not be ready until mid-June)
C. Limiting Spread -- Our response was indecisive, spotty and disorganized
We pretty much followed the Italy/Spain timeline in these security measures even though we had 2-3 weeks head start to see what results that had already produced.
2. National/Homeland Security: Probably more importantly -- for a country that throws around the amount of money we do toward National/Homeland Security -- to come off so "fly by the seat of our pants" in what is the largest threat to our "homeland security" most of us who weren't here 80 years ago in WWII have faced is patently absurd.
If you just look it like an American citizen and not try to spin it for a certain political talking point, it's really a failure across the board.
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 5:36 pm
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:22 pm to wm72
480 cases
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:23 pm to Cobrasize
quote:
We did very well considering the information we were getting from China and WHO. Hard to know what you’re dealing with when you aren’t getting truthful information. Again, Trump was labeled as racist when he stopped flights from China.
I live in the rest of the world, and we had plenty of information. COVID-19, not know my that moniker at the time, was clearly a huge global threat very early on. Costa Rica followed the WHO's recommendations and had dedicated labs set up before the virus ever got to this country. The testing kits were ready to go. Everyone was on the same page and dancing to the same drum while the same issue was being touted on video as a 'hoax' by Trump himself and Foxnews. I clearly remember as every single student wanted to discuss it ad nauseum.
The notion that the US had insufficient information is a flat out mutherfukking lie, and it's shocking that a person, President, or political party would think they could rewrite history from a month ago and no one would notice. It's batshit insane.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:26 pm to prevatt33b
Oh yes, let’s follow WHO recommendations
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:29 pm to Cobrasize
Let’s not forget the Bill De Blasio tweet from March 2, 2020
quote:
Since I’m encouraging New Yorkers to go on with your lives + get out on the town despite Coronavirus, I thought I would offer some suggestions. Here’s the first: thru Thurs 3/5 go see “The Traitor” @FilmLinc. If “The Wire” was a true story + set in Italy, it would be this film.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:37 pm to Cobrasize
I see nothing in the WHO report that advises against getting your national defense for this in absolute emergency mode in terms of preparing testing, medical supplies and precise worst case scenario plans in place. South Korea didn't either.
And anyway, when did this county and specifically this administration, start deferring our own homeland security decisions to international organizations?
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:47 pm to Cobrasize
quote:quote:Our public health team has drilled and prepared for how to respond when we see a case. We will make sure people get the care they need and that this challenge doesn’t spread.
Another DeBlasio tweetquote:
New Yorkers: It’s not a matter of if, but when, we’ll see cases of coronavirus in our city. We are prepared and we need you to take precautions as well.
If you recently traveled to Wuhan and experience:
-Fever
-Cough
-Shortness of breath
Don’t wait. Get to a doctor immediately.
This is about vigilance, not alarm.
Go about your lives, come out and celebrate the Lunar New Year. At this time, we believe coronavirus can only be contracted through prolonged exposure, not casual contact.
We are monitoring the situation daily and will update as needed.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:53 pm to Cobrasize
I'm no De Blasio fan, but at the same time, good luck to any local mayor etc that tried to go all out in shutting down people's livelihoods without any official call to do so from a national level.
Remember the stuff you're posting is from the almost 2 weeks before arenas were filled with last games of the season and 1st round conference tourney games and posts on TD were getting 95% upvotes saying to even think of cancelling games was a massive over reaction.
Remember the stuff you're posting is from the almost 2 weeks before arenas were filled with last games of the season and 1st round conference tourney games and posts on TD were getting 95% upvotes saying to even think of cancelling games was a massive over reaction.
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 1:59 pm
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:56 pm to TideSaint
quote:
know you like continuing to point this out, but let's take some of China's "response" in this pandemic into context:
And as I said in another thread, China's handling of it has no bearing on how we have handled it since it became apparent the severity of the virus.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:58 pm to TideCPA
quote:
The long term goal is gaining herd immunity without either triggering a global depression or overwhelming the healthcare system. Either one of those will kill a ton of people.
That will take years though. A vaccine will likely be produced long before we could achieve herd immunity in that manner.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 1:58 pm to Cobrasize
Look, I don't know if that screenshot is real. Even if it is, it's from Jan 10th. The very next day could have had completely different advice. I'm not here to argue about the WHO.
