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re: Off-Topic: Governor’s Race
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:25 pm to imjustafatkid
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:25 pm to imjustafatkid
I guess I just made up all those white Southern democrats switching parties through the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s. Their ideology didn’t change much, but voting dynamics across the south did and they responded.
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Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:29 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I guess I just made up all those white Southern democrats switching parties through the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s. Their ideology didn’t change much, but voting dynamics across the south did and they responded.
Very few actually changed parties. Shelby being one of them...another reason not to vote for his protege.
ETA: Only one of the 21 Dem Senators who opposed the Civil Rights Act ever became a Republican. Republicans took the majority of southern US House seats in 1994...30 years after the Civil Rights Act. The timeline just does not fit the party switch myth you're pushing.
This post was edited on 2/24/22 at 1:34 pm
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:38 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
FDR was a big government progressive
That’s something I’ve been a little confused on. Democrats seem to love FDR but since he was a Democrat at the time and they claim the parties were the opposite back then, that means that their idol is a Republican?
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:39 pm to The Spleen
You have to factor in the Democrat Party becoming the party of abortion and other progressive-social issues like affirmative action, etc.
A better question is why AAs were supporting the Democrats from FDR onwards.
A better question is why AAs were supporting the Democrats from FDR onwards.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:40 pm to The Spleen
Can you provide a list? B/c I know George Wallace (who had AA support btw) died as a Democrat.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:43 pm to 1BamaRTR
I bring that point up in my debates with them. They also overlook his interment policy of Japanese Americans (which Hugo Black supported, the same Black who would support Brown Vs. Board of Education).
Meanwhile, Robert Taft aka Mr. Republican opposed the internment policies and his family is GOP to this day. Scoop Jackson is another interesting case.
Meanwhile, Robert Taft aka Mr. Republican opposed the internment policies and his family is GOP to this day. Scoop Jackson is another interesting case.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 1:48 pm to RollTide4Ever
quote:
That’s something I’ve been a little confused on. Democrats seem to love FDR but since he was a Democrat at the time and they claim the parties were the opposite back then, that means that their idol is a Republican?
Right? Nearly every Democrat icon was from the time they claim us "racist Republicans" were voting Democrat. If it wasn't for double standards, Democrats would have no standards at all.
ETA: Responded to the wrong post. Updated the quote above to what I intended to respond.
This post was edited on 2/24/22 at 1:54 pm
Posted on 2/24/22 at 2:18 pm to 1BamaRTR
quote:
they claim the parties were the opposite back then
Just FTR, I never claimed the parties were the opposite at any time in our history. My point was strictly about southern democrats post Civil Rights Act passage.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 2:32 pm to Panthers4life
Alvin Briggs is useless as “tits on a boar hog”! I’ve had a few communications with him during my time and he definitely “passes the buck” on to the next man.
This post was edited on 2/24/22 at 4:40 pm
Posted on 2/24/22 at 2:55 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I guess I just made up all those white Southern democrats switching parties through the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s. Their ideology didn’t change much, but voting dynamics across the south did and they responded.
Fatkid has put out a bunch of bad takes in this thread, but at least in Alabama he's not wrong on this one. While you're right that the typical Alabama white male (D) didn't change his ideology much, the (R) takeover didn't happen because of party switching. The big (R) takeover happened in 2010. Up to that point, the voters had been voting (R) in national elections and statewide offices but they were still voting for (D)s at the lower levels like the state legislature.
In 2010, (R)s in the state senate went from a 14-20 deficit to a 22-12 advantage. In the house they went from a 44-60 deficit to a 62-42 advantage. That swing didn't happen because incumbent (D)s switched parties to follow voter dynamics. It happened because they were finally unable to avoid being tied to the policies of the national Democratic party and they lost. Go back and look at who won those races. They were largely rookies.
Now, once the big wipeout happened there was a switch for sure. All those municipal officials holding non-partisan offices but with higher aspirations suddenly became (R)s overnight and it killed the (D)s bench - which is a big reason they can't field candidates for many statewide races and there are VERY few white Democrats in the state legislature.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 3:38 pm to coachcrisp
quote:
To not at least acknowledge the benefits our state (and YOU) have received from federal money is not only very short-sighted, but ridiculously stupid.
I dont acknowledge anything.
quote:
How exactly is any of the federal funding been used to "keep us in line"?
