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re: Ranking the SEC Academically - US News 2014
Posted on 9/10/13 at 11:59 am to aggressor
Posted on 9/10/13 at 11:59 am to aggressor
quote:
AAU Membership is not the "be all, end all". There are some great schools that aren't in the AAU such as Notre Dame and Wake Forest.
Still, it is the gold standard and far more respected than US News. There are some older members that have fallen back academically and some have gotten kicked out in recent years (Nebraska and Syracuse for instance). It also has a Northeast/Midwest bias but that actually is a statement to just how good a Southern school has to be in order to gain membership (Georgia Tech only recently became a member).
As for US News itself I don't really worry about it. They greatly understate A&M's endowment (saying it is less than $400 million when it is actually $7 Billion) and they greatly reward class size and such. A&M has very high entrance requirements, very high graduation rates, and is an elite research school with the 3rd largest endowment amongst all Public schools. If US News chooses to find a way to rate us low that hurts their credibility, not ours.
AAU is a really nice feather in the cap for any school and is something to be proud of. That being said, I think there is a tremendous bias and prejudice against Southeastern schools unless they are located in super high growth East Coast areas and the Deep South schools no matter how good they are will never be accepted due to decades old biases. The fact that it took Georgia Tech until 2010 to be invited in is a frickin joke and the fact that Georgia still isn't in is a joke as well considering some of the Big 12 schools that are currently members.
As for Alabama's chances, the semantics of Alabama's medical school technically falling under the UAB banner kills Alabama's research numbers. That branding decision literally costs Alabama close to $400,000,000 a year in research numbers.
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Posted on 9/10/13 at 12:03 pm to Chicken
My b Chicken. It was on the first page, but I added it to the OP as well
Posted on 9/10/13 at 12:04 pm to TulaneTigerFan
quote:
128 Arkansas
135 LSU
quote::Kern:
63. Arkansas
68. LSU
This post was edited on 9/10/13 at 12:07 pm
Posted on 9/10/13 at 12:08 pm to TulaneTigerFan
quote:
Why would you want to be on TideFans? Those people are crazy.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 12:11 pm to Govt Tide
I agree with everything you stated. The deep south will always be hurt more than assisted when academic rankings are concerned.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 12:11 pm to randomways
quote:
Honestly, all this discussion of AAU status is pointless. It's a reward for a certain focus, not an overall validation or indictment of a school. I've attended two different AAU schools. I attended one non-AAU. Trust me, when you're takin' th' classes and absorbin' th' nawludge, the differences are pretty much negligible. There's a false equivalency going on here. Yes, a lot of prestigious universities are AAU. It doesn't necessarily follow that AAU is causative in said prestige, nor does it necessarily indicate that prestige and AAU membership are correlative. For the most part, two defining aspects characterize AAU membership -- a certain directed focus on intensive research (and not all forms of research by any means) and diverting money specifically toward that end. There's a reason why a significant portion of the AAU membership tilts toward the technological, and it's not because technological schools are inherently better. There's nothing wrong with being proud of AAU membership for your school. But it's a pride that needs to be tempered with a realization that it's just one "honor" offered for one relatively narrow set of criteria that have little to do with a university's inherent excellence overall.
I don't disagree with any of that. As I said before you have schools like Notre Dame and Wake Forest that aren't in the AAU but only an idiot would consider Stony Brook or Kansas a better school.
If you get outside of Engineering and Science/Medical specialties the AAU schools are often not the right choice for students. Ole Miss for instance has a great reputation for producing writers but it will likely never be an AAU candidate. You can get a great education at most schools depending on your vocation but that isn't the point.
The point is that the AAU is still the Gold Standard amongst academics for right or wrong and it is the most valuable accreditation to have for a school. It is also far more valuable and respected than US News which has its own flawed ranking system. Can't blame them, I mean how do you really compare Yeshiva University to the University of Florida and proclaim one better than the other?
Posted on 9/10/13 at 1:41 pm to aggressor
quote:
To discount the credibility of the AAU though is just silly.
No, its not.
Its a good ole boy club that runs a racket in disbursing grant money.
That's it. It isn't that special or noteworthy.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:06 pm to MagicCityBlazer
There's a lot of great research done at AAU schools that isn't sexy or really worth mentioning when it comes to US News rankings. Rankings are generally setup to help incoming undergraduates make decisions on which school to attend.
Mizzou has been hurt recently in rankings by the growth of the university overall in the more common fields of study. There's been a real initiative to grow the university and that has hurt the acceptance rates and from what I've heard, has hurt overall quality of the major core programs which is what a lot of these rankings are based upon. Mizzou has a recently as 2011 been the fastest growing AAU school.
However, when it comes to the real research mission of the university, it remains strong. Ag research is still moving forward, Mizzou's Health Research is still top notch, and the Mizzou Nuclear Research Reactor is still the largest in the country and has provided a number of enormous benefits to humanity overall in nuclear medicine, this is among all the other facets of the university's research mission.
ETA: Just for backup on the research thing.
Mizzou holds the patent on a process discovered at Mizzou to clone mammals. Remember Dolly the Sheep? That dude's at Mizzou.
In April, Mizzou announced the discovery of a breakthrough technique to kill cancer without side effects.
Mizzou was where Ir-192 was first produced for the fighting of breast cancer.
These are just a few of the things that happen at Mizzou in regards to research. I'm sure the university is sorry if the acceptance rate is dragging down the US News opinion a bit.
Mizzou has been hurt recently in rankings by the growth of the university overall in the more common fields of study. There's been a real initiative to grow the university and that has hurt the acceptance rates and from what I've heard, has hurt overall quality of the major core programs which is what a lot of these rankings are based upon. Mizzou has a recently as 2011 been the fastest growing AAU school.
However, when it comes to the real research mission of the university, it remains strong. Ag research is still moving forward, Mizzou's Health Research is still top notch, and the Mizzou Nuclear Research Reactor is still the largest in the country and has provided a number of enormous benefits to humanity overall in nuclear medicine, this is among all the other facets of the university's research mission.
ETA: Just for backup on the research thing.
Mizzou holds the patent on a process discovered at Mizzou to clone mammals. Remember Dolly the Sheep? That dude's at Mizzou.
In April, Mizzou announced the discovery of a breakthrough technique to kill cancer without side effects.
Mizzou was where Ir-192 was first produced for the fighting of breast cancer.
These are just a few of the things that happen at Mizzou in regards to research. I'm sure the university is sorry if the acceptance rate is dragging down the US News opinion a bit.
This post was edited on 9/10/13 at 2:21 pm
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:08 pm to TulaneTigerFan
quote:
135 LSU
doesn't matter, got degree
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:11 pm to MagicCityBlazer
quote:
No, its not.
Its a good ole boy club that runs a racket in disbursing grant money.
That's it. It isn't that special or noteworthy.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:11 pm to Broyota2
Here's how we know USNWR is full of shite. From A&M's description:
W
T
F
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quote:
The school’s varsity sports compete in the NCAA Division I Big 12 Conference
W
T
F
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Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:47 pm to TulaneTigerFan
I thought Mizzou joined to improve our academics?
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:01 pm to GumpMaster&Commander
Moving up in the rankings!
Florida's goal right now is to become a top 10 public university. Right now we sit at #14.
Florida's goal right now is to become a top 10 public university. Right now we sit at #14.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:02 pm to GumpMaster&Commander
It is interesting how most of the posts stated they didn't care about the US News rankings and then preceded to argue why there ranking did not reflect the true excellence of their college's academics reputation. The AAU thing is interesting only in that it means serious cash. The person who mentioned Alabama's Med School being under the auspices of UAB brought up a great point. That little mistake cost our state a great deal of money. Alabama might be in if not for that giant f...up.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:04 pm to crawdaddy52
quote:
he person who mentioned Alabama's Med School being under the auspices of UAB brought up a great point.