I'm here to clearly state that most of the whole damn world knew this was a huge fricking deal, and knew it clearly at the moment and before it was completely mishandled by the President and his buddies. The whole planet had its mouth agape at the time watching the situation be humbled.
For perspective, the virus came to Costa Rica long before it came to Alabama, and we now have less than half of the cases you have and the virus is contained and all clusters identified. In Alabama, you guys have hundreds of new cases every day and it is far from controlled.
Why is that, if both countries/states had access to the same information? Why did Costa Rica have dedicated labs set up before the virus even arrived, yet the virus was a political 'hoax' for the first 2 weeks it entered the US? Both countries had access to the same information.
Some countries never had a chance, most notably certain countries with high Chinese populations in the Eastern hemisphere. The US was always going to have a hard time with this virus given how open its borders and airports are. But literally and simultaneously while the rest of the planet knew this was a huge deal, the President and his party bungled the deal, called it a hoax, and wasted 2 weeks focusing on the stock market instead of people. And at that moment, everyone on earth knew the deal. It was closer to Valentine's day, not the beginning of January.
The US got a tough deal, sure, but Trump is incompetent, evil, clown shoes and is the laughing stock of the planet. We all watched his ineptitude unfold in real time. Rewriting history doesn't change what we all saw globally at the time.
I'm here to clearly state that most of the whole damn world knew this was a huge fricking deal, and knew it clearly at the moment and before it was completely mishandled by the President and his buddies. The whole planet had its mouth agape at the time watching the situation be humbled.
For perspective, the virus came to Costa Rica long before it came to Alabama, and we now have less than half of the cases you have and the virus is contained and all clusters identified. In Alabama, you guys have hundreds of new cases every day and it is far from controlled.
Why is that, if both countries/states had access to the same information? Why did Costa Rica have dedicated labs set up before the virus even arrived, yet the virus was a political 'hoax' for the first 2 weeks it entered the US? Both countries had access to the same information.
Some countries never had a chance, most notably certain countries with high Chinese populations in the Eastern hemisphere. The US was always going to have a hard time with this virus given how open its borders and airports are. But literally and simultaneously while the rest of the planet knew this was a huge deal, the President and his party bungled the deal, called it a hoax, and wasted 2 weeks focusing on the stock market instead of people. And at that moment, everyone on earth knew the deal. It was closer to Valentine's day, not the beginning of January.
The US got a tough deal, sure, but Trump is incompetent, evil, clown shoes and is the laughing stock of the planet. We all watched his ineptitude unfold in real time. Rewriting history doesn't change what we all saw globally at the time.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 2:01 pm to wm72
Since humans have no immunity to this cornavirus, the only way to stop it is everyone gets it or you shut everything done and stop the spread of the virus until no one is contagious anymore.
Lockdown everyone that gets it and everyone that comes in contact with the infected person.
If every country's healthcare system gets overwhelmed, the death toll can easily reach the millions.
Lockdown everyone that gets it and everyone that comes in contact with the infected person.
If every country's healthcare system gets overwhelmed, the death toll can easily reach the millions.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 2:02 pm to prevatt33b
quote:
The US got a tough deal, sure, but Trump is incompetent, evil, clown shoes and is the laughing stock of the planet. We all watched his ineptitude unfold in real time.
So, um, explain his rising poll numbers in how he's handling this situation.
Posted on 3/26/20 at 2:03 pm to The Spleen
489 Cases
Posted on 3/26/20 at 2:03 pm to TideSaint
Alabama is updating its numbers on its map quickly. I’ll try to keep up the best I can in posting them. 489 now.
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 2:04 pm
Posted on 3/26/20 at 2:04 pm to prevatt33b
quote:
I live in the rest of the world, and we had plenty of information.
No you don't and no offense as you live in a country of 5 million people. So basically the size of a state here in the country. So you really do not represent the rest of the world. Just saying.
Now regardless to the politics since you do seem to swing to one side and as mentioned I support neither in theory but can you please provide links that support what you are saying? Like what info you and the rest of the world got that the US did not. And examples of how Costa Rica was so prepared .
This post was edited on 3/26/20 at 7:16 pm
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