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re: Off Topic: Governor's race. Walt Maddox vs. Kay Ivey
Posted on 7/31/18 at 3:59 pm to pvilleguru
Posted on 7/31/18 at 3:59 pm to pvilleguru
He also voiced opposition to Iraq War, and was very concerned about the national debt. Whatever it takes to get into the WH.
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Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:00 pm to amders44
quote:
Your wrong look it up
See, here’s the thing. If you notice my user name you’ll see that I am pretty serious about accuracy. I knew you were wrong about the resignation so I did look up the rest and, as pville ( who is likely totally opposite of me politically ) points out the study you rely on was done for partisan election purposes leading up to the election. There are numerous others - some of which predated his candidacy- that put him in the teens to middle twenties.
What YOU’RE (English matters too) guilty of is conformational bias. It sounds like what you want to be true so you believe it without question.
Edited to add - resigning a few weeks before taking office is very different than resigning before the first primary has been held.
This post was edited on 7/31/18 at 4:04 pm
Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:09 pm to amders44
quote:
Obamacare
What about the ACA makes it a "left wing policy"?
quote:
Social engineering of our neighborhoods ( Although he did not get this done, but the kind of data he was trying to collect through HUD to manufacture diversity in our neighborhoods was very left wing.
"left wing data" is pretty kooky.
quote:
He was considered the most left Senator in the chamber based on voting records when he left the senate to run for President.
Other people have adressed this.
quote:
He was the first President in history to announce he is in favor of Gay marriage.
I give you that. He was very left in terms of social policies.
Overall thpugh he was fairly on the right in terms of economic policies. As a person he was much more left than his presidency, but the reality is that he conceded on the public option. His foreign policy was also, at the very least, right of center. For the most part he continued our legacy of neo-conservativism (realism) when it came to international relations.
I think that all of that balances out him being left on social policy, leaving him pretty much in the middle.
quote:
Its why I've wanted to see the Democrats to show a pulse when it comes to statewide races
They will. The DNC, in their shortsightedness, took all the funding they used for Dean's "50 state strategy" and plunged it into Obama's campaigns. The result was losing all the infrastructure they had remaining in the south and rust belt. That was the primary topic in the DNC chair election.
That all being said, I'm not sure that I have enough faith in Perez to get a sizeable enough pulse to matter. It might take a lot longer to undue the damage than the Democratic party thinks.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:30 pm to Fells
He also expanded gov't spying, the fourth amendment took a huge hit under his admin.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:43 pm to Fells
quote:
the reality is that he conceded on the public option.
That really wasn't completely him though. Dems in Congress had to concede on it to get Lieberman's vote. And that's unfortunate because I really think a public option would have prevented a lot of the problems the ACA had in its infancy, and it would have likely forced states to expand Medicaid. I do think looking back he likely regrets not pushing harder for a public option.
ACA had a LOT of problems and onerous regulations, but it was written in a way that the only way it'd work is with full cooperation. Republicans balked at it labeling it "socialism" and worked tirelessly to undermine it and states controlled by Republicans refused to cooperate, and here we are.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:44 pm to RollTide4Ever
quote:
He also expanded gov't spying, the fourth amendment took a huge hit under his admin.
No again. The Patriot Act, which enabled the domestic surveillance was renewed under Obama but it was enacted under the Bush admin during the post 9/11 hysteria.
ETA - not sure why it matters any more. Half the country are using devices whose sole purpose is to sit there and listen to every word you say.
This post was edited on 7/31/18 at 4:46 pm
Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:53 pm to Fells
What about the ACA was right wing? It was a huge govt handout program and represented the most striking govt intrusion into the lives of all America in most of our lifetimes.
ACA was the epitome of a left wing policy.
Obama's economic policies were dogshit. His main idea was that the govt can solve all our problems. Does that sound right wing?
His social policies were the most left wing we've seen in this country. He ushered in all this transgender crap we are still dealing with.
So that leaves his foreign policy, and yeah he was probably right in line with the neocon globalists. That doesn't make him a centrist. It makes him a bought and paid for stooge of the military industrial complex. He played ball with them so they'd look the other way on his other shite. But I would argue that endless wars aren't a conservative policy.
GTFO with this Obama was a centrist crap.
ACA was the epitome of a left wing policy.
Obama's economic policies were dogshit. His main idea was that the govt can solve all our problems. Does that sound right wing?
His social policies were the most left wing we've seen in this country. He ushered in all this transgender crap we are still dealing with.
So that leaves his foreign policy, and yeah he was probably right in line with the neocon globalists. That doesn't make him a centrist. It makes him a bought and paid for stooge of the military industrial complex. He played ball with them so they'd look the other way on his other shite. But I would argue that endless wars aren't a conservative policy.
GTFO with this Obama was a centrist crap.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 4:58 pm to JustGetItRight
I should have just said this and then there would not have been any debate, Obama and Hilary, no matter how far left you or I or anyone else thinks they are or are not, are way to far left for me and my tastes. Case closed!
Posted on 7/31/18 at 5:01 pm to amders44
Pretty sure I never heard Obama say Govt can solve all problems.
gheesh
what are specifically a few of his shitty economic policies you keep mentioning?
gheesh
what are specifically a few of his shitty economic policies you keep mentioning?