Because if Alabama doesnt tow the fedgov line sufficiently, all the federal projects suddenly are in jeopardy of going elsewhere. Its not complicated
Posted on 2/24/22 at 3:53 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:
Any benefits are short-term, at best. An ever-expanding federal government is a poison pill. Were you born after March 2020 and just don't know any better? Maybe you never had to purchase health insurance before Obamacare and thus don't realize how badly that screwed up healthcare in our country? Not old enough to remember our nation before the Patriot Act turned it into a surveillance state with secret FISA courts with little-to-no oversight?
It's really hard to imagine being as naive as you are about this.
Who in hell said ANYTHING about expanding the federal govt?
Why can't you realized that it actually takes HUGE money to just service the basic cost for running the world's most successful country/govt.?
It's just ridiculous for an "educated" person with average intelligence to not be able to grasp this.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 3:57 pm to coachcrisp
quote:
Who in hell said ANYTHING about expanding the federal govt?
You. At every point in this thread that is what you are arguing for. Explain exactly how you think the federal government spends money and somehow does not expand.
quote:
Why can't you realized that it actually takes HUGE money to just service the basic cost for running the world's most successful country/govt.?
It really doesn't.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 3:57 pm to coachcrisp
quote:
Lets hear about those "strings" up in Huntsville for example, that are a detriment to the state!...Then we'll talk about all the benefits it gives us!
A Senator like weve always had will vote for irresponsible spending and social bills because his state is getting some of the pie.
What would happen if the Governor decided to challenge or defy a fedgov mandate or executive order? bye bye new FBI office...bye bye new Space Center.
Im all for the State growing and thriving...but not at the expense of freedom and sound fed government policy.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 3:59 pm to lechateau
quote:
A Senator like weve always had will vote for irresponsible spending and social bills because his state is getting some of the pie.
Yep. It's "I'll support your pork spending project as long as you support mine," and fools just eat it up and pretend "that's how things get done in Washington. We should keep voting for these people because they get things for our state!"
This post was edited on 2/24/22 at 4:00 pm
Posted on 2/24/22 at 4:03 pm to imjustafatkid
quote:Do us ALL a favor (especially yourself), and go look at how much federal money Alabama gets annually(setting entitlements aside) AND what it goes toward.
This is true of course, but the entire conversation comes from the idea that we NEED federal funding and should elect people who seek it out. I completely reject that premise.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 4:04 pm to coachcrisp
quote:
Do us ALL a favor (especially yourself), and go look at how much federal money Alabama gets annually(setting entitlements aside) AND what it goes toward.
I don't need to do this. I'm already well aware. We don't need federal funding.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 4:15 pm to coachcrisp
quote:
It's just ridiculous for an "educated" person with average intelligence to not be able to grasp this.
I dont believe anyone in this thread is below average intelligence. If you wanna vote for Katie Britt or whomever go for it. To act like legitimate arguments arent being made on the other side is simply you being disingenuous.
The "money" being pumped into Alabama from the fedgov isnt real. The piper will be paid eventually. I dont think Alabama should be vying for this irresponsible money. Some people do. If I was a dictator, Huntsville probably wouldnt be booming...but itd be easy to start a business, youd be paying no State income taxes and wed have the least amount of regulation in the country. Many people wouldnt like that, some would
Posted on 2/24/22 at 4:19 pm to lechateau
quote:Answer: How does this force us to lose our freedom, or change our political ideology?
A Senator like weve always had will vote for irresponsible spending and social bills because his state is getting some of the pie.
What would happen if the Governor decided to challenge or defy a fedgov mandate or executive order? bye bye new FBI office...bye bye new Space Center.Answer: It's happening in states all over the country! How do you lose something that you never had?
Im all for the State growing and thriving...but not at the expense of freedom and sound fed government policy.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 4:24 pm to coachcrisp
quote:
Do us ALL a favor (especially yourself), and go look at how much federal money Alabama gets annually(setting entitlements aside) AND what it goes toward.
See you just assume that you know all the facts, and that we are uninformed. Like for a second could you consider that we DO know these things. We DO know things would be different if Alabama got no federal funding. We DO know many people would be living much different lives, many making far less money. Many wouldnt be living in Alabama...yet despite weighing this, we still have the opinions we have.
I get your argument, I just disagree with you with valid reasons to do so.
This post was edited on 2/24/22 at 4:25 pm
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