As a UAB fan I can say UAB stole the med school.
It really should be considered the fourth entity in the university system (UA, UAH, UAB, UA-Med School)
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:06 pm to TulaneTigerFan
Damn, I figured ole miss would be ahead of state
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:21 pm to crawdaddy52
quote:
The person who mentioned Alabama's Med School being under the auspices of UAB brought up a great point. That little mistake cost our state a great deal of money. Alabama might be in if not for that giant f...up.
If I remember correctly, that's a big reason Nebraska kicked out. Medical school wasn't attached to UNL.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:35 pm to TulaneTigerFan
quote:
University of Mississippi has a total undergraduate enrollment of 16,060
well that's not even close
Posted on 9/10/13 at 3:42 pm to UMRealist
Posted on 1/2/14 at 1:00 pm to DamnStrong1860
Know I'm a little late putting in my 2 cents but let me just say this. I grew up and went to school in the middle of SEC country in Atlanta but went to a non-football school, Emory. However, I now live in Texas. My son was a darn good student. Got accepted at a lot of places, including Texas and Texas A&M. I do not accept those USNWR rankings as gospel. For one thing, TAMU has more alumni who are CEOs of major corporations than any other public university in America. For another, TAMU grads earn on average more than Texas grads. Hell, they earn on average more than Northwestern grads. LINK
My take on USN&WR is that it skewed toward schools in the northeast, west coast and Chicago area. Why? Because its is a publication based in the northeast and run mostly by liberals. TAMU is conservative so that brings them down a peg. Conversely, UT Austin is liberal, so that brings UT up a notch in the eyes of the editors at USN&WR who do these rankings.
I could not be happier with the education my son is receiving at Texas A&M. In every way it is equal to or better than its cross state rival UT. In fact, if you look at the history, A&M actually started out as the University of Texas engineering school branch. It was built first which is how A&M ended up being the oldest public university in Texas. What happened is that the school decided to have its own identity so in the 1880's it was made completely independent of UT.
So let's see, the pay is higher for A&M grads, the undergraduate experience is better and the academics are every bit as demanding as UT. Plus there is a sense of comraderie at A&M that exists nowhere else in Texas. All these combined made A&M the easy choice for my kid. Way above the University of Texas IMO, and that opinion is an objective one because, as I said, my kid could have gone to either school (and I have no preexisting connection to either school, having attended Emory) and we chose A&M.
Addendum: Here is the link showing that A&M has more CEOs of major corporations than any other public university in America. In fact, A&M is ranked 34th in the entire world in this area: LINK
My take on USN&WR is that it skewed toward schools in the northeast, west coast and Chicago area. Why? Because its is a publication based in the northeast and run mostly by liberals. TAMU is conservative so that brings them down a peg. Conversely, UT Austin is liberal, so that brings UT up a notch in the eyes of the editors at USN&WR who do these rankings.
I could not be happier with the education my son is receiving at Texas A&M. In every way it is equal to or better than its cross state rival UT. In fact, if you look at the history, A&M actually started out as the University of Texas engineering school branch. It was built first which is how A&M ended up being the oldest public university in Texas. What happened is that the school decided to have its own identity so in the 1880's it was made completely independent of UT.
So let's see, the pay is higher for A&M grads, the undergraduate experience is better and the academics are every bit as demanding as UT. Plus there is a sense of comraderie at A&M that exists nowhere else in Texas. All these combined made A&M the easy choice for my kid. Way above the University of Texas IMO, and that opinion is an objective one because, as I said, my kid could have gone to either school (and I have no preexisting connection to either school, having attended Emory) and we chose A&M.
Addendum: Here is the link showing that A&M has more CEOs of major corporations than any other public university in America. In fact, A&M is ranked 34th in the entire world in this area: LINK
This post was edited on 1/2/14 at 1:05 pm
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