Posted on 7/31/18 at 5:10 pm to McGregor
I will add one more fact. My taxes went down under Bush, they went up under Obama and they are headed down again under Trump, and no I am not in the 1 percent category.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 5:13 pm to McGregor
"You didn't build that."
Posted on 7/31/18 at 5:14 pm to McGregor
Cash for clunkers
Stimulus package
Obama phones
Dodd Frank
It's not exactly groundbreaking news that Obama is dogshit when it comes to running an economy.
Stimulus package
Obama phones
Dodd Frank
It's not exactly groundbreaking news that Obama is dogshit when it comes to running an economy.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 5:22 pm to SECSolomonGrundy
Solyndra
Reagan started the phones, though.
Reagan started the phones, though.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 5:26 pm to RollTide4Ever
Yeah and when Reagan was president a phone had a rotary dial. Obama expanded that shite into some ridiculous handout.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 6:01 pm to SECSolomonGrundy
quote:
Obama expanded that shite into something more useful.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 6:07 pm to SECSolomonGrundy
The ACA increased power over our health care system for private corporations, not the government. It was a huge coprorate handout if it was anything, which all falls in line with Mundell's right wing economics.
Cash for clunkers and Obama phones are left wing policies that were also incredibly minor and insignificant in terms of gov't spending.
Dodd-Frank is left wing but the alternative to finicial regulations is anarcho-capitalism. I think that the majority on both sides can agree that Wall Street should be regulated and severely monitored, especially since the (necessary) repealment of Glass-Steagll contributed to the great recession.
Obama took an economy that was wrecked and turned it around. I'm sure that we all have different opinions on what could have happened to make the turnaround better, but the reality is that it was significantly better off when he left than when he inherited it. To say that he was "dog shite" for the economy is just as silly as thinking that he was a "far left" president.
If he really was the far-left wannabe tyrant that people around here like to portray him as, he would have got congressional members to present a single-payer bill and used his bully pulpit to get it passed.
His biggest fault is that he believed too much in the system and failed to realize how partisan our country was becoming, and as a result, how we have become a nation that is unable to find reasonable compromise. If he had been a better leader, he would have been able to combat our hyper partisanship.
Which is all unfortunate because the reality is that neither side is completely right. Raw capitalism and raw socialism are equally terrible in terms of providing a system for a fair and free society. The trick to self-governence is finding the appropriate mix for the particular needs and variables of each individual nation. Right now our option seems to be a nation where our legislative branch is completely immobilized until one side gains a complete monopoly on our political system, both of which are terrible situations.
Until we can all be rational again about our analysis of public policy and recoginze that those who think differently are not opponents but team members that bring important differences to the table, we won't be able to fix our political system, and disenguiniously portraying Obama as being one step removed from communism prevents us from getting closer to that goal.
Cash for clunkers and Obama phones are left wing policies that were also incredibly minor and insignificant in terms of gov't spending.
Dodd-Frank is left wing but the alternative to finicial regulations is anarcho-capitalism. I think that the majority on both sides can agree that Wall Street should be regulated and severely monitored, especially since the (necessary) repealment of Glass-Steagll contributed to the great recession.
Obama took an economy that was wrecked and turned it around. I'm sure that we all have different opinions on what could have happened to make the turnaround better, but the reality is that it was significantly better off when he left than when he inherited it. To say that he was "dog shite" for the economy is just as silly as thinking that he was a "far left" president.
If he really was the far-left wannabe tyrant that people around here like to portray him as, he would have got congressional members to present a single-payer bill and used his bully pulpit to get it passed.
His biggest fault is that he believed too much in the system and failed to realize how partisan our country was becoming, and as a result, how we have become a nation that is unable to find reasonable compromise. If he had been a better leader, he would have been able to combat our hyper partisanship.
Which is all unfortunate because the reality is that neither side is completely right. Raw capitalism and raw socialism are equally terrible in terms of providing a system for a fair and free society. The trick to self-governence is finding the appropriate mix for the particular needs and variables of each individual nation. Right now our option seems to be a nation where our legislative branch is completely immobilized until one side gains a complete monopoly on our political system, both of which are terrible situations.
Until we can all be rational again about our analysis of public policy and recoginze that those who think differently are not opponents but team members that bring important differences to the table, we won't be able to fix our political system, and disenguiniously portraying Obama as being one step removed from communism prevents us from getting closer to that goal.
This post was edited on 7/31/18 at 6:25 pm
Posted on 7/31/18 at 6:09 pm to Fells
well said
Posted on 7/31/18 at 6:15 pm to RollTide4Ever
Posted on 7/31/18 at 6:47 pm to McGregor
Where would Ron Paul fall on the spectrum?
Posted on 7/31/18 at 6:54 pm to lion
quote:
It is pretty sad that 90% of the state's citizens wont know anything about either candidate and will just vote based on party.
I remember when he announced his party (he'd governed Tuscaloosa pretty much as an independent), and my friend said... "oh, so he doesn't REALLY want to be governor."